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Post by Deleted on Aug 11, 2015 11:02:52 GMT -5
Okay, and when you say soupie do you mean the balanced soup recipe with heart and liver? Or just blended up muscle meat? Let us know if your girlfriend's workplace will order meat for you, if not and you cannot find enough to create a balanced menu we will have to explore other options to make sure they get the nutrients they need.
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Post by Sherry on Aug 11, 2015 18:04:43 GMT -5
sorry- no idea why I thought I read SURREY BC, instead of Stewart BC.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 12, 2015 12:58:37 GMT -5
Okay, and when you say soupie do you mean the balanced soup recipe with heart and liver? Or just blended up muscle meat? Let us know if your girlfriend's workplace will order meat for you, if not and you cannot find enough to create a balanced menu we will have to explore other options to make sure they get the nutrients they need. It is the normal soupie recipe, though I have been doing ground beef instead of chicken lately, I was mostly concerned about the lack of a third organ. sorry- no idea why I thought I read SURREY BC, instead of Stewart BC. No problem Sherry, it happens, and I have lived in surrey in the past. Anyways, I have now ordered the following meats: 28kg pork (I don't actually remember the cut, but it was cheap) 10ish kg lean ground beef chuck (83% meat) 16kg organic chicken wings (funnily organic was the cheaper item) 15kg beef heart 15kg beef kidney 15kg chicken liver (I think, might have only ordered 7.5, forgot to double check) Also, I finally got my canned pumpkin in a few days ago, so I have started feeding them a bit of that too. Now I just need to make a meal plan and pre portion so much meat... I am going to hate myself on Tuesday (which is when the food orders for the whole town come in). And all this is only going to cost me a whopping $600 after the freight charges *sigh*.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 12, 2015 13:10:45 GMT -5
Oh my, $600. But, that is a lot of meat, it should last a good while. Don't feed them any canned pumpkin, that is no longer recommended to use as it contains sugars (natural sugars, which they cannot break down), we only use that for blockage protocol. But it is good to have around just in case they eat something they shouldn't have Can you make a menu based on what you have ordered, and post it here? As just an overview/reminder, these are the basic frankenprey requirements, along with an example menu. The minimum is to feed at least 3 proteins a week, and one of the proteins you feed needs to be a red meat (ie: Chicken, Beef, Pork) but it's always good to have more variety as is available. Here's the ex menu, Monday AM: Half Heart - 1/4 Liver - 1/4 Other Organ Monday PM: Edible Bone-In Meal Tuesday AM: Muscle Meal Tuesday PM: Edible Bone-In Meal Wednesday AM: Muscle Meal Wednesday PM: Edible Bone-In Meal Thursday AM: Edible Bone-In Thursday PM: Half Liver - Half Other Organ Friday AM: Edible Bone-In Meal Friday PM: Muscle Meal Saturday AM: Edible Bone-In Meal Saturday PM: Edible Bone-In Sunday AM: Muscle Meal Sunday PM: Edible Bone-In Meal So as long as you follow this menu and have this being fed weekly then their diet will be balanced 7-9 Bone-in Meals (ei: chicken wings, necks, frog legs, etc) 3-4 Muscle Meals (remember, heart is a muscle) Half Liver & Half Other Organ Half Heart, 1/4 Liver and 1/4 Other Organ 1 Meal of Hearts At least one Red Meat meal A minimum of 3 different proteins Edible Bone-In Meat is the non-weight bearing bones of the animal the size of a chicken or smaller. Muscle Meat is any meat not containing bone, remember that Heart is a muscle and must be one of the muscle meals. "Other" organ is any organ that secretes, Kidney, Spleen, Pancreas, Brain, Thymus, etc. As for how long all this stuff will last out at room temp, Soup - 6-8 hours Muscle Meat - 12-24 hours (depending on size of the chunks) Bone In Meats - 24 hours Whole Prey - 48 hours You and your fuzzers are doing very well, it is wonderful to see someone who will go thru so much to get their fuzzers what they need.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 12, 2015 23:29:29 GMT -5
