|
Post by Deleted on Jul 22, 2015 15:22:48 GMT -5
Congratulations on Marble and Moka. You're in for quite a ride.
Moka is simply overexcited. Scruffing isn't my thing. I leave that for the Vets. Females especially will see it as a dominance issue and react badly to it.
She will calm down as she gets use to you. She does need to play though. Find a teaser toy and dangle it at her. Put a blanket on the floor and pull it along. You want to do what other ferrets would do, when she bites too rough. Stop the play for two minutes, really no more and then come back and resume play to reward her. Just avoid letting her get hands or feet. Her friends would give her that kind of treatment and she will understand it.
Show both Moka and Marble around your home. Explore with them. Show them sinks running, open a drawer that is ferret proofed and let them explore. I call it border patrol and they will enjoy it and you are building your bond with them.
With your soupie, if you can avoid mixing kibble and raw, it's better. Kibble and raw will digest at different rates. That may lead to an upset tummy and may turn into a bacterial overgrowth. They are young enough that they should not have imprinted on kibble yet, but simply are not used to soup. It's a new thing for them and that means that you will want to be patient and persistent. That is the key to success with ferrets.
Make a plate of soup. It's good left out for six to eight hours and at their age, they should have access to food all of the time. They will eat alot for the next few months. They are Tummies with Teeth. Sit on the floor with them and a towel and a spoon. I use those colorful plastic baby spoons. Put one or both on your lap. Dab some soupie on their mouth. They will have to lick it off. Do it again if necessary. Then take the spoon and offer it to them. Once they have licked a spoonful or two, lower the spoon to the plate and place them on the floor. Let them lick off the spoon. If the run away, pick them up and gently place one hand under them, just to let them know that you are there. Offer the spoon again. Always try for that one last bite. It's like feeding a toddler.
You will know they are full if they leave food on the plate. If they empty the plate, they could eat more. The average Grown male eats 3-4 ounces a day. Grown females eat around 2 ounces. Their appetite is bigger in the winter and smaller in the spring. Kits will eat around 4 times a day and may eat alot more than you expect. Between growing and eating raw, they are going to need to eat alot of nutrients and make up for the lost nutrients in kibble.
It's super important to work with them on their food. You can leave a dish of soup in the cage at night and it should be fine. Since they are kits, leave a chicken wing for each of them. They won't be able to handle the top part yet, which is strong. However if you cut them wing once lengthwise and twice across, without severing it, it will be good stimulation for them and give them some learning to eat Bones experience.
Getting pictures of kits is tough, they are almost always blurry, but pretty please... :wave3:
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 22, 2015 16:52:02 GMT -5
OK, so fill plate whenever empty, stop scruffing, start getting their attention with toys more, let Moka do a tour of the house, throw out my bag of kibble.
I did let Marble do a tour of the house last night, I was just worried about Moka biting the kittens, so wanted to wait until she calmed down.
Question about biting though: how do I get the little stinker to actually let go?
And about the chicken wings... They don't actually sell them in town (when the store does carry chicken it is ridiculously priced), so all I got is thighs and drumsticks, could I leave one of those in the pen for each of them instead?
Also, I will post a nice big blurry album on Friday of pictures off my phone/my girlfriend's phone.
|
|
|
Post by Celene on Jul 22, 2015 18:20:52 GMT -5
bitbyter and katt have threads on biting in our training tips board. I'm also tagging Heather since I think she has done a lot of bite training in her time. Young ferrets will often bite, particularly when they have spent their lives in a pet store after being taken from their mommy at a mill at too young an age - they've really never had anyone around to teach them that biting was wrong! Many people on here are very against scruffing. If Moka is biting out of fear then scruffing will only make it worse.
|
|
|
Post by katt on Jul 22, 2015 18:54:24 GMT -5
I had a video not sure if I uploaded it. When they bite you can typically get them to let go by applying GENTLE but firm pressure at the corners of their mouth/jaw. This will get them to open their mouths and let go of whatever they are holding.
|
|
|
Post by katt on Jul 22, 2015 19:11:20 GMT -5
Here we go - same concept applies when they are biting onto something. Just gently press your finger in the corner of their mouth. [Don't worry, Koda got plenty of loves and some salmon oil for participating as the model for this video. ]
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 22, 2015 20:53:29 GMT -5
Yeah, now that its been pointed out I remember about no scruffing/seeing that video, I just haven't looked into it much in the past 6 months, and currently lack home internet, so I was going by what I remembered from elsewhere.
