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Post by brittles888 on Apr 20, 2014 2:55:43 GMT -5
Hey! So before I read this, to make smaller slivers, they actually started eating the slivers and chunks on their own anyway. They eat all the soup first, and leave the chunks, but then come back to the plate a little later and eat up the slivers...even Lola. So they are eating pieces in the soup by themselves without me hand feeding it to them that vary from fingernail clipping size to half fingernail size. The dogs main toys now are just stuffed animals, which the ferrets usually don't even touch. (There originally was a mix of stuffed animals, mini tennis balls that squeak, plush eggs that squeak, and rubber toys that squeak, and the ferrets stole everything and hid it except the regular stuffed animals.) I have rope toys, but neither the ferrets or the dogs like them. I do have other ferret toys too, like I've got a ball pit and tunnels and I've made a rice box. I've made them a couple box/tunnel/ducttaped together combos in the past too. (I had one contraption that was a tunnel going into a super long skinny box filled with plush scraps that had two tunnels coming out of it, one going under the couch and a second one going around and behind the dog kennel then into the ball pit) They loved that for a few weeks then never used it. The last rice box I made they loved and went crazy in, then one of them started using it for a litter box so I had to end up dumping it. I've made them a biodegradable packing peanut box too, and also filled a box with crumpled paper. I just need to find something new they love to hide that isn't made from rubber, since that's pretty much the only thing they like to hide. I guess I'll find out soon enough what they choose as a rubber replacement stash item when suddenly their access to "their precious" is no longer there. Ha! I never leave the dogs and the ferrets out together if I'm not there. If I'm there they are both out together. I never leave the ferrets or the dogs out if I'm not there. (The dogs are kennel trained and go in a kennel if we aren't home.) The ferrets would only be out if I was home. I have been able to give them free time in this new house finally so they are happier right now...I'm still working on unpacking stuff though so it's been pretty supervised play time in this house and for short periods. At my old house, I usually just opened the cage if I saw they had woken up. And then they would explore the house and find stuff to steal and hide and play with each other and me and then fall asleep in one of their hidey holes. (They had one under my dresser, and one under my boyfriends nightstand. Or they would climb from the under my dresser hidey hole up into my sock and underwear drawers and sleep there.) So when I would notice they weren't running around, I would go to those spots and find them sleeping and gently move them back to their sleeping spots in their cage. That was the routine at the old house anyway. My dogs are small (Zin is only a couple pounds less than my smallest dog) and the dogs and the ferrets get along. The dogs don't really interact with them so much...sometimes the dogs will try to get the ferrets to play, or they will follow them around a little sniffing them, but in general they just stay away from them and watch them from up above by sitting on the furniture. They dogs are slightly scared of the ferrets from getting nipped when squeaking a toy and also from me doing training with the dogs to teach them that the ferrets are not to be messed with and the ferrets are above the dogs in the "pack". So in the dogs eyes, the ferrets are alpha over them. (When I squeak a squeaky toy now, to find the ferrets or whatever, all the dogs instantly get up and jump up to high ground so no carpet sharks come lunging out from under a couch or something biting them. They learned to get to higher ground when they hear that sound quickly! Ha! Just like I learned it was a bad idea to squeak the squeaker if I wasn't wearing shoes and didn't have a 360 degree 3-4 foot view around me so a ferret couldn't sneak up and get me while I was doing it...ouch! ) Anyway, so I have about 1 1/2 more days worth of soup before I need to make a new batch. Let me know if I should just keep on this step for now or change something! Thanks! Anyway,
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Post by katt on Apr 20, 2014 3:44:41 GMT -5
So before I read this, to make smaller slivers, they actually started eating the slivers and chunks on their own anyway. They eat all the soup first, and leave the chunks, but then come back to the plate a little later and eat up the slivers...even Lola. So they are eating pieces in the soup by themselves without me hand feeding it to them that vary from fingernail clipping size to half fingernail size. Great news! (dance) In that case, try cutting the soup and offering them the slivers only (since they are eating them soup-free once they have licked the soup off anyways). They might pout and try to hold out for some soupies, but give it a while (even hand feed a bit if they aren't eating anything after ~3-4 hours) and they should cave and eat the slivers since they are already eating them anyways. IF not, then work on increasing the chunks in number and size while decreasing the amount of soup each meal. If they eat the slivers without soup no problem, let me know. From there we will work on a few things at once. The dogs main toys now are just stuffed animals, which the ferrets usually don't even touch. (There originally was a mix of stuffed animals, mini tennis balls that squeak, plush eggs that squeak, and rubber toys that squeak, and the ferrets stole everything and hid it except the regular stuffed animals.) I have rope toys, but neither the ferrets or the dogs like them. I do have other ferret toys too, like I've got a ball pit and tunnels and I've made a rice box. I've made them a couple box/tunnel/ducttaped together combos in the past too. (I had one contraption that was a tunnel going into a super long skinny box filled with plush scraps that had two tunnels coming out of it, one going under the couch and a second one going around and behind the dog kennel then into the ball pit) They loved that for a few weeks then never used it. The last rice box I made they loved and went crazy in, then one of them started using it for a litter box so I had to end up dumping it. I've made them a biodegradable packing peanut box too, and also filled a box with crumpled paper. I just need to find something new they love to hide that isn't made from rubber, since that's pretty much the only thing they like to hide. I guess I'll find out soon enough what they choose as a rubber replacement stash item when suddenly their access to "their precious" is no longer there. Ha!
