|
Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2017 8:47:04 GMT -5
4.09: I'm freaking after googling but Appa doesn't fit the symptoms for ECE. Appa is acting normal and has been. But suddenly yesterday afternoon he started pooing watery like green poo. We have poo pads so I change them a few times a day depending on how much poo happens on the pads due to me having 4 ferrets. So in the AM I saw no green poo, all of it was normal poo. In the late afternoon I changed out some of the poo pads and noticed a few spots of green poo but didn't think anything of it. Once in a while I see odd poo just once but then it's back to normal. Last night while I was changing them out again I noticed more green poo and suddenly Appa comes over and poos right in front of me next to the geeen poo. SO i know for a fact it is him but like I said he's been acting fine. Maybe not eating his hard food as much as he usually does that I noticed just in the last 12 hrs or less of noticing the green poo but that's honestly it. He's been wanting more soft food (his marshall ferret food in some water with some due soup mixed in) but other than that he's drinking more than enough water so he's not dehydrated at all. He's not bledding, acting like he's in any pain, or is awkward when I feel around his tummy. He has always slept more than my other ferrets so that's nothing new. When Appa eats the soft mix of marshall ferret food, his poo is still green but is more chunky like its trying to be solid you know. Appa isnt puking or anything either. Appa is still getting up, bouncing around, curious, climbing around, socializing, etc. all as he normally does. Maybe he's just got a cold or something?! He hasn't ate anything odd. Only thing I can remember is him eating some of the cat food I give my hedgehog about two and a half or three days ago when I was cleaning my hedgehogs cage?! Other than that I can't think what else it could possibly be. My four ferrets all stay in between these two huge bed rooms we have that are ferret proofed of course. Any ideas?! And yes he's been urinating normally too. So theres no blockage or anything like that either.
4.10: Appa has been running a lot more. And eating a lot more. I think I heard him eating his hard marshall ferret food and he's been certainly eating more of his softened marshal ferret food too. I even made sure to feed him it myself to make sure he eats more. I put vitamins in the soft food as well. His poo early this morning around 8/9am were still green and squishy/chunky still but he hasn't went poo yet since. He's definitely being a lot more active then he usually is everyday. He tends to sleep more like I said above but there are days where he's very active..like today. He's been his usual with water still as said above, he aways drinks a lot of water and played in it a bit today so far too.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2017 11:14:34 GMT -5
UPDATE:
Appa just pooped. It was bubbly (gas/excess fiber) I even heard him fart, with some dark green now and a little bit if a yellow chunkiness to it now too. As for the smell, all of his greens poo smells normal, like all his poo usually smells. Still doesn't seem like too much to worry about. I just don't understand why he's not eating his marshal ferret food hard like he always has. Like i said earlier I think I heard him eating it but otherwise he's been eating the softened by water version of his Marshall ferret food.
|
|
|
Post by Heather on Apr 10, 2017 13:03:48 GMT -5
If you're giving him watered or softened food he's going to eat that rather than hard kibbles. Kibbles hurts the mouth and teeth, why eat it hard when you can eat mush instead? Ferrets are lazy eaters, they will eat the easiest thing to eat. Why chew when you don't have to? Green stools usually mean the food is going through the system faster than it's absorbed. If you're leaving moistened kibble around for him to eat it may be he has a minor bacterial infection as kibble is a great breeding ground for bacteria and moistened just attracts more. Other than general information regarding that about kibbles I can't help as I don't feed it and haven't done in so long I've really not much idea about it. If it continues I'd be tempted to take in a fecal to see if bacteria is indeed the issue. If he's having a hard time with dried kibbles I would be looking at his teeth. Kibbles do horrible things to teeth causing serious tartar build ups and gum disease. ciao
|
|
|
Post by LindaM on Apr 10, 2017 13:27:31 GMT -5
