Hazelrah's Switching Thread/Sunnyberra

[Heather]

Name: Shauna
HF Forum Username: Hazelrah

1. Where did you first learn about natural diets for ferrets?

I heard mention on the ferret.com forum, and one of their threads directed me here

2. Please describe the type of diet you would like assistance in switching your ferret(s) to. Be sure to include if you are interested in feeding whole prey (live or frozen-thawed) and if you are wanting to FULLY switch to a natural diet or PARTIALLY. If you are unsure what kind of diet you want to put your ferrets on, please express that and we can help you find the best type of natural diet for your ferret.

I would like to switch to a full natural diet, but don't have any ideas about specifics

3. Why are you interested in switching your ferrets to a natural diet?

I adore them and want them to be as healthy and happy as possible! Also, I'm concerned about their tendencies towards certain illnesses later in life, and want as much prevention going on as possible.

4. Do you understand that switching your ferret to a natural diet can be a lengthy, arduous process? Its not an overnight switch. It can be a commitment of several weeks or even months. Your HF Mentor will be more then happy to assist you in switchng your ferret(s) to a natural diet, but you need to be equally as commited. If you aren't willing to tough out a potentially lengthy switching process, or if you have major life changes approaching (baby on the way, moving, starting school, getting married/divorced, etc) then it might be a better idea to wait on switching your ferret's diet until you have more time. Are you willing to make the commitment?

Absolutely! My furbabies are my primary time commitment for the foreseeable future.

5. How many ferrets do you currently have? What are their names? Ages? Genders? Do they have any health problems? Are they overweight? Underweight?

I have two ferrets. Oryx is an approx. seven month old female with no health problems (touch wood). As far as I can tell, she is a good weight, slender but doesn't seem thin. Falcor is an approx. four month old male. He is deaf, and I suspect that he has Waardenburg Syndrome. He is a little wobbly and isn't really putting on weight. He has a big belly, but is super scrawny otherwise.

6. What diet do you currently feed your ferrets? (Please include all treats, supplements, etc)

I feed them PVF Ferret Food (the one for young ferrets), olive oil, pumpkin, and small pieces of raw chicken.

7. Have you ever tried to switch your ferrets to a natural diet in the past? If yes, what happened?

I've been giving them small pieces of raw chicken which has been going well, but I don't know where to go from here.

8. What additional information about yourself or your ferrets would you like to share?

Neither of my ferrets appears to be picky at all

9. How often during the week do you have access to a computer?

Daily

10. Please post a picture of each of your ferrets (if possible).


Hi and welcome to the mentoring program. In a little while your mentor (Sunnyberra) will introduce herself and you can get started on a new adventure in natural ferret care and diets. Please remember to post regularly (daily or as per arranged with your mentor) so that your mentor can assist you move along safely in this adventure. If you experience computer difficulties or are going to be away, please notify your mentor and most of all relax and have fun . Your mentor is here to help you on this journey.
ciao

[Deleted]

Hi, I'm Annie (known on here as sunny or sunnyberra ), and I'll be helping you switch your guys to a raw/natural diet. I'm a mentor-in-training, so we're going to have more experienced mentors dropping in and checking on us from time to time, as well.

I'm 24, and a graduate student in school psychology/clinical psychology here in the wonderful state of Virginia. I've been a proud ferrent for almost 6 years, now, and have been feeding raw to my fuzzies for three of those years.

I currently have four ferrets: Pixie, who's a bit over 5 years, now; and then the other three are all two: Yogi, Sian, and Hiko (who, I suspect, has Waardenburg's, as well. He's not deaf, but he has a much different skull formation than my other guys, and he has some neurological issues, too).

I first decided to switch after doing a bit of independent research after Pixie and her brother, Yew, turned two. That was the age I was dreading as a new ferrent - it seemed so scary, as I read more and more about the illnesses that seemed to start cropping up around that age. I decided then to do everything I could to lessen my guys' risk. One of those things was getting them off of kibble and onto a more natural diet.