Lol honestly I have learned over the years that other than jingle balls (Kenai LOVES things that make noise - the more noise the better), they really don't seem to play with toys unless you are using the toys to actively engage them. Otherwise they are just treasures to stash. See if you can find some little plush balls - I'll get a pic for you. They are a favorite stash toy here. Solid jingle balls are fun too bc it takes them time to learn to grab so they can pick it up to stash. Same for ping-pong balls, but watch for chewing with those (all toys should be checked regularly anyways). Oh! Here's an idea for you - golf balls. We found a golf ball laying around and gave it to the boys...Kenai goes NUTS for that thing. It's heavy and solid and round so it's hard to pick up and he REALLY wants to stash it. It's hilarious. I never leave the dogs and the ferrets out together if I'm not there. If I'm there they are both out together. I never leave the ferrets or the dogs out if I'm not there. (The dogs are kennel trained and go in a kennel if we aren't home.) The ferrets would only be out if I was home. I have been able to give them free time in this new house finally so they are happier right now...I'm still working on unpacking stuff though so it's been pretty supervised play time in this house and for short periods. At my old house, I usually just opened the cage if I saw they had woken up. And then they would explore the house and find stuff to steal and hide and play with each other and me and then fall asleep in one of their hidey holes. (They had one under my dresser, and one under my boyfriends nightstand. Or they would climb from the under my dresser hidey hole up into my sock and underwear drawers and sleep there.) So when I would notice they weren't running around, I would go to those spots and find them sleeping and gently move them back to their sleeping spots in their cage. That was the routine at the old house anyway. Oh good Ferrets+dogs is an iffy combo. We've seen a lot of accidents with best-friend dog:ferret pairs on the forums over the years. While you are unpacking, is there perhaps a room that you can thoroughly ferret proof and close off? Then they could run around in there with the door closed while you unpack and clean and do whatever else needs doing in the other rooms. Just an idea to give them some more free time while you aren't able to supervise... We will be moving here in July, it's a pain in the butt. lol I'm looking forward to having my own place again (well, plus Shane lol) but NOT looking forward to the moving part. My dogs are small (Zin is only a couple pounds less than my smallest dog) and the dogs and the ferrets get along. The dogs don't really interact with them so much...sometimes the dogs will try to get the ferrets to play, or they will follow them around a little sniffing them, but in general they just stay away from them and watch them from up above by sitting on the furniture. They dogs are slightly scared of the ferrets from getting nipped when squeaking a toy and also from me doing training with the dogs to teach them that the ferrets are not to be messed with and the ferrets are above the dogs in the "pack". So in the dogs eyes, the ferrets are alpha over them. (When I squeak a squeaky toy now, to find the ferrets or whatever, all the dogs instantly get up and jump up to high ground so no carpet sharks come lunging out from under a couch or something biting them. They learned to get to higher ground when they hear that sound quickly! Ha! Just like I learned it was a bad idea to squeak the squeaker if I wasn't wearing shoes and didn't have a 360 degree 3-4 foot view around me so a ferret couldn't sneak up and get me while I was doing it...ouch! ) ROFL That's hilarious - poor dogs! I am not at all surprised that the ferrets rule to roost though! Anyway, so I have about 1 1/2 more days worth of soup before I need to make a new batch. Let me know if I should just keep on this step for now or change something! Thanks! Okay...first is to see if they will eat the chunks sans soup, or if they still need a little soup gravy (which is fine actually). From there we will work on adding in new proteins, and start on separating liver/hearts. This is where it starts to get a bit tricky. You'll need to make a soup that has MORE organs, and less muscle meat. Ideally it should be about half liver, half muscle meat. IF they will accept it with even LESS muscle meat, all of the better. You can try pureeing some liver and finger feed them all a dab - they will probably act like you have poisoned them. Then add in a little bit of chicken or other familiar muscle meat at a time, and finger feed a dab until you