Okay, so I'd just like to point a few things out to start off with. Kibble fed ferrets are ALWAYS toeing the line of dehydration. Carnivores, especially obligate carnivores get the moisture they require for their bodies from their food, they are notoriously bad drinkers, and just do not drink enough water in general to stay properly hydrated. Believe me, I kibble fed once, and after making the switch and then comparing new ferrets to already switched ferrets, kibble fed ferrets do not get as much hydration as they need. Secondly, as Heather stated, kibble is awful on their teeth, downright hellish. When kibble-feeding, you need to regularly brush their teeth or plaque and tartar will build up fast, start damaging their teeth and even lead to gingivitis and periodontal disease and if not corrected by a vet, can lead to needing their poor little teethies pulled. Now Marshall's kibble... that is the worst thing of all, I'm sorry to say. While it may say "for ferrets" and "premium" it is pretty much the worst kibble you can feed to ferrets, and in the long run it will surely lead to health problems like insulinoma. Marshall kibbles is more fillers and indigestibles than it is truly meat based. Even higher-end cat kibbles are leagues better than it. If you can, I suggest switching to Orijen cat kibbles, it's much healthier. This chart will show you what are considered good kibbles and which are downright horrible: docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1Ugt4k4JPUw8X-WDsxbbOIBUqIKkTubrkpyba4YsUeEgAn even better diet, to see better coats, healthy white teeth, happy and bouncy ferrets, who poop a lot less and poop much smaller poops that don't really even stink, would be to switch to the species appropriate natural diet for ferrets: Raw. If you're squeamish about feeding raw meat, there are even other easier, but still raw alternatives available (FDR and Commercial Grinds). Though sadly, both of those last two will still require you to brush their teeth regularly. And if you are concerned about switching troubles, you can even sign up for a mentor on here who'll help get your ferrets on a balanced and healthy raw menu. His green and bubbly poops do sound like a possible bacterial infection to me, and I too would be tempted to get a fecal analysis done as he might need antibiotics from the vet to fight it off. Wetting down kibble, especially kibble that just sits out for long durations, can quickly lead to a mess of bacteria. That said, it could also be from something else, like stress.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2017 13:53:43 GMT -5
That's all he ate before is the dry kibble. So stop feeding that to him. I'm sure he's eating then, I'm apparently not seeing it. That's what I was think some how he got maybe a minor bacteria issue but the wet food isn't helping. So I'll stick to dry and feed them quality cat food instead? If it continued for the next few days then yes I'll take Him to the vet of course but at least I'm not to worry too much now. Like I said he's drinking plenty too. Thanks everyone!
What's best to feed ferrets then for suggestions?! Thanks
|
|
|
Post by LindaM on Apr 10, 2017 14:12:23 GMT -5
If you want to stick to feeding kibble, keep in mind about the regularly brushing of their teeth, as well as the fact that insulinoma is a big possibility later in life, even on high-end kibbles. They will always be toeing the line of dehydration, so if they end up with diarrhea, a blockage, or some other illness, you can't play around and wait, you'd need to get them to a vet very soon as they'd be even worse off than a fully hydrated ferret. To learn more about insulinoma, refer to this: holisticferret60.proboards.com/thread/16664/insulinoma-worksAs for kibble feeding, a kibble like Orijen cat food is good, Wysong Digestive isn't bad either (it's the old Epigen 90, the new one causes tummy upsets). Other things to keep in mind is to use more than one specific brand and flavor. This is in case the company stops producing the kibble you use, or change the formula, etc. so your ferret won't stop eating entirely. The best thing to feed your ferrets, is a species appropriate raw diet. Ferrets are obligate carnivores, meaning they are meat eaters and MUST eat meat. Things like fruits, veggies, wheat, etc. are indigestibles and have no role in their diet at all (other than pumpkin when used in the Blockage Protocol or cases of very severe diarrhea). Obligate carnivores thrive on a raw diet, compared to when being kibble fed. My one boy was always sleepy, not up for long nor interested in his toys, but when I changed him over to raw, he was like a whole different ferret. Is there any specific reason you wouldn't want to feed raw compared to doing kibble?
