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Post by Deleted on Oct 5, 2015 10:07:46 GMT -5
Yesterday i started introducing thr soupie to my ferrets. Spaghetti is 6 y/o with insulinoma. Spaghetti gets 20 ml of canned Hills urgent care, three times a day, with access to kibble all the time. I gave him 20ml of canned food as per usual at 7am, along with his dose of Pred. I took their food away at 9am, and the two boys ate a combined total of 0.7oz of soup at noon. I put their food back at 2pm(a little sooner than i would have liked, but i was worried about keeping food away from spaghetti). At 4:30pm, I found Spaghetti with a slight prolapse(about 2mm out). Spaghetti has had quite soft poops since we started supplementing his diet with the canned food. The vet is aware of his softer poops. I took him to the emergency vet. By the time we got there, the prolapse had retracted. I told the vet about the diet switch. He said it could be that the new diet doesn't have enough dietary fibres, so he's having to strain to poop. Am i correct in thinking that with how little he got, and the fact that he had his regular diet, that that is probablu not the cause? Also, he's now having small(in quantity, not circumference) poop with a some stringy mucous. He's having prolapses every time, but less so than the initial one. Should i be holding off on giving him more soup until this is treated? Any other ideas as to the cause? TIA
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Post by Sherry on Oct 5, 2015 13:05:56 GMT -5
answered on facebook, but just add another 1/4 tsp eggshell powder to help firm the stools up
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Post by Deleted on Oct 5, 2015 13:41:07 GMT -5
answered on facebook, but just add another 1/4 tsp eggshell powder to help firm the stools up Thanks Sherry. Is that another 1/4 tsp per recipe? I have already frozen the soupie in ice cube trays. They're about 1oz cubes.
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Post by raynebc on Oct 5, 2015 14:14:12 GMT -5
It would be 1/4 tsp per soup batch (ie. 10oz of soup). If you feed several cubes at once in a meal you could try to measure a small amount, otherwise you may have to make do with approximations or just add a "pinch" of eggshell/bonemeal to individual cubes.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 5, 2015 14:33:10 GMT -5
It would be 1/4 tsp per soup batch (ie. 10oz of soup). If you feed several cubes at once in a meal you could try to measure a small amount, otherwise you may have to make do with approximations or just add a "pinch" of eggshell/bonemeal to individual cubes. Allow me to make one small correction. It should be 1/2 tsp to 3/4 tsp for each 8 ounces of chicken meat. Add in the heart and liver and you have about 10 ounces of meat, like Raynebc said. @nikkita969 is already at 1/2 tsp so we have suggested going up a bit. Speaking of that, Nikkita I have noticed that you mentioned feeding wet canned food. What brand are you using? I'm wondering if Spaghetti might have either an allergy or intolerance to chicken or possibly that canned food is high in oil and Spaghetti is simply getting far too much oil which would lead to very loose poops.
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Post by Sherry on Oct 5, 2015 16:10:51 GMT -5
That is also possible Steph- I'd not thought of that.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 6, 2015 11:09:36 GMT -5
Poncesmom, The canned food is Hill's a/d Urgent care. The vet told me to supplement his diet with it when he was first diagnosed with insulinoma because he easn't eating enough kibble on his own. I