get an amount of muscle:organ that they will eat. This soup they will get one meal a day, with the other meal being slivers. Every day or couple of days (depends entirely on how picky they are, and how hard you push them)increase the amount of liver and hearts, while decreasing the amount of muscle meat. When they get up to about 2/3 organs and heart, we will cut them back to about 3 meals a week, and start adding in slivers of organs. Heart you can add into the liver and muscle soup AND/or start adding slivers to their muscle meat slivers. I would prefer to see the hearts in slivers over the soup. This is where we get into the more labor intensive part of the game, so regular updates will help me know where they are at and where you need to go next at each point. Here goooeeess!!!! (dance)
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Post by brittles888 on Apr 20, 2014 21:46:22 GMT -5
I'll have to do soup today, as the store is closed so I couldn't go buy regular meat. Easter...doh. I have a bunch of frozen heart and liver so I pulled some of that out for the week, and tomorrow I will go buy some chicken. The chunks and slivers were premixed into this batch of soup so unless I pick them all out I can't just give them that. I did have a room set aside for them to play that was ferret proof, but that's the one Zin ripped up the carpet and got the door open even though I had an office mat down to protect the carpet by the door. And our renters are going to be moving in here in a week and they came by to check everything out so I had to remove the ferret mess and fix the carpet. So they aren't allowed on that side of the house anymore and there aren't any other rooms that don't have stuff in them. But they seem happier anyway, in general, and Zin isn't being crazy like he was. Ok, so tomorrow I will buy muscle meat!
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Post by katt on Apr 20, 2014 23:45:14 GMT -5
I'll have to do soup today, as the store is closed so I couldn't go buy regular meat. Easter...doh. I have a bunch of frozen heart and liver so I pulled some of that out for the week, and tomorrow I will go buy some chicken. The chunks and slivers were premixed into this batch of soup so unless I pick them all out I can't just give them that. lol yeah don't bother picking out the slivers, they can wait a day or two. Talk about pain in the butt... lmao I did have a room set aside for them to play that was ferret proof, but that's the one Zin ripped up the carpet and got the door open even though I had an office mat down to protect the carpet by the door. And our renters are going to be moving in here in a week and they came by to check everything out so I had to remove the ferret mess and fix the carpet. So they aren't allowed on that side of the house anymore and there aren't any other rooms that don't have stuff in them. But they seem happier anyway, in general, and Zin isn't being crazy like he was. Ohhh boy. What a little brat! haha Well, glad they are feeling happier now. Moves can be so stressful. I'm grateful that my boys are seasoned little travelers - they're going to need that experience! I've moved apartments 2x since I have had them, and every summer we usually make at least one trip to Fairbanks (6hr drive), and then we spend most of the summer out in Ninilchik (3hr drive) at Shane's family's cabin. They spend a lot of time living in their travel cage in the summer time (they get tons of out-time to play of course). It will be a few day drive down to WA, so hopefully them being used to traveling a bunch and living in their travel cage will help reduce some of the stress. :/ Still going to be a rough trip on them though. Ok, so tomorrow I will buy muscle meat! Sounds good! Let me know how it goes! BTW did you figure anything out for the little 'bino pair at the shelter?
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Post by katt on Apr 22, 2014 22:24:36 GMT -5
Just popping in to check for updates and to let you know that sadly I am going to take a brief hiatus. For the next 2.5 weeks one of the other mentors is going to take over for me as I am totally swamped by finals right now. I will still check in when I can, but until May 9th my life is going to consist of studying, studying, and more studying... Ugh, yay...? LOL Anyways, you'll be in very good hands and I'll pop in if I can.
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Post by brittles888 on Apr 23, 2014 2:21:54 GMT -5
Hey! Ok no problem...I understand!
The albino's are gone off the site now, so hopefully they got adopted. I always watch petfinder to see what ferrets go into shelters in Alaska. It's rare one goes into the Juneau shelter.
