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Post by Deleted on Feb 17, 2011 16:20:25 GMT -5
I'm sorry hun. I wish there was something more I could say or do to make you feel better, but I know little about adrenal myself. I hope you are able to correct the problem. ((HUGS))
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Post by acodlin on Feb 17, 2011 19:19:48 GMT -5
To save poor Kenai from being munched on I'd use some bitter apple spray on his neck, or Heather recommended a diaper rash cream to me. I couldnt find it but the spray worked. My guys would also wake me up between 3-5am. They have no respect for mommy needing her sleep lol  I had to seperate mine at night just so I could sleep. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 17, 2011 22:00:47 GMT -5
It's my understanding that a lot of vets use lupron depot because giving only one month of lupron results in a rebound of hormonal activity thats higher than the pre-lupron levels. If a client gets one or two shots and quits the treatment for some reason, the ferret would have been better off with no treatment at all.
I recommend getting deslorelin if you can. (It's cheaper, but it's very difficult to get). If you cannot get the Des., you may want to try 4 months of lupron. The monthly shots are more effective than the depot. I would start the lupron ASAP since you want to knock back those hormone levels when they are at their highest. The theory behind the annual preventive lupron protocol is to hopefully prevent the high spike in the spring time.
Koda is not the only ferret that is adrenal at an early age. A lot of owners simply do not recognize the signs of adrenal activity. Keep in mind that adrenal disease is weird in that the symptoms vary depending on the type of activity and possibly location on the gland where the overactivity is taking place. The severity and type of symptom does NOT necessarily reflect the severityof the disease or whether disease is even present on the gland.
A fine example of this is Tomichi not even being phased by the Lupron. One of the theories you hear is that when the lupron or des. is not working, the gland has a tumor that has grown large (a lot of mass to produce more hormone) and is probably cancerous because it has grown beyond control of the medication. This is clearly NOT the case with Tomichi , who had small/normal-sized glands with small cysts on her left adrenal gland.
I finally learned to not feel sick to my stomach when something seems amiss with one of my ferrets. For all the years I panicked over my first two ferrets, they managed to live to be over 6.5 and 7 years of age. And they were a LOT worse than Koda.
Try the 3-4 months of lupron and see how things go. Koda may just be having a wild spike with somebody to take it out on this year.
-jennifer
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Post by katt on Feb 18, 2011 20:36:35 GMT -5
I just read Jennifer's post in the Adrenal Mounting Behavior. Should I be checking poor Kenai's little bum?  I never thought Koda might ACTUALLY be trying to do the dirty like, physically. :S I guess I didn't think he COULD since he's neutred...but I guess removing the testicles and removing the penis are totally different things after all... Lol  On another note, Koda was going at it again last night. This time at 2 am.  I doused Kenai's neck with Vinegar and that seemed to end things for the night. That I know of anyways. Bitter Apple is a no go, A) because Koda doesn't care I have tried various bitter sprays to keep him from chewing things before to no avail, and B) because I don't want to be tasting it everytime I touch, snuggle, and kiss Kenai! Lol Thanks for the idea though the vinegar seemed to work pretty well. I need to pick up more tonight.  |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 18, 2011 20:59:39 GMT -5
Can you possibly get a hold of a des. Implant?
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Post by Heather on Feb 18, 2011 22:39:30 GMT -5
Can you get some sudocreme? It's an awesome deterrent to the sexual nuzzling.
ciao
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Post by Sherry on Feb 19, 2011 0:48:01 GMT -5
I don't know that sudocrem is available in the US, unfortunately |
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Post by Heather on Feb 19, 2011 0:50:19 GMT -5
Hmmm, I got mine at walmart? Is it possible or strictly offered to the walmarts in Canada
ciao
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Post by bluemoose on Feb 19, 2011 0:52:25 GMT -5
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Post by Sherry on Feb 19, 2011 1:01:56 GMT -5
That's great  I just remember on another forum, Americans telling me they couldn't find it anywhere. |
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Post by joclyn on Feb 19, 2011 12:22:19 GMT -5
sudocrem is a diaper rash medication...desitin would be the comparable item here in the states
i'd just go with lupron shots asap - that's clearly adrenal disease at play; not just increased hormones because spring is near.
it's a nasty disease and symptoms can manifest in a variety of ways and sometimes no symptoms appear at all. nasty, nasty disease and i hate it!!! more than i hate insulinoma and i hate that one with a passion!
i agree that once neutered they are 'adrenal' and that the 'disease' part develops later on - if nothing is done to curtail the hormone production.
