3 protein sources?

[orv420]

I understand variety for enrichment and to keep them (ferrets) open to different food sources, but I don't understand why the rule is 3 protein sources per week. If polecats can live off of 2 protein sources (voles and frogs), with others supplemented randomly via scavenging or luck, then what benefits are obtained by feeding many meat sources per week? It's not something I have a problem doing, it's more to see the logic and facts behind it, hence why I started raw feeding an obligate carnivore. To me, it's just variations of red and white meat.

[Deleted]

Thanks!!

I'll stick around for an answer to that too! I've been wondering, but never really asked...

Or even, I'm also wondering... why not like 4 or 5 sources?

[Heather]

It's the various sub-nutrients you're trying to cover. Variety will make sure that whatever nutrients one protein misses another will pick up. Rabbit is supposedly low in taurine but quail is much higher and duck is higher still...so why not feed all three. You want to give your little ones the best possible diet, not just a diet to get by on. That's what kibble does. A polecat doesn't limit himself to two protein sources, like a cat they are opportunistic hunters. He will eat anything he can get his little paws on. The key food source maybe voles and frogs (you also left out rabbit, which is a key source as well), but you can bet he's eating mice, scavenging fish, eating off carcasses, eating insects, ground worms, eggs, dead birds....the list is endless. If it's protein they're going to eat it. It doesn't take much stretch of the imagination thinking about what these little ones can scrounge up. During the spring you can bet that they will also make short work of any ground birds eggs that they can raid too, and some of the birds that possibly thought they could sit around and protect those eggs. I've watched my guys outside and they will hunt and eat groundsquirrels (chipmunks), mice...they'd eat a squirrel if they could catch them....We had a member who's ferrets hunted birds and were very successful at getting them too (these birds were scavengers who would get into the ferret pen to clean up the meat scraps)
Here's a couple of articles and it states that their diet is extremely varied:
www.bbc.co.uk/manchester/content/articles/2007/06/14/140607_polecat_features.html
www.animalcorner.co.uk/britishwildlife/polecat.html

ciao

[Deleted]

The specifics of diet are not well understood in the scientific community. So a good variety is a way to make sure there is a safety net that covers anything that might not have been discovered to be essential yet

[rebel135]

So true my cat brings home and eats anything he can sink his teeth into and that usally squirael,pigieon,mouse,sparrows,gartersnalkes and the ferret is in there like a dirty shirt

[orv420]

Don't get me wrong, I do understand the need for various nutrients such as Taurine (rabbit does not contain enough to support feline let alone ferret health and turkey contains much more than necessary), but Taurine is only processed as needed by the body, and excess is flushed. I'm just playing devil's advocate in case someone only had access to home bred feeder mice and some scavenged meat from the freezer. Someone brought up water in an emergency situation and this, I believe is just as important.

My cats bring home various animals. The latest was Poop's (don't ask, long story) large rabbit. It took him three days to finish it and he wouldn't eat anything else. All he left were the ears and back feet. I leave dry food out for the cats in case they couldn't catch something, but they are very effective hunters and there's no point in feeding something that will likely go to waste, so why spend unnecessary money? The dogs get meat scraps along with measured amounts of kibble twice a day. Trust me, my animals will not starve or be deficient, but I will still live within my limits.

Edit: Diets depend on geography also. Different prey are available in slightly different areas, but preyed upon by the same predator species. A varied diet is just varied over time, not continuously. Nature isn't McDonalds where you can order what you need, you eat what you can get and survive to produce offsrpring. Nothing more. Deficiencies take time to develop and can be corrected, usually.

