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Post by Deleted on May 24, 2012 11:58:28 GMT -5
He has not been checked out by a vet since I got him and I have located a good (reportedly) ferret vet nearby. As far as stress--we did go house sitting in April and I was really sick while we were there so he didn't get out of his cage hardly at all. He protested by not using his litterbox and trashing his cage. A couple weeks ago he got hold of a foot scrub soap bar and licked the heck out of it before we caught him. Then when my daughter was here my mother fell and was in the hospital so for a few days I was dog sitting everyone's dog. Tomo and mom's terrier played and played but I think the terrier was a bit too much. Then there was the new puppy my daughter got and we had her around for a day or too before they left to Alaska. So there has been a lot going on. I know I have been extremely stressed out and actually my tummy isn't so good right now either. I ordered bene bac, it should be here in a few days. That may help out. His poos are better when he eats cubed or ground meat. Yesterday I gave him game hen and I pounded it quite a bit first. I'm not terribly worried because he is gaining weight--nearly 3 lbs now! And he is full of energy but I think that if he is having these issues now he is probably going to always have a sensitive GI tract. I was reading that some of these issues are endemic in some pet ferret populations depending on where they came from. Tomo is a Marshall ferret so who knows.
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Post by Deleted on May 24, 2012 13:21:31 GMT -5
That's right - pet ferrets are incredibly prone to GI issues (esp. Marshall's) - food sensitivities, bacterial infections, and ulcers (either FROM bacteria or idiopathic). I'd use the benebac and keep a kind of running tab on the waste he produces. If it's just a sensitivity, you usually control with food and probiotics and other natural remedies (jennifer, aka mustelidmusk, would be a great person to contact about herbs to use, and we can do that, if you want!), but these things are interconnected from the minor things to the major, and can morph quickly from one to the other, so that's why, even if it's nothing to worry about now, it's important to monitor, because having a GI system constantly/frequently irritated can lead to IBD, to hard-to-control-flares, to cancers. It's just the way these guys are built, unfortunately. And also getting Tomo in for a stool sample and some tests for bacterial infections, etc, might be a good idea) You can also use some Bach's rescue remedy in his water, too, to help with the stress, if you want. As for ground/cubed food - have you tried ground bone in food? It lacks the tooth cleaning power of RMBs, but it'd be balanced and he might be able to get more use out of it, if his body's not breaking down/digesting things quick enough for whatever reason (and that's my main concern with Tomo, that so much of his food is apparently appearing undigested in his stool. It'd be interesting to see if ground food actually helped that issue). I'm glad to hear he's getting so big and happy, though
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Post by Deleted on May 25, 2012 10:33:09 GMT -5
I'm concerned about it too, he may not be absorbing all the nutrients he needs. I'm really hoping that the bene bac will do the trick, and he can eat a normal raw diet. I will get him to the vet as soon as I can. I was hoping to be able to wait until he's old enough for his rabies vac but I guess I can't. I've been adding eggshell whenever I give him ground or cubed so that he gets some calcium with it.
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Post by Deleted on May 25, 2012 21:16:26 GMT -5
I feel for you - I prefer waiting until my guys are old enough for vaccines (being as some vets can be a little trigger happy, in my experience :\ ) That's great, keep adding in the eggshell powder.
Possibly if you didn't want to take Tomo *in* could you just take in a stool sample and ask them to test it for bacteria oveload/parasites?
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Post by Deleted on May 25, 2012 21:17:08 GMT -5
*or overload, even
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Post by Deleted on May 27, 2012 21:41:12 GMT -5
Yes, I have noticed a worrying trend in the veterinary profession. They seem to be mirroring the human health profession. They push drugs and tend to go overboard doing unnecessary procedures. I would really like to do things naturally but I do recognize that Tomo is not a wild ferret. He is a product of selective breeding. Marshall Ferrets is in the business of producing ferrets with good personality traits for pet ferrets. In his case they have succeeded wonderfully but he may be suffering a little in his physical constitution as a result. I naively thought that feeding a raw diet would be the cure-all but I guess its not that simple. Not that I won't continue, he is totally better off than my previous ferrets! We were just remarking this morning how much more energy he has than our other ferrets ever had.