The ferrets haven't eaten the slivers/chunks only yet. I didn't get to the store yesterday, so they got soup yesterday and this morning, and then this early eve I put in a plate of slivers and small chunks. They sniffed at it but wouldn't eat it. I tried to hand feed it to them and Lola just licked it and Zin took pieces but was taking them to the top of the cage and hiding them. After about an hour they still hadn't touched it, so I stirred in just about a teaspoon of soup with the pieces, just barely coating it. As of now, they still haven't touched it. Is it ok to just leave meat sitting in their cage like that? I'm hoping when they wake up next they will be hungry enough to go for it. We'll see what happens.
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Post by Sherry on Apr 24, 2014 8:31:45 GMT -5
Hi! I'll be picking up for Katt I gather they are being stubborn? I haven't read through everything, but what was the soup/sliver ratio that they were accepting?
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Post by Sherry on Apr 28, 2014 8:43:31 GMT -5
Update?
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Post by Sherry on May 2, 2014 9:39:19 GMT -5
Updates?
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Post by katt on May 11, 2014 3:22:06 GMT -5
Hey, just letting you know that I am back! How are the fuzzers doing?
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Post by katt on May 12, 2014 2:15:41 GMT -5
Bumping this for my feed
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Post by brittles888 on May 13, 2014 1:55:36 GMT -5
Ok, here I am! I explained to Katt on facebook but it's getting into my crazy busy time of year now but I want to keep trying to do this especially now that I see there are a bunch of people waiting and they aren't taking any more applications for the mentor program at this time. I don't want to take for granted my opportunity or not allow someone else to move into the program by not getting on here. Is there an app for this forum to use on phones ? Or is it easy to use via smartphone? If so I should load my information on my phone..I'd be more apt to get on here every day since I'm on my phone every day. Anyway, my work picked up then my second summmer job started and I wasn't giving the time to making sure the ferrets were eating the food and a batch of meat in the fridge that needed processed spoiled and I ended up giving them kibble. And then just kept giving them kibble. Yesterday I pulled more meat out to make a new batch of soup so I have backup and I took their kibble out of their cage so it can move through their body. The last thing that happened was I made a sort of "soup" with slivers and they wouldn't eat it for the first 12 hours or so it was in their cage but then would reluctantly eat it. That's what was going on. So, I'm going to make a batch of soup tonight so that I have some in the freezer for backup but should I give them soup again for their first raw meal back since you left for your tests or should I do slivers and see what they do? I'll make the soup and then check to see what you think before serving. I weighted them tonight...Zin is 2 lbs 3.5 oz and Lola is 1 lb 10.6 oz. Zin JUST blew his winter coat so he's looking so skinny and ratty. Anyway, I'll be up for hours tonight painting the bathroom so after I make the soup I'll check to see what you think. Thanks for not kicking me out of the program for not being on here. It is disappointing my mentoring thing couldn't have happened during the winter when I first applied and was unemployed but I'll try harder to make it work and schedule in the time I need to work on their food.
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Post by katt on May 13, 2014 3:08:15 GMT -5
Ok, here I am! Perfect timing! I explained to Katt on facebook but it's getting into my crazy busy time of year now but I want to keep trying to do this especially now that I see there are a bunch of people waiting and they aren't taking any more applications for the mentor program at this time. I don't want to take for granted my opportunity or not allow someone else to move into the program by not getting on here. Is there an app for this forum to use on phones ? Or is it easy to use via smartphone? If so I should load my information on my phone..I'd be more apt to get on here every day since I'm on my phone every day. Yes, look for the proboards app. I don't use it but most people do. I just always keep a tab open to the forum in Safari on my iPhone. I have no problem posting from Safari other than my hands get tired of typing on my phone for long replies. I think most people have no trouble with the app. If you open the forum in Safari on your phone it should give you a pop up to the app. iPhone: www.proboards.com/iphone-mobile-forum-appAndroid: www.proboards.com/android-mobile-forum-appAnyway, my work picked up then my second summmer job started and I wasn't giving the time to making sure the ferrets were eating the food and a batch of meat in the fridge that needed processed spoiled and I ended up giving them kibble. And then just kept giving them kibble. Yesterday I pulled more meat out to make a new batch of soup so I have backup and I took their kibble out of their cage so it can move through their body. The last thing that happened was I made a sort of "soup" with slivers and they wouldn't eat it for the first 12 hours or so it was in their cage but then would reluctantly eat it. That's what was going on. Okay so we are back to soup then. No problem. So, I'm going to make a batch of soup tonight so that I have some in the freezer for backup but should I give them soup again for their first raw meal back since you left for your tests or should I do slivers and see what they do? I'll make the soup and then check to see what you think before serving. I'd give the slivers a shot and see what they think, try a little smaller perhaps than what they were getting before. They should pick back up on it fairly quickly. If not though don't worry about it. Sometimes this is a 2 steps forward one step back process. We'll just go back to basics and move forward from there. Hopefully they take to the slivers though - try a little finger feeding to remind them if they seem reluctant. I weighted them tonight...Zin is 2 lbs 3.5 oz and Lola is 1 lb 10.6 oz. Zin JUST blew his winter coat so he's looking so skinny and ratty.
