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Post by azaelia on Apr 18, 2017 18:39:14 GMT -5
( photobucket is finally working - yay) Jasper Ellie Frank Jasper isn't on pred yet. He will have a day-long glucose test at the vets with Ellie in the middle of next month. I have to wait that long cause the vet is an hour away so I need time off work, they need a months notice for holidays. Yes frankenprey is my goal. Frank loves slithers, the other two aren't so bothered atm. Jasper been really sick again last week & everyone went off they're food again. They've just now started eating from the bowl again so I'm keen this week to make no changes to they're diet for a week. My plan is to slowly reduce the amount of water I add to the grounds until I'm not adding any. Ill then try other protiens. From next week ill try adding slithers again but ill try finger feeding rather than mixing it in the food right away. Im keen to not put them off theyre food again. My cat also suddenly passed away yesterday & i really dont want to worry about the ferrets right now. I'm also planning to take Ellie to the vets next week, she's been really quiet this passed week. But at the same time she's not been eating (like everyone else) she has been a little better today. I think I've mentioned it before but they stopped eating when I tried fishy food instead of chicken & they hated it!
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2017 21:03:04 GMT -5
I'm sorry to hear about your loss. ;n; Take your time. You've been doing fairly well so far. Some things require multiple tries but be persistent, you'll get there in time. Good luck with the vet appointment.
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Post by azaelia on Apr 21, 2017 14:25:36 GMT -5
so last night i noticed Ellies lymph nodes on her neck are visibly swollen. took her to the vet today, she has a slight temperature, all of her lymph nodes are enlarged as well as being quiet & off her food. she's on antibiotics for 10 days in hope thats it's an infection. if theres no improvement in 4 or 5 days i'll take her back. i'm scared to death for her.
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Post by katt on Apr 22, 2017 17:07:44 GMT -5
Poor girly. I hope it is just an infection. How are they doing with the diet?
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Post by azaelia on Apr 22, 2017 17:40:19 GMT -5
They're just starting to eat by themselves. Not doing great when I'm not there but they're getting better. Before I add slithers I'm going to make sure they're all eating reliably. We're just taking it easy atm while Ellie's going through this. I don't know if it's imagination but (She's had 2 doses of antibiotics now) her lumps feel a little softer.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 22, 2017 22:57:57 GMT -5
I hope she clears up! <3 That is a good decision. It is especially important that you have them eating 100% by themselves before you completely remove kibble. On that note, are they still having the kibble at a certain time? If you noticed a difference in her lymph nodes, then that is surely a great sign. I'm glad to hear you're seeing some improvement and I hope it continues to improve.
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Post by azaelia on Apr 23, 2017 13:35:14 GMT -5
just a quick update - ellies lymphnodes are still visible. shes now had 3 lots of antibiotics. i still can't work out if they feel softer or smaller.
they don't have kibble at all any more. i try to feed every 4 hours. frank & ellie r doing ok & are just starting to eat by themselves. i've taken jasper back to finger feeding. if i try to feed from the bowl or spoon he just takes tiny pieces in his mouth, runs off & mostly spits them out. hes not ingesting enough.