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Post by Deleted on May 27, 2012 23:26:53 GMT -5
A lot of people think a raw diet is a cure all, so that's not unusual. Unfortunately, like you said, it's not, it's just something that helps bolster them, and especially with pet store/farm ferrets, it's about giving them the things to help their bodies delay for just that bit longer what's kind of inevitable (and raw diet does help - when Pix got really sick, I was able to keep her weight, appetite and energy up much longer on the raw diet than we'd have ever seen with kibble. And that's because when she got sensitive to a protein I could take it out of the diet, or if her body couldn't break down the RMB or carcass, I could offer a balanced raw alternative that was much easier for her to digest, instead of forcing her body to try to digest high carb/forced high fat percentages that wreck the body even more)
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Post by Deleted on May 30, 2012 10:40:56 GMT -5
I'm still waiting for the bene bac-I ordered it online instead of driving to town, not taking into account the holiday weekend (duh). So no changes to report. I won't be checking in much for the next week because the good computer is heading to Orlando for the high school band trip and I will be stuck home with the one that doesn't work. Do you think I should start with giving the bene bac and looking for improvement or having him checked out at the vet to see what's in the poo? P.S. Got the bene bac and scheduled an appt. with the vet that justhannah recommended on the list your vet thread. He doesn't go in til next Thursday. And scored some beef heart
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Post by Deleted on May 30, 2012 21:07:18 GMT -5
Generally, if he's going to have a major bacteria overload/parasites (<= unlikely. It's actually rare for ferrets to harbor parasites), it'll show up regardless of the probiotics. I'd start the benebac and see about improvements, and just inform the vet of what you've given him, so they know. Yay, beef heart! I know that was a big seller for my guys, so here's hoping Tomo likes it
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Post by Deleted on Jun 1, 2012 20:06:14 GMT -5
The beef heart was a no go, but my dog liked it. Her health has improved since I got Tomo because she eats his refused meals. She is a big dog, a mixed breed austrailian shepherd/ /coyote? so I can't really afford to feed her all raw. She does a pretty good job of catching her own prey. One of our cats acts like she would really like a raw food diet too, the other one will only eat Friskies Grillers Blend--disgraceful, I know. No improvement with the poo. I don't really see a pattern relative to what I feed him. I will be interested to see what the vet says. If the bene bac had any affect it has been to reduce the output of his poo. I also got him some ferretone and have been giving 3/4 tsp daily.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 3, 2012 18:49:17 GMT -5
Ferret-tone's okay (kind of loaded with things he really doesn't need, but) - EVOO, fish oil, etc is better for him, in the long run.
Ferrets are individuals, and it might take time for Tomo to adjust to a new food, so don't give up, just try dicing it and mixing it in with a food he already likes. Then you can work on upping the size of the chunks once he gets used to the the taste/texture/smell/whatever that's putting him off.
Maybe the benebac is helping build up the good bacteria, and slowing down his digestion so that he's actually breaking things down, instead of having so much nutrients being wasted. Can't wait to hear about the vet!
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Post by Deleted on Jun 8, 2012 21:02:13 GMT -5
Ok. My stupid internet is out at my house-if it isn't one thing its another. Anyway we went to the vet yesterday and she is WONDERFUL! I wish she was my doctor. She was excited that I had him on a raw diet. She has a friend who is a colleague, Dr. Brown, who is doing research on adrenal disease and early neutering. She is very holistic in her approach. She said he is doing wonderfully, good everything, heart, lungs, coat etc. But the fecal exam showed an overload of bacteria, some kind of spore forming bacteria (or something...not really sure exactly what she said). But she sent his sample off to a lab for testing as to exactly what strain of this particular bacteria it is so we know what we are dealing with. In the meantime she wants to get his GI tract calmed down so she prescribed amoxycillin and wants me to give the benebac every other day. She doesn't think that a food allergy is an issue at this point, given his age, but she thinks maybe limiting the variety for a time until we get this under control might be a good idea. She liked the recipe for the soup and said that he could eat that everyday and get what he needs. So I will make up some soup using the game hen as the meat and chicken broth, heart and liver and feed him that along with his antibiotic and the benebac. She basically told me what you told me so I feel really good about this mentoring program. It is such a life saver for people who want to feed raw but don't really know how to go about it. She also said that I can't do anything about his genetic make up but I can control his diet and environment to give him the best life possible. Pretty much what you said too. I will have to pm justhannah and thank her for recommending her vet. Well worth the hour drive!
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Post by Deleted on Jun 10, 2012 10:08:07 GMT -5
You and I are both having issues with internet then! Mine has been sketchy these past few days, as well, no worries. I'm so glad we're getting Tomo on track. He'll get a lot of relief once the amoxi helps kill that bacteria issue. We go to a lot of lengths for these guys. My own ferret vet is 2.5 hours away from me and is pretty expensive, but he knows his stuff, and that's all that matters at the end of the day! Also - thank you! I'm just glad I've been able to help at all it's always nice to hear that this mentoring program helps and that people are getting a use of it!
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Post by Deleted on Jun 12, 2012 16:28:43 GMT -5
Yes, we do go to great lengths. Its because ferrets are such special little people. The vet just called me with the further test results. The bacteria overgrowth was clostridium. Apparently it will move in and cause problems in an already inflamed gut. She will call me in a couple of weeks when he's done with his amoxi. If he has not improved then we will look for some kind of food sensitivity. She thinks he will probably be fine once we kill the bad bacteria and encourage the good with the benebac. Yesterday actually had a normal looking poo. I was quite pleased.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 13, 2012 14:12:13 GMT -5
That's great to hear, at least we know now what's going on. I'd recommend always having benebac on hand and dosing him weekly (even after this). Once these little guys get a serious GI issue, they tend to always be sensitive to more.
Just a warning - I'm having serious difficulties with my modem (currently at my sister's house, mooching internet access). My posting may continue to be a bit intermittent in the next few days until I figure out what's what.
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