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2017 15:52:04 GMT -5
Ive tried minimally but what should I exactly give them? and if they won't try it, because thats exactly how they are, what do i do to get them to eat it? Honestly i would prefer it. Appa and his brother are a little older and I got from someone who had to give them up. My other two are babies. Around 1 year or a little less than that. So i prefer to switch and asap so I don't have issues nor do I want my animals in pain or to get in because of me feeding them the food they told me to upon buying the two of them the other two i kept giving them the marshal because well, apparently thats what the people before me have been feeding them. Ill keep the recommended hard food above you suggested for emergencies or traveling purposes but otherwise if I can get them all to do the raw thats what I want asap. Especially for the two older ferrets. I noticed their teeth being a bit yellow, fortunately there is noting major but their breath readings yellow teeth and the start of some cavities it looks like. I saw about brushing and was in the midst of getting the necessaries to do so but this raw diet is apparently what they need. So load me up with what i need to do
|
|
|
Post by LindaM on Apr 10, 2017 16:05:36 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2017 16:10:32 GMT -5
Oh girl so much information lol. Im taking so many notes now. Thank you! I'm on it.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2017 16:39:43 GMT -5
As for Appa, he just took another poop, I heard him fart a little but its mostly brown again and whole with a little green squishy around the brown whole poop. Whatever was going on is getting better which I'm glad for. He must of ate something, thats all i can think of. Maybe I dropped a skittle on the floor and he ate it? Im not sure. They don't go outside and all my ferrets are really good when it comes to health. I just need to get them on this raw diet now so they don't get anything major. I'm such a worry bug lol I literally didn't sleep at all last night and was up numerous times checking on him though I knew he was fine due to being active, eating and drinking as normal but still. google was worrying me
|
|
|
Post by LindaM on Apr 10, 2017 16:41:10 GMT -5
If you get stuck on anything or feel you need some clarification on something, feel free to ask and we'll try to answer as best we can. This forum is a great source of information, and help.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2017 16:51:38 GMT -5
Oh yes I will thank you! I have a lot of reading to do and the I'm sure I'll have tons of questions. Hearts for ferrets to consume? You are referring to chicken ones right?
|
|
|
Post by LindaM on Apr 10, 2017 17:27:00 GMT -5
Actually, you can use other hearts too, duck, turkey, beef, pork to name some. Chicken is just easiest for most people to get a hold of, as some grocery stores will carry some, and usually almost ALL Asian markets will carry them.
That's something for you to do too, see if you have some Asian/Ethnic markets or stores in your area and go check them out. They tend to have a great selection of meats you can use for the raw diet, and at affordable prices.
How old are your four fuzzballs? And what genders?
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 12, 2017 17:53:41 GMT -5
I live in key west so theres nothing here but I personally eat chicken hearts a lot due to there being no hunting here to have deer heart so thats great! I will keep it in mind though for new york Two I just adopted a couple months ago from a women who could no longer care for them. She said she thinks they are around 3/4 years old. Both males, Appa and Kratos. My first one was about a year ago, got on the main land of florida in homestead area at a pet store, her name is Coco. Then the second one I got was about 4 months after Coco, bought again from a pet store here in key west, his name is Mocha. So 3 males and 1 female right now. Coco and Mocha are more of a sable mitt. Kratos is very dark, and Appa is more of a white ferret with a mix of dark brown.
|
|
|
Post by LindaM on Apr 12, 2017 19:50:25 GMT -5
Well, there is always online providers of raw too, such as Hare Today, My Pet Carnivore, and Rodentpro. These are pretty good options to order from, so long as you have the freezer space to spare, that way you can do a bulk order which runs cheaper (that and they limit you on a minimum, say like needing to order at least 10lbs before they'll ship out).
So it sounds like 3 over a year old, and one still under a year, yes? When you take to mind how much each ferret eats, you need to take in to account their age, their gender, and seasonal changes. So the following is good to keep in mind:
Kits eat several times the amounts adult ferrets do, an adult male will tend to do around 2-5oz on average per day, and an adult female will eat around 1-3oz on average per day. When ferrets are first starting off with their switch, there may be quite a bit of wastage you need to account for at first, and they will also eat a lot more once they start and then slowly taper it down to the average amounts. Each ferret is different though, so keeping a weight and diet journal will be your best friend, as well as a good little kitchen scale to weigh both them and how much food you portion out to them (how much they get for a meal and how much they've eaten of the meal afterwards). In winter ferrets will eat more and in spring they start eating less again.
Also, kits and sick ferrets (say one that has insulinoma for example) should always have food available to them. Most of us doing a Frankenprey diet (or FDR or Commercial Grinds) feed an AM and a PM meal, the whole prey feeders often will do just a single meal in the day.
Do any of them eat raw eggs or get a dab of salmon oil for a treat?
|
|