i'll try to do their weights tomorrow
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Post by katt on Apr 23, 2017 16:09:36 GMT -5
Can you post a picture of what they are eating again for me, so I can get an idea of how thick the grinds are? Also, we want to move forward with the slivers but especially with sickies slow and steady wins the race. We will take it at whatever pace they need, so you are right to hold off on pushing more changes until they are eating enough of the current food. <3
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Post by azaelia on Apr 25, 2017 17:52:14 GMT -5
Hey @hurricankatt I'm sorry for the delay. I'm having a though time with these little monsters! 1. Ferret's name: jasper 2. Ferret's weight: 727kg (-33g) 3. Ferret has eaten "X" amount on average per meal: a fingerfull every other hour. 4. Stools on various proteins: poops are small but looking ok 5. Activity levels: greatly reduced 6. Weekly menu: nutriment chicken ground 1. Ferret's name: ellie 2. Ferret's weight: 700g (+8g) 3. Ferret has eaten "X" amount on average per meal: She's getting better at eating, doest always chose to eat by herself but will chow down if I put her infront of the bowl 4. Stools on various proteins: poops are looking good 5. Activity levels: decreased 6. Weekly menu: nutriment chicken ground 1. Ferret's name: frank 2. Ferret's weight: 925g (-90g) 3. Ferret has eaten "X" amount on average per meal: Frank's doing ok, similar to ellie, he doesn't always chose to eat by himself, he needs encouraging 4. Stools on various proteins: poops are looking good 5. Activity levels: normal 6. Weekly menu: nutriment chicken ground Ellie is still seriously worrying me - her lymphnodes are still swollen & she's now been on antibiotics for 5 days now. I'm so worried! I still can't work out if they're getting softer & smaller, I think they are but Idk. She's also really quiet & her coat quality is awful. Jasper only comes out of his bed to pee/poop. The only other time he gets up is for 10mins at playtime to hunt for the dogs rubber ball, when he can't find it he goes straight to bed. He must be up for 20mins a day. He's getting a little better at eating, I went back to finger feeding & although he eats very little, he eats more than he did. He did eat by himself from his bowl tonight, & quite a bit too because I put a drizzle of salmon oil in it. I hope I've had a breakthrough with him. He's also been a little more active this evening. I took this picture of his butt today- He gets a pattern in his fur every spring. It's not thin, but I just thought I'd check to make sure u don't think it's a sign of adrenal. He has no other signs & his coat is stunning. Frank has been a little firecracker the past few days! I've never heard him dook so much! I plan on taking Ellie & Jasper back to the vets, Ellie to follow up on her lymphnodes - depending on weather or not they go down. Jasper to discuss further tests to try to work out what's wrong. Should an enlarged spleen in itself cause him to be quiet? Other than the sickness bug he suffers with that's the only obvious thing. Otherwise he's beautiful. The food I'm feeding is nutrient chicken & lamb ground raw - 80% fresh meat, 10% offal and 10%bone British Chicken with Bone (dressed carcasses), British Beef Kidney, British Turkey Liver, Scottish Cold Water Salmon Oil, Raw Sea Kelp Powder (Laminaria japonica), Spirulina Powder (Spirulina platensis), Wheat Germ Oil (natural vitamin E) It's quite finely ground but has some decent chunks of bone in it. I noticed though that when I'm finger feeding it feels quite greasy or oily - is that just the fat in It? It also feels gritty. Idk if it's normal? I was told once that (the dog version at least) Is pretty much a whole animal put in a grinder. Idk how true that is.
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Post by azaelia on Apr 25, 2017 19:14:39 GMT -5
Quick update, Since my last post jaspers had another meal, again with a few drops of salmon oil. He's eaten loads!freely by himself, from the bowl. I hope I've cracked it.
Ellie's right lymphnodes feels bigger than the other. Honestly, what are your thoughts? Get breathing when she's sniffing is quick clicky but she doesn't seem to struggle with the stairs despite her added weight. She had a chest x-ray & ultrasound (hence The shaved tummy) just before this mentoring thread was started. They didn't show anything concerning. I might see if I can get a copy of them.