But hey, that's why I said what I have been doing and asked.
Speaking of asking, no one answered if drumsticks should be OK instead of wings (if I don't hear back about this before I go home I will try anyways, and maybe break the bone a bit first)
|
|
|
Post by Celene on Jul 22, 2015 21:26:19 GMT -5
Drumsticks as in the thighs, or the drummettes that are the top/upper third of the wing? In either instance they are quite hard and most ferrets have a difficult time with them, particularly ones who are new to raw.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 22, 2015 23:03:30 GMT -5
From the thigh, I didn't think to buy any wings or drummettes while I was in terrace, and like I said the grocery store doesn't carry any. I will crack the bone and let them gnaw on some drumsticks tonight though, and see how well they did in the morning.
|
|
|
Post by katt on Jul 23, 2015 1:10:54 GMT -5
My boys take on drumstick bones as long as I break them open BUT most ferrets have trouble eating bones that large and bones not eaten don't count toward bone content. Also there's a lot less bone in a drumstick than a wing, so that's something to keep in mind as well.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 23, 2015 14:47:32 GMT -5
My boys take on drumstick bones as long as I break them open BUT most ferrets have trouble eating bones that large and bones not eaten don't count toward bone content. Also there's a lot less bone in a drumstick than a wing, so that's something to keep in mind as well. I did smash them with my cleaver, however I guess they weren't hungry overnight since they kind of dragged one drumstick half off the plate and nibbled on the soupie a little. Think I put a little too much in the cage last night. Anyways... Day 2: Marble: would not sit on the scale (hurry up amazon, I need that salmon oil! Moka:615g Made another batch of soupie, this one I only did half the meat, and small diced a drumstick (was about 4oz as it was) and added that after blending the rest. I am worried I am not getting the eggshell fine enough though, I was seeing a lot of it leftover yesterday. I have seen both of them nibbling at the food, although Moka definitely eats more from what I have seen. Speaking of Moka, my girlfriend started doing as suggested for biting, and already neither of us get anything but light nips now. I put the kittens in the playpen today, though the kittens are still nervous around the fuzzbutts, especially Midna. Moka nipped midna, Midna hissed and swatted her, they avoided each other after that. Had to pull Moka off New several times though, she kept jumping on him and biting behind the ears and neck, and occasionally the back leg, but Mew is too passive and nervous to respond. *sigh* guess I can't expect too much from the second day, huh?
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 24, 2015 13:09:35 GMT -5
My boys take on drumstick bones as long as I break them open BUT most ferrets have trouble eating bones that large and bones not eaten don't count toward bone content. Also there's a lot less bone in a drumstick than a wing, so that's something to keep in mind as well. I did smash them with my cleaver, however I guess they weren't hungry overnight since they kind of dragged one drumstick half off the plate and nibbled on the soupie a little. Think I put a little too much in the cage last night. Anyways... Day 2: Marble: would not sit on the scale (hurry up amazon, I need that salmon oil! Moka:615g Made another batch of soupie, this one I only did half the meat, and small diced a drumstick (was about 4oz as it was) and added that after blending the rest. I am worried I am not getting the eggshell fine enough though, I was seeing a lot of it leftover yesterday. I have seen both of them nibbling at the food, although Moka definitely eats more from what I have seen. Speaking of Moka, my girlfriend started doing as suggested for biting, and already neither of us get anything but light nips now. I put the kittens in the playpen today, though the kittens are still nervous around the fuzzbutts, especially Midna. Moka nipped midna, Midna hissed and swatted her, they avoided each other after that. Had to pull Moka off New several times though, she kept jumping on him and biting behind the ears and neck, and occasionally the back leg, but Mew is too passive and nervous to respond. *sigh* guess I can't expect too much from the second day, huh? A small note, Bones are considered the Non Weight bearing bones of an animal the size of a chicken or smaller. If you can find quail, that's a great beginner bone and they can handle all of it.