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Post by katt on Feb 19, 2011 14:02:39 GMT -5
Ok so I talked to the vet this morning. I was not happy with what she had to say. Lupron is $47 an injection, and the injections are monthly.  That is a LOT of $ to spend monthly. I can afford it right now, but it will hurt. What do you guys pay for Lupron? I was under the impression that it was NOT expensive. She said we could give a month, and see what happens when that month wears off to determine whether or not he is in "adrenal disease" and whather we should continue. She said that Melatonin is $75 for a shot that lasts 3 months. It treats the behavior but not the physiological issue of hormone imbalance and thus won't do anything to help prevent the gland from becoming diseased/more diseased. Des implants. Are not available in the US unless you have a special permit. She CAN order them for me, but there will be fees for: the exam, blood work, anesthesia (the implants are large so they make a small incision to be sure it is inserted properly), and import fees. She wasn't sure how much it would cost after all that, but that the implant could last as long as 6 months. She also said that there is a big risk of death with the des implants. That it in her words has been known to sometimes "unmask insulin issues" that then, even with aggressive treatment, the ferrets often cannot be saved. But I mean, having been on a raw diet since kit-hood, does that even apply to Koda?I have no doubt that she will order the implants for me if I ask. But it will be an expense, and it will take some time to do. She said that for preventative Lupron I'd want to get it NOW as they usually do it between Jan-Feb and once a year (for preventative rather than treatment). What do you guys pay? How much is a Des implant typically, and Lupron? Is it worth putting him under to get the Des twice a year? What about the risks she mentioned? I guess now I have to decide what to do.... |
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Post by Sherry on Feb 19, 2011 14:44:58 GMT -5
I pay $42 for each lupron shot. I have 3 adrenal ferrets, so $126 a month plus tax ( ). Here, that is inexpensive compared to a lot of treatments. I just had a one year melatonin implant put in Sinnead, $78 for that. Why would they have to put him under anesthesia? What I got from peptech was that it was no real difference than doing a microchip implant. Large bore needle, yes, but that was it. And personally, I've never heard about it having a high risk of death for any reason. |
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Post by joclyn on Feb 19, 2011 15:18:29 GMT -5
i was paying $42 a month for the lupron, $80 for melatonin. the desi i've paid $130 and $120 - depending on which vet i went to for it.
yeah, the lupron cost does add up (multiplied by 4 for me ) since the desi is harder to get a hold of, i'd do the lupron for the moment and then move to the desi as soon as you can.
the plus with doing the lupron first is, if it doesn't make any difference, then adrenal disease may not be the problem and you've saved a bit of money...if adrenal isn't the issue, the lupron doesn't hurt anything (neither does the desi); so, no harm done by using it.
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Post by goingpostal on Feb 19, 2011 15:24:49 GMT -5
I pay $30 for each Lupron shot, but I also have to pay to have it shipped here from the pharmacy every 3 months or however much I order. Not all ferrets respond to it though, Pip is doing great on it, Craven had no change other than more hair loss even after 3 months so I stopped. It's pretty cheap compared to other options. I would NOT give it for only a month, go at least 3 if you start it to see if it helps IMO. Or they have a 4 month implant. You can buy liquid melatonin and give it yourself, but it has to be given at a certain time of day and most people can't manage that everyday.
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I doused Kenai's neck with Vinegar and that seemed to end things for the night. That I know of anyways. Bitter Apple is a no go, A) because Koda doesn't care I have tried various bitter sprays to keep him from chewing things before to no avail, and B) because I don't want to be tasting it everytime I touch, snuggle, and kiss Kenai! Lol Thanks for the idea though the vinegar seemed to work pretty well. I need to pick up more tonight. 