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Post by katt on Apr 25, 2017 20:47:19 GMT -5
1. Ferret's name: jasper 2. Ferret's weight: 727kg (-33g) 3. Ferret has eaten "X" amount on average per meal: a fingerfull every other hour. 4. Stools on various proteins: poops are small but looking ok 5. Activity levels: greatly reduced 6. Weekly menu: nutriment chicken ground
1. Ferret's name: ellie 2. Ferret's weight: 700g (+8g) 3. Ferret has eaten "X" amount on average per meal: She's getting better at eating, doest always chose to eat by herself but will chow down if I put her infront of the bowl 4. Stools on various proteins: poops are looking good 5. Activity levels: decreased 6. Weekly menu: nutriment chicken ground
1. Ferret's name: frank 2. Ferret's weight: 925g (-90g) 3. Ferret has eaten "X" amount on average per meal: Frank's doing ok, similar to ellie, he doesn't always chose to eat by himself, he needs encouraging 4. Stools on various proteins: poops are looking good 5. Activity levels: normal 6. Weekly menu: nutriment chicken groundEllie is looking really good all things considered. With them not wanting to eat on their own - are you leaving the food available at all times? How much are you able to watch them from afar during the day? Ellie is still seriously worrying me - her lymphnodes are still swollen & she's now been on antibiotics for 5 days now. I'm so worried! I still can't work out if they're getting softer & smaller, I think they are but Idk. She's also really quiet & her coat quality is awful.She is on pred still? Pred can definitely affect their fur. As can general illness. The vet said here lymph nodes are swollen also correct? Just checking bc I just had a conversation with someone the other night about how it can be really hard to feel nodes in ferrets, and that fatty deposits/distribution can be deceiving - that said, Ellie doesn't have a lot of extra fat so that is less likely than in a chubbier fuzz (aka my Koda who looks like he has swollen LN but does not - just neck chub lol). Pred can cause increased body fat and change fat distribution, but Ellie is still pretty thin. I am pleased that she will chow down if you set her in front of the bowl - she is doing really well. Try to slowly work from setting her in front of the bowl, to perhaps setting the bowl in front of her, to setting it down in her sight etc to wean towards her eating more on her own. Jasper only comes out of his bed to pee/poop. The only other time he gets up is for 10mins at playtime to hunt for the dogs rubber ball, when he can't find it he goes straight to bed. He must be up for 20mins a day. He's getting a little better at eating, I went back to finger feeding & although he eats very little, he eats more than he did. He did eat by himself from his bowl tonight, & quite a bit too because I put a drizzle of salmon oil in it. I hope I've had a breakthrough with him. He's also been a little more active this evening. I really don't know what to make of Jasper yet. Has he had repeat imaging done? I know you said his spleen lump was gone, but what about his liver? When did he last have blood work done? Has he been given an implant for adrenal disease? I know we discussed it before and you were thinking about it. Honestly if he doesn't have one already, I would really consider just implanting him. He has some odd fur loss which could be seasonal, but due to location could be adrenal. He has vague symptoms, and he is the right age (even more so since as a rescue we can only guess at his real age). Early adrenal signs can be very vague and subtle. It might not be adrenal, in which case the implant will NOT hurt him and will help prevent further strain on his adrenal glands as we previously discussed, but if he does it could make a WORLD of difference for him. The GI symptoms he is having really make me wonder. My Koda had GI symptoms that we chalked up to IBD that we struggled for a very long time to get under control. When we finally implanted him, his IBD suddenly came under INFINITELY better control. For a variety of reasons (many unknown - hormones do weird things to the body), adrenal disease and GI symptoms (often called "IBD" but that is a rather blanket term for GI stuff in ferrets) very frequently tend to go hand in hand. The low energy, weight loss, and unusual shedding pattern makes me even more suspicious. Has he been treated for H. pylori? It can be a real b* to get rid of if your vet does think he is a carrier. Frank has been a little firecracker the past few days! I've never heard him dook so much! I'm glad he is doing so well. You need ONE fairly easy one with what you have going on with your other two! I plan on taking Ellie & Jasper back to the vets, Ellie to follow up on her lymphnodes - depending on weather or not they go down. Jasper to discuss further tests to try to work out what's wrong. Should an enlarged spleen in itself cause him to be quiet? Other than the sickness bug he suffers with that's the only obvious thing. Otherwise he's beautiful. Many ferrets have enlarged spleens and no one ever figures out why. Spleens can be enlarged for a variety of reasons, including cancers and infections. The large spleen itself would not cause decreased energy - but stuff that causes the large spleen can cause the other symptoms. The food I'm feeding is nutrient chicken & lamb ground raw - 80% fresh meat, 10% offal and 10%bone
It's quite finely ground but has some decent chunks of bone in it. I noticed though that when I'm finger feeding it feels quite greasy or oily - is that just the fat in It? It also feels gritty. Idk if it's normal? I was told once that (the dog version at least) Is pretty much a whole animal put in a grinder. Idk how true that is.It probably is a combination of the fat and ground up connective tissues causing the oily gritty feeling. I forget if I asked this already, but do you know the heart content of the Nutriment? If it really is whole ground animal it should be pretty good, but it might be worth double checking. What other proteins do they have available - just for my own knowledge so I know what your grind options are. The meat bits in the grind are a pretty good size, which is great! That will put us that much farther ahead when we get back to working on slivers.