@sirrush I stand corrected on that statement. Bones do not have to be the Non Weight bearing Bones. ANY bones that they eat counts - including weight bearing bones. Some ferrets can't eat weight bearing bones very well bc they are thicker, but many can. Same goes for stuff like pork ribs/button bones, oxtails, etc. If they eat it, it counts toward their bone content if they don't it does not.
Moka is learning, that's great. Kittens and cats need a place to retreat up and away from the ferrets, when they have had enough. Ferrets tend to terrorize felines. I don't have any but I keep reading all the stories.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2015 12:51:09 GMT -5
A small note, Bones are considered the Non Weight bearing bones of an animal the size of a chicken or smaller. If you can find quail, that's a great beginner bone and they can handle all of it.
@sirrush I stand corrected on that statement. Bones do not have to be the Non Weight bearing Bones. ANY bones that they eat counts - including weight bearing bones. Some ferrets can't eat weight bearing bones very well bc they are thicker, but many can. Same goes for stuff like pork ribs/button bones, oxtails, etc. If they eat it, it counts toward their bone content if they don't it does not.
Moka is learning, that's great. Kittens and cats need a place to retreat up and away from the ferrets, when they have had enough. Ferrets tend to terrorize felines. I don't have any but I keep reading all the stories. Moka is learning, however the kitten that would tell Moka to stop biting doesn't let Moka get close enough to play, and the other kitten just lets himself get bit... And then I have to detach Moka because she doesn't let go. I vacuumed for the first time around the furballs and fuzzbutts today, the kittens disappeared the moment the vacuum turned on, the ferrets let their noses get stuck in the end. Fearless little guys. Also made them feeding and litterbox dens today, they like the feeding den, still pulled half the litter out of the litterbox though. Need to actually exchange the one in their playpen with a den though, they keep going AROUND their current open one *sigh*. Anyways,for the switching updates for the past 2 days: Day 3: Marble 960 Moka 630 Did half chicken half ground beef in the soupie today, Moka ate right away, Marble was a bit iffy at first. Gave them a broken up (but still whole) drumstick, they didn't eat it by bedtime. Day 4: Marble 980 Moka 630 Decided to do a double batch of soupie today, because between the four of them they go through a batch a day, chunked up 2 drumsticks (didn't grind them) as half the meat content... Going to give them some pork riblets at bedtime today. Still need to talk to the grocery store about ordering meats/organs, and going to see about ordering some whole quail/rabbit/rats off of rodentpro today (I have easy access to an american p.o. box due to where I live).
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2015 14:10:53 GMT -5
Have you looked around for a good Asian Market? That's a great source for quail and other proteins. Google find Asian Markets near Stewart BC. Then check for reviews. We also have several BC members, Celene is one. I know it's a big place though. We make a one hour trip once a month or so into the city. It saves on shipping costs.
|
|
|
Post by Celene on Jul 25, 2015 14:36:26 GMT -5
Hah @poncesmom! I'm pretty sure @sirrush lives a 12-14 hour drive from the nearest Asian market I think it would be easier to try and find local farmers and hunters to get meat and organs from. Generally there are people in small towns who raise their own livestock, including rabbits and smaller birds. Ordering from rodentpro or hare today is a good idea. I would just call your local border crossing first to make sure they'll let you bring it through. I talked to Katt who went from Alaska to Seattle and she said they let her bring meat into Canada, but the end destination was still the US so she isn't sure whether it would make a difference.
|
|
|
Post by Celene on Jul 25, 2015 14:37:47 GMT -5
Oh, and also make sure the US post office you use has a refrigerated area or is willing to call you the second it arrives to pick it up so it doesn't spoil!
|
|