Jill in heat

[Deleted]

I recently took on a new jill, one year old. I was told she wasn't in heat yet, but when I picked her up it was clear she was.
She received her Deslorelin implant 2 days ago, and I have a few questions.

If anyone has experience of Des with jills already in heat, how long, in your experience, did it take for them to come fully out of heat? How do I know when she is - will her hormones be settled once her vulva is back to normal? I have a boy around the same age who received his Des a month ago, so I don't want to introduce until I know all hormones are normal.

When she arrived her vulva was incredibly swollen and wet, and entirely whiteish in colour. Today it looks pinky-red around the middle/inside. Des first gives a hormone surge prior to ending the heat, so is this a normal sign of her heat worsening, or something to be concerned about?

Should I be doing anything special for her while she is still in heat? Anything to help her keep the area clean and prevent infection maybe?

She currently has access to a rice digbox. When she comes out, she usually has a few grains stuck to her vulva. She tends to be fairly quick to groom and brush them off, but is this okay, or likely to cause issues or infection?

Anything else I should know? I'm not experienced at all with jills..

Thanks

[joan]

It's my understanding that there is an initial hormonal surge with the Des implant, so it may keep her in heat longer before she starts going out. You'll know when she starts going out, as her vulva will start shrinking. Until then, keep her living area very clean. I'd recommend that you restrict access to the dig box until her vulva is back to normal size, as there's too great a chance that the rice grains could get up into her vagina and result in an infection.

[Deleted]

=/ I was afraid of that.. okay, thanks. I'll have to find something else heavy enough to block the hole between floors in the hutch..

[Heather]

What if you emptied out the rice and provided smoothed river rocks or marbles? I have a box of those, the guys love them...they also provide considerable weight too
ciao

[crazylady]

Hi I am surprised your vet did not bring her out with a jill jab first as your in the uk wipe a little sudocreme on her vulva ( or vasaline ) as if she remains in longer than necessary while waiting for the des to begin working she may become sore from urine dribbles I must admit I am scratching my head as to why no jill jab as this would of brought her out in a matter of days good luck with your baby may I just ask do you plan on breeding her in the future ? let us know how she gets on with the des implant take care bye for now
Bev

[Deleted]

Heather - That's a good idea, I was thinking about smooth rocks for a second dig box.. I'll see if I can get hold of some tomorrow.

Bev - I'll stick some vaseline on her now, thanks.
I discussed it with my vet, I initially made the appointment for a jill jab with the plan to get Des later. But he said he'd spent the afternoon researching and called Peptech direct, where he had been told that while it is reccommended to implant jills when not in heat it has been tried on jills in heat and has generally taken them out within a week, following a brief hormone surge. He promised a free jill jab to take her out if it doesn't work within a couple of weeks.
I've also checked the ferretdes board, and Nancy says she trialed this method on a year old jill in full heat. The jill was nearly fully out within a few days, but still hormonal for a week or so.
I have no current plans to breed, I'm using des to reduce the risk of adrenal. But who knows, perhaps if I have my own house and a more stable income the next time they're due for an implant I'll reconsider.. She is pretty and has a wonderful temperment.. but I know nothing of her genetic history..

[crazylady]

Hi I hope things work out for you with regards preventing adrenal ( just remember there is no 100% proof that it does ) I am in the uk all my ferrets are whole ( you dont want to know how many lol ) and I can honestly say I have been dam lucky in over 42 years I have not had one case of adrenal or insulinoma ( she says touching wood and crossing her fingers ) but mine are all kept outside in natural conditions and fed a raw diet I travel around the world a lot ( I judge ferrets all over the place ) and I have seen a lot with the des implant the reason I asked if you planned breeding was simply I know in some cases it has been difficult for the jills to conceive after having the des implant and if you didn't plan breeding from her it may be more cost effective to simply spey ( I know uk vets charge an arm and a leg lol ) good luck with your baby please let us know how she progresses with the implant take care bye for now
Bev

[nanjferret]

Hi and sorry this took so long to reply to! When I gave the Des to a jill fully in heat it took about a week for her vulva to go completely down but only a few days to see a noticeable difference. When they are in heat the Des puts them in a false pregnancy status and the hormones surge initially. If your hob has his testicles completely shrunken where he is totally out and the jill has her vulva shrunk down then it will probably be ok however, the hob might still bug her and try which will get her upset. I'd just watch them together and see how he acts as he is still fertile. I have several groups where there are a few whole jills out of heat with an implant and a hob with an implant and they do fine. I do check periodically to make sure they all are still out as I do not want surprise pregnancies. I am keeping notes on how long the implants last for this. I was told one and a half to two years is an average. I'd be careful getting a jill jab on top of the implant as that is basically doubling the chemicals but your vet would know what is safe. My jill that has an implant done in full heat is post about 4 weeks and going though a typical false pregnancy, acting and looking fine.

[Deleted]

That's great, thanks.
I kept them together and kept an eye on them. It took a week for me to see any change in her vulva, it's now shrunken considerably, but still just a little swollen. So she was in full heat when they got in together, but his testicles are fully shrunken and he's shown no interest in anything sexual with her, he just wants to play, so I think we're alright.
Her hormones seem to have settled now, too. It was actually her bugging him for a while there, but they play nicely now and she doesn't follow him around dooking constantly anymore.

What does a false pregnancy look like - if I should expect this is there anything to be aware of that I should/shouldn't worry about?

[nanjferret]

That's great it is all working out. A false pregnancy looks like a real one for the most part. The jill will start to eat more and will go into mommy mode, cleaning, making a special nest area and become very affectionate. She will also loose some of her coat towards the end and end up with a very short sleek one. Her nipples will be pinker towards the end. What you need to watch for is pyometra which is an infection of the uterus. Pick her up each day and feel her abdomen. You can feel the sides of her where her muscle is and feel where the uterus is. Pyo shows as a marked puffyness like a balloon where her uterus is. The problem with Pyo is the jill most times will not act sick until the infection has gotten very bad and if gone too long can kill her. It is difficult for anyone who has never seen/felt Pyo to realize it is there. She will naturally gain some weight anyways . My suggestion is if you have someone you know that has bred and you can take her there for them to do a check say in a month do it or just keep checking and if any doubts take her to your vet to look at. Don't stress! It's just a heads up and most jills do fine with false pregnancy. I'm not sure where you are located (in the states or elsewhere) but feel free to call me if you are unsure of something. I can also talk you through palpating her for a Pyo check. My number is 509-460-9735 Nancy

[Deleted]

Cocoa has been out of heat for 3-4 weeks (I think fully out for about 3 and a half weeks)
She is definitely in mummy mode - very affectionate and following Winston around grooming him all the time
She has put on a little weight, so I may just be worrying over nothing, but I really don't know what to look for with pyo, could someone talk me through palpating her, and exactly what it should feel like? I'd call Nancy but I'm in the Uk..
I've been feeling her abdomen regularly, and while it's felt gradually larger, I assumed from gaining weight, the past couple of days it's also felt quite firm and not as squishy as Winston did with his winter chub. It's not hard, but it's definitely firm.. I can't single this down to one point though, it's kind of the entire stomach area feeling puffy.. Is this pyo? something to worry about? or normal? Should I take her to the vet? What's the usual treatment if it is pyo?

Thanks

[Sherry]

You can also message crazylady. She's in the UK as well.

[Deleted]

Will do, thanks

[crazylady]

message sent lol take care bye for now
Bev

[Sherry]

Thanks Bev