There are quite a few methods used for switching. For my guys, I decided to disallow kibble. Instead, I offered kibble coated boneless chicken chunks and I would supplement feed meals of baby food every few hours after the initial fasting period (Yew also got soup, made from pureed chicken meat, baby food and olive oil, because he liked it, whereas Pixie didn't).

After a bit of hair pulling, they were both switched completely by the end of a week, and they never looked back. Sadly, Yew's since passed away, and I eventually introduced Yogi (first) and Sian (second) as kits, and both were eating meat chunks the same night I got them. Hiko is my newest, a two year old rescue who had been used to eating sugary treats (gummi bears) and sugary kibble. I treated him the same as the others - gave him kibble-dusted meat chunks, and he started eating them that first night. By his second evening with me, he was completely on raw. By the end of the week, he was eating bone-in. Now, he's a proud raw-eating pro, who occasionally enjoys a frozen/thawed quail or two.

So, it's possible. It might seem tedious or nerve-wracking, but we'll get your guys there, with a method that works for you *and* for them!

Right now, why don't we try them out on soup? Soak some kibble (so that it's mush), puree some boneless chicken breast (this meat tends to be super bland), and add in some kind of treat they like - meat baby food, fish/olive oil, 'tone. Before giving them the soup, make sure kibble's been put away for a couple/few of hours. Leave the soup for an hour or two and see what they do.

If there's no apparent interest, you can try to get them interested by dipping a spoon in and offering or drawing their attention to the soup bowl, but don't really try to force them to eat it.

[hazelrah]

Yay! It's nice to meet you Sunnyberra I'm super excited to start working on this with my guys

They have been eating kibble mush and chicken baby food, I'll try the chicken tomorrow and see what happens Falcor is a chubster and spends all his time eating; he couldn't care less what's in the bowl. I have a feeling that I could set a plate of meat plus bone in front of him and he wouldn't even blink ;D Oryx, on the other hand, has not been eating very much since I started mushing up the kibble. It's been a week now, and she's just now getting used too it

[Deleted]

It's nice to meet you too!

It takes time. In my experience girls tend to be a lot more stubborn (especially when they're older kits or adults). We'll get her there! As for Falcor, I'd be interested to see what *he* does with just a plate of diced chicken breast. If we can skip the soup steps and get into chunks that be great (not necessary, but great ;D). You can even smash kibble (I put about a cup's worth into a ziplock bag and smashed it with a hammer. FUN.) and sprinkle it on the top of the meat to get him (and her, if she wants to) interested.

[hazelrah]

Well, Falcor went for both the soup and the diced chicken no problem I put olive oil on the first bit to get him interested, and everything just went from there. Oryx hasn't been impressed with the kibble mush plus blended chicken. She didn't eat any of it last night, but sneaked a few bites this morning when she thought I Wasn't looking

What ratio is best for the kibble/ pureed chicken mix to convince Oryx to eat it? Also, since Falcor clearly will eat chunks, how should I do meals? Should I be offering both at all times, one at all times and one at meals, or both just as meals?

[Deleted]

It might be extra work, but I'd just offer the meat chunks at every meal, enough for Falcor to feel full (sometimes it's good to give them enough to stash, so they can snack between meals. A transitioning ferret is hungry almost constantly. A transitioning kit can be a BEAST.)

As for Oryx, there's no telling what ratio is best for her. Ideally, SHE'D want you to leave it out altogether, however, I'd keep doing what you're doing, but in smaller portions (that way it's not going to waste if/when she doesn't eat all of it). It'll take awhile, but she's already showing you that she KNOWS she has to eat it, and that's what we need from her.

Sometimes, too, the action of another ferret eating chunks, etc can help the stubborn ferret get more interested in the new foods, too. So Falcor's doing HER a favor as well!

[hazelrah]

Yeah, today was the first time Faclor has eaten only chicken and it seems like he's already devoured his own weight in meat How long do they usually take to stabilize in that respect?