Anyway, I'll be up for hours tonight painting the bathroom so after I make the soup I'll check to see what you think. Thanks for not kicking me out of the program for not being on here. It is disappointing my mentoring thing couldn't have happened during the winter when I first applied and was unemployed but I'll try harder to make it work and schedule in the time I need to work on their food.No worries! I'm just glad you are back in action now! (dance) Yes, we are working on that issue. Unfortunately the program is so backed up right now that we have had to temporarily close down accepting any new applications. We are in the process of adding new mentors, but training takes some time. On top of that, several of mentors are tied up in some slower-moving, more involved switches right now. Lots of insulinoma babies this year it seems. Hopefully we will open the program back up soon and have lots of new mentors to keep things running more quickly so that the wait will not be so long in the future. It is a blessing and a curse. It sucks to have people waiting so long, but the forum being this busy is a really good thing because it means that more people are becoming interested in raw. We're in the process of ramping up the program to help with the recent explosion in members and applications. Anyways, even if you are buys just pop in with a quick note a few times a week - even if it is to say "no change." Once a week should be a fairly detailed update post (weights, preferably pictures of them for size monitoring, activity levels, what and how much they are eating, etc). And you have my number! I try to keep the majority of the important parts at least of the switch here, but don't be afraid to text or message me on FB if something comes up that you have a quick Q or note on. Worst case I can always copy/paste it into the thread for record keeping purposes.
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Post by brittles888 on May 15, 2014 2:21:26 GMT -5
Ok. So, they wouldn't eat the plain slivers. I mixed them into some really thick soup. (This batch was really thick..but I didn't thin it out at all. Like, it's thick like peanut butter.) They ate the soup, but left the slivers. So we are back to that stage. I put more soup in and then went and fed them off my finger a bit, and gave them the slivers. They took them when I did that. So just do soup and slivers again for now then? (Guess what...the albino ferrets are back in the Anchorage pound! They got returned due to allergies. I'm eyeing them again. I'm probably too busy right now to do it but it's so tempting. They seem really sweet from their description.)
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Post by katt on May 15, 2014 3:12:05 GMT -5
Ok. So, they wouldn't eat the plain slivers. I mixed them into some really thick soup. (This batch was really thick..but I didn't thin it out at all. Like, it's thick like peanut butter.) They ate the soup, but left the slivers. So we are back to that stage.
I put more soup in and then went and fed them off my finger a bit, and gave them the slivers. They took them when I did that.
So just do soup and slivers again for now then? No worries! It happens. Yep, back to soup and slivers again. Let's really try to push them towards the slivers though since we know they CAN eat them and are just being spoiled. Hand feed sliver bits if and when you can, and each day add a couple more slivers than before. We'll start with increasing number first for a little bit, then tackle size. (Guess what...the albino ferrets are back in the Anchorage pound! They got returned due to allergies. I'm eyeing them again. I'm probably too busy right now to do it but it's so tempting. They seem really sweet from their description.)
Oh no, poor babies! It must be a sign....! I'm not in the middle of finals anymore so I could potentially be available to help BUT it would have to be in the next 2-3 days as Sunday we leave town - headed to Soldotna to do clinicals for a month. I can't have them in the house because of Shane's parents (my boys are pushing it already unfortunately), but if you can arrange airline stuff that fast I could probably do a pick up and drop off. Also, I will be back in town for the weekend halfway through our clinicals - so around May 30/31-June 1, and may be able to do something then. Also, check out the Frontier Ferrets FB group I added you too (I think I added you?), someone on there might be able to help too...
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