[Heather]

Agreed to a point. These are not hunters, these are usually a caged animal and at the mercy of our decisions. You're right, imbalances take time to show up. Ferrets imprint on their food. If you feed nothing but mice you're going to get a sick ferret (by the way taurine will not be a problem with this animal, they have a very high taurine level). We use a 3 protein minimum because to cover a carnivores nutritional bases they require approximately 3 "different" types of proteins. I've seen people try and get by feeding nothing but chicken backs to their dogs....or hamburg. You're feeding kibbles, which supposedly covers their bases so if they chose to only eat one protein it would cover their bases. So, even if you choose to feed only what you can afford or have, you're feeding a "so-called" variety. Tell me something, if you chose to eat only 1 type of meat or veggie how soon would it take for you to get sick or for you body to become "unbalanced"? They allowed small children, babies actually to participate in a test regarding that babies knew exactly what they needed and we as adults messed things up. Guess what...they had to close the test down because eventually all the children gravitated toward one item and eventually it endangered their life. Your cats are hunters, they eat what they catch. It's a varied diet. Why would you give any less to your ferret. You top up but they're not eating one protein, they're eating a varied diet. Yes, your cat ate a rabbit for a couple of days until it was gone or sufficiently disgusting that the dog ate the rest but you can bet he's not going to get another rabbit for a while. Balance over time, but there has to be other proteins if balance is going to be achieved. Ferrets have a poor digestive tract meaning they have to eat multiple small meals during the day. You can feed them nothing but chicken on one day but you really should feed a different protein the next or within a couple of days. Ferrets fixate on a food, so it's far easier to feed multiple proteins in a short period of time. Why 3 because it's a lot better than 2....more is better. If you want to feed 7 do so. I try and feed a different protein daily. I will see if I can find the article about the 3 minimum proteins....it was a study regarding carnivores and necessary diet minimums. Let's face it....3 proteins is an easy attainable dietary achievement. All of us at one time or another have 3 different types of proteins in our freezer....unless you're vegan then you will have to go out an buy for your little ones.
ciao

[Deleted]

Each animal provides a varying degree of different levels of vitamins, minerals, proteins amino acids and such. Also the more variety you feed the less a chance it has to develop an allergy. This paragraph on the back of Eva's wysong ferret Epigen 90 says it well. I tried to take a pic but the tiny letters got blurry. It says "Wysong advises against feeding any one pet food exclusively. Feeding one food fosters the development of ingredient intolerances (allergies) and other health ailments. You would never eat one food exclusively and, neither should your pet."

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[orv420]

Good answers. That was my goal with this thread - to get a decent explanation other than the generic, "they need variety" mantra. This question popped into my head after reading dietary studies of polecats, and reading about Europeans feeding biscuits and cream (if the ferrets didn't survive for an acceptable amount of time, the trend would have been abandoned, yet it prospered) My brother has an 8' red tail boa that eats rats exclusively, Slinky is in excellent health and has been with us for 9 years so far. As far as living off of one food source as a human, I've done it, but not for too long. The ramen noodle diet is quite common and at $0.20 each they are cheap, but offer little other than carbs. As far as the vegan thing - never in a million years. I understand the food chain/pyramid and if you're a vegan, you may as well be prey since all you're doing is breaking a natural cycle and placing yourself just above the providers (where rodents and livestock belong) instead of at the top where a true apex predator (or omnivore with no natural predators) belongs, but that's just my opinion.

My ferrets do eat varied diets - I've got chicken, beef, pork, duck, mice, and will pick up other meats from time to time. I am more careful about their diet than the cats or dogs, since ferrets are dependent on us for everything. The cats only use us for a warm dry place to sleep, and the dogs are scavengers. Since Jan. 6th, all of my ferrets have been on a raw diet. They get their nutritionally balanced soup (paste) for breakfast (heart, liver, kidney, and two meat sources with oils and pumpkin) and bone-in/whole prey meals a few hours later. I took my own path for the switch, using information gained from various web sites. I will stand by my statement that feeder mice and meat scraps will do in a bind, but not long term. Thanks for the discussion, hopefully it helps out others looking for knowledge rather than just answers. Not everyone gets this involved with their pets, some just follow others' examples or do things because it's the "popular" thing to do. Take care.