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Post by katt on Apr 25, 2017 20:50:06 GMT -5
Quick update, Since my last post jaspers had another meal, again with a few drops of salmon oil. He's eaten loads!freely by himself, from the bowl. I hope I've cracked it. Ellie's right lymphnodes feels bigger than the other. Honestly, what are your thoughts? Get breathing when she's sniffing is quick clicky but she doesn't seem to struggle with the stairs despite her added weight. She had a chest x-ray & ultrasound (hence The shaved tummy) just before this mentoring thread was started. They didn't show anything concerning. I might see if I can get a copy of them. Awesome!!!! (dance) Go Jasper!! If a few drops of salmon oil is what it takes to get him interested that is just fine. Just watch that he isn't getting too much over the week that his poops get even worse. But that is a GREAT step forward. Hopefully he keeps it up!! A copy of the XRay and US results would be interesting to see. Has she had any blood work aside from BG?
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Post by katt on Apr 25, 2017 20:51:07 GMT -5
Also, keep up the awesome work. You have a very challenging set of fuzzards and you are doing a wonderful job with them. Dont forget to congratulate yourself for how far you have come (they are not on kibble! ) and how much work you have put in to giving them a healthier life. <3
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Post by katt on Apr 25, 2017 23:27:42 GMT -5
Also, Machan has sadly had to take a break for life reasons. As working with ferrets with difficult medical conditions is a part of our training program for all of our mentors, I would like one of our other mentors to have an opportunity to work on this switch with me. All of our mentors are fantastic and have a lot of knowledge, so you'll be in good hands. It's always nice to have 2 people on a switch too to have twice the eyes watching and twice the resources to go to for help if an issue arises, and to hear different perspectives. As soon as I know who will be joining us I'll let you know!
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Post by azaelia on Apr 26, 2017 6:21:17 GMT -5
Thank you Katt!
I'm sorry to hear about Machan, but I totally understand!
Yes, I'm leaving they're food out all the time atm. Although we entering summer now so I'll start picking it up between meals when I'm home soon.
Ellie is on pred, .1mg a day I think (I'll check when I get home) it's quarter of a tablet anyway. It's good to hear it can affect her coat, i won't worry as much about that now. When I took her in to the vet he said all her nodes were inflamed. The ones on her neck do feel like fatty lumps, I have no idea what swollen lymphnodes feel like but these are around the size of a penny and squishy. I really hope it's fat. She's always been a petite lady & now she's quite chunky. She looks a little like a pit bellied pig lol fingers crossed it's fat.
The only bloodwork Ellie has had is for bg. We were going to send away a blood sample but her bg was so low we were convinced we found the cause.
Jasper also hasn't had many tests, we've not long found a decent test. In July last year he had a tummy scan when he was sick with his tummy bug. I don't remember what the results were but there was nothing diagnostic in them. I still plan on having everyone implanted I'm going to talk to my vet at out appointment about it. I think I'd also like to put him on a dose of pred for a week or 2 to see if he improves with that. I'd rather not go down the route of anethetising him at the moment because he still seems quite weak. It's interesting to hear about go problems being linked to adrenal.
When you ask if he's been tested for 'H. pylori' I've not heard of that, what is It?
I'm not sure of the heart content in nutriment, I'll find out. I know they also do beef, turkey & probably lamb. I've got some beef in the freezer but I want them to be eating reliably before I make any more changes. 2 days a week I'm out the house for 7 hours so those days have been a major concern for me. I'll sleep better at night when I know they'll eat during the day.
Jasper also ate his breakfast, the ferrets practically qued up at the bowl this morning! I'll continue putting a little salmon oil in for a few more meals & I'll watch out for poops. He was quicker to get up this morning so I'm wondering if some of his lethargy was due to not eating enough.
Could you tell me what the qualifications mentors need please so when I discuss this with my vet he knows your qualified. I think they see too many google warriors who don't really know what they're talking about.
Thanks 😁
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