[Deleted]

In general, kits tend to even out around 6-9 months, so he'll probably be around there as well. Right now, his body's going to start detoxing from the kibble, plus he'll want to eat more because chunked meat is soft and easily digestible. For older ferts transitioning (like Oryx, once she's solidly onto soup and meats/bones), she'll go through the same kind of ravenous stage. That takes a few months on average, too. Though some ferts linger in this stage for almost a year (probably because the detoxing is so extreme in certain cases).

Both Pixie and Hiko were two when I switched them, and they had to EAT ALL THE TIME, OMG for about 2 1/2 - 3 months after getting on a balanced raw diet. After that, I was able to schedule their 2x a day meals. Yogi and Sian were babies (12 weeks old and about 7-8 weeks old, respectively) when I switched them, and they were holy terrors with food until they hit the 6 month mark and then they calmed down, although I still had to feed them 3 x a day until they were a year old, and then they settled down into the 2x a day routine, as well.

(I should also add, even Falcor should slow down when you introduce bone. Learning how to manipulate the bone to shear/chew definitely slows them down and gives them time to realize hey, wow, I AM full)

- and since Falcor IS eating the meat, you're going to now have to incorporate powered egg shell or bone meal powder. Generally, the amount is 1/2 tsp per 8 oz of meat.

[hazelrah]

Lol, I think all Falcor's been doing for the last 24 hours straight is eating. Apparently he's right on board with the raw thing. So I should just continue feeding him as he gets hungry for the time being rather than trying for meals? And how do I add in the powdered egg shell? I'm used to mixing things like that into soupies, should I do something like that?

Oryx ate today She did her thing of running up to the bowl and then stopping and looking at me in disgust, but this time she got over it after a minute or so and ate some I was worried she was going to turn into an epic picky eater!

[Deleted]

Right now, you can sprinkle the eggshell over the chunks of meat and then mix it in so that it's distributed somewhat evenly. Although at the rate Falcor's going we'll be introducing a smashed up chicken wing pretty soon!

Yay! Good for Oryx. Hopefully she'll stay on track and we can move her forward as well

[hazelrah]

Ok, awesome. I'll be sure to track down some of that tomorrow to be sure it gets in there. I'm looking forward to seeing how he reacts to bone

[Deleted]

Oh, I realized I forgot to address part of the earlier post: right now, I WOULD continue feeding when he's hungry, if you can, or give him plenty that he has leftovers (meat can stay out for around 8 hours without any problems in an air conditioned home - longer usually than that, too, but 8-10 hrs is the generally accepted max. So there's no reason you COULDN'T provide him with a few meals in one go and leave him to it, if you wanted).

As for the bone - it's whenever you feel comfortable that he's ready to at least be introduced to it. You can cut off the wing tip portion, smash it up to break the bones up a bit, and then cut slits from the center of the wing outward, so that he has a place to sink his teeth in and pull. The drummette portion can be "flowered " - slicing the meat away from the bone so that it hangs off, but is still attached. Granted, he PROBABLY** won't be able to eat the bone or get that much into it, but it's good practice for shearing off meat and just getting acquainted with how to work the jaw and turn the head to access the food.

** some ferrets are hardcore bone eaters, and they will crunch into ANYTHING. Yogi and Sian tend to be this way, and will eat a lot of weight bearing bones consistently, whereas other ferrets tend not to get much nutritional use out of them (still great for stimulation, though).

[hazelrah]

Sorry for not posting yesterday, someone got to my computer cord

As of last night, I would say Oryx is reliably eating her soupies. So I should start adding in some chunks now, right? Should I still puree some chicken and mix it in and then also add some chunks, or only the chunks?

I'm going to try Falcor on his first chicken wing tonight, so we'll see how that goes I'm still shocked my how much he's eating. I hope the bones slow him down a bit, I feel like all I dis yesterday was defrost chicken to keep up, lol.

[Deleted]

Definitely still puree chicken in it. Basically, keep the soup base the same, and add in fingernail thin bits of chicken (or as small as you can). If she'll eat that, we'll adjust the soup (decrease kibble, increase the amount of diced chicken).

[Deleted]

Also, you're fine! I really don't expect every day posting (although I do like it, but schedules can get crazy), but every other day is just as good