Oh my, $600. But, that is a lot of meat, it should last a good while. Don't feed them any canned pumpkin, that is no longer recommended to use as it contains sugars (natural sugars, which they cannot break down), we only use that for blockage protocol. But it is good to have around just in case they eat something they shouldn't have Can you make a menu based on what you have ordered, and post it here? As just an overview/reminder, these are the basic frankenprey requirements, along with an example menu. The minimum is to feed at least 3 proteins a week, and one of the proteins you feed needs to be a red meat (ie: Chicken, Beef, Pork) but it's always good to have more variety as is available. Here's the ex menu, Monday AM: Half Heart - 1/4 Liver - 1/4 Other Organ Monday PM: Edible Bone-In Meal Tuesday AM: Muscle Meal Tuesday PM: Edible Bone-In Meal Wednesday AM: Muscle Meal Wednesday PM: Edible Bone-In Meal Thursday AM: Edible Bone-In Thursday PM: Half Liver - Half Other Organ Friday AM: Edible Bone-In Meal Friday PM: Muscle Meal Saturday AM: Edible Bone-In Meal Saturday PM: Edible Bone-In Sunday AM: Muscle Meal Sunday PM: Edible Bone-In Meal So as long as you follow this menu and have this being fed weekly then their diet will be balanced 7-9 Bone-in Meals (ei: chicken wings, necks, frog legs, etc) 3-4 Muscle Meals (remember, heart is a muscle) Half Liver & Half Other Organ Half Heart, 1/4 Liver and 1/4 Other Organ 1 Meal of Hearts At least one Red Meat meal A minimum of 3 different proteins Edible Bone-In Meat is the non-weight bearing bones of the animal the size of a chicken or smaller. Muscle Meat is any meat not containing bone, remember that Heart is a muscle and must be one of the muscle meals. "Other" organ is any organ that secretes, Kidney, Spleen, Pancreas, Brain, Thymus, etc. As for how long all this stuff will last out at room temp, Soup - 6-8 hours Muscle Meat - 12-24 hours (depending on size of the chunks) Bone In Meats - 24 hours Whole Prey - 48 hours You and your fuzzers are doing very well, it is wonderful to see someone who will go thru so much to get their fuzzers what they need. Yeah, its been fun trying to get their meals figured out, I will be making a proper menu over the next few days, however -as I think I read Sherry does- I am going to do grinds with eggshell in the AM and either bone in or muscle meats at night, as I was only able to get 1 kind of bone in meat, and my non-organ beef is all ground, at least for now. Also, I am feeding my kittens raw as well, and the only difference I have been able to find in their diet is less bone, is that correct, or am I missing something else?
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Post by Deleted on Aug 13, 2015 8:29:36 GMT -5
Sounds good, but if you want to do grinds in the AM for an extended period, eggshell powder isn't nutritionally sound enough to use long-term, so human grade bonemeal powder would need to be used. They can go a couple months with eggshell though, but after that they'll either need real bone or bonemeal. For cats and ferrets they have the exact same requirements, you're correct, some cats may need less bone, but that's it. All the others are the same. Actually, it's pretty much the same with dogs too, but a dogs need for heart in their diet isn't as demanding as for cats and ferrets.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 13, 2015 16:32:31 GMT -5
Sounds good, but if you want to do grinds in the AM for an extended period, eggshell powder isn't nutritionally sound enough to use long-term, so human grade bonemeal powder would need to be used. They can go a couple months with eggshell though, but after that they'll either need real bone or bonemeal. For cats and ferrets they have the exact same requirements, you're correct, some cats may need less bone, but that's it. All the others are the same. Actually, it's pretty much the same with dogs too, but a dogs need for heart in their diet isn't as demanding as for cats and ferrets. Yeah, meant to say I will be getting bonemeal powder eventually, but that is definitely a 'next paycheck' sort of thing right now.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 16, 2015 17:27:42 GMT -5
Ok, I made this meal plan a few days ago, but just got access to post it now, this is my current plan (please let me know if it seems balanced properly)
HEART LIVER KIDNEY CHICKEN WINGS PORK GR. BEEF AM
Sunday | Monday | Tuesday | Wednesday | Thursday | Friday | Saturday Heart | G. Beef | G. Beef | Heart | G.Beef |G. Beef| Liver |Egg+Shell | Liver | Egg+Shell | Kidney | OR | Kidney | OR | |Bonemeal |Bonemeal/ | Bonemeal | | Egg (no shell)| Eggshell |Egg (no shell)| PM Sunday | Monday |Tuesday |Wednesday | Thursday |Friday | Saturday Chicken Wing| Pork Cube |Chicken Wing |Pork Cube |Chicken Wing |Pork Cube| Chicken Wing
Let's see if this copy/pasted from excel properly... Messed this up, proper plan few posts down
Anyways, I am planning on pre-portioning each meal into 8oz portions, hopefully between the 4 of them it will all get eaten with minimal leftovers.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 16, 2015 18:52:56 GMT -5
2 Meals Heart One meal Half Liver Half Kidney One meal Liver One meal Kidney 4 meals red meat 7 Bone-In 3 Proteins It looks good, a few tweaks needed (or clarification) for Tuesday, Thursday and Saturday, make sure the organ amounts are as follows- Half Liver, Half Kidney Half Heart, 1/4 Liver, 1/4 Kidney No fulls meals of liver or kidney, it's gotta be split And we recommend not mixing foods, as ferts tend to pick out what they like when you do so, so on Tuesday AM, if you can just give them the organs and take out the ground beef that'd be good, to make sure they are getting what they need. Although if you need to use some G. Beef to get them to eat the organs at first, that's fine. A lot of people give organs in soup form, because some ferrets won't eat enough if it's chunked. Also just watch them with the amount of bone, you have quite a few muscle meat meals, so watch their poops and if they're loose increase the bone meals. Everything else looks great! You have- 2 Meals Heart One meal Half Liver Half Kidney 4 meals red meat 7 Bone-In (4 bone, 3 eggshell/powder) 5 Muscle meat meals (3 other muscle meals containing eggshell powder) 3 Proteins What you need for a balanced menu- 7-9 Bone-in Meals 3-4 Muscle Meals (remember, heart is a muscle) Half Liver & Half Other Organ Half Heart, 1/4 Liver and 1/4 Other Organ 1 Meal of Hearts At least one Red Meat meal A minimum of 3 different proteins :goodjob:
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Post by Deleted on Aug 16, 2015 20:04:44 GMT -5
2 Meals Heart One meal Half Liver Half Kidney One meal Liver One meal Kidney 4 meals red meat 7 Bone-In 3 Proteins It looks good, a few tweaks needed (or clarification) for Tuesday, Thursday and Saturday, make sure the organ amounts are as follows- Half Liver, Half Kidney Half Heart, 1/4 Liver, 1/4 Kidney No fulls meals of liver or kidney, it's gotta be split And we recommend not mixing foods, as ferts tend to pick out what they like when you do so, so on Tuesday AM, if you can just give them the organs and take out the ground beef that'd be good, to make sure they are getting what they need. Although if you need to use some G. Beef to get them to eat the organs at first, that's fine. A lot of people give organs in soup form, because some ferrets won't eat enough if it's chunked. Also just watch them with the amount of bone, you have quite a few muscle meat meals, so watch their poops and if they're loose increase the bone meals. Everything else looks great! You have- 2 Meals Heart One meal Half Liver Half Kidney 4 meals red meat 7 Bone-In (4 bone, 3 eggshell/powder) 5 Muscle meat meals (3 other muscle meals containing eggshell powder) 3 Proteins What you need for a balanced menu- 7-9 Bone-in Meals 3-4 Muscle Meals (remember, heart is a muscle) Half Liver & Half Other Organ Half Heart, 1/4 Liver and 1/4 Other Organ 1 Meal of Hearts At least one Red Meat meal A minimum of 3 different proteins :goodjob: Looking it over again, I failed my formatting (didn`t actually double check I had them lined up quite right), going to just screenshot excel instead for less headache.. www.dropbox.com/s/3g2r6g3yxk0vb5t/Meal.PNG
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Post by Deleted on Aug 16, 2015 20:13:35 GMT -5
Ah, much better read that way. Do you know when the meats you ordered will be arriving?
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Post by Deleted on Aug 16, 2015 20:56:37 GMT -5
Heart and kidney 2 days ago, rest Tuesday.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 17, 2015 19:00:35 GMT -5
Okay, let us know after it comes in and you try them with it. Remind me, what size slivers are yours eating right now?
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Post by Deleted on Aug 18, 2015 21:22:14 GMT -5
They are happy to strip whole drumsticks now (the ones from the thigh), and will munch on the bone even. Not sure how well they will do with pork and organs though, as I ran out of pork after a few meals and the organs were always ground. Plus marble is old enough she is starting to get picky, so I am going to have to watch her.
Oh, and I remembered what the pork was.
Giant chunks of frozen pork shoulder... Going to have FUN cutting that up *sigh*
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Post by Deleted on Aug 19, 2015 1:35:52 GMT -5
That's great, they're already munching bone! (dance)
Do you have a cleaver and kitchen shears? I wouldn't attempt to cut up that pork shoulder without a cleaver, it doesn't have to be the top knotch ones but a decent one (one that isn't from the dollar general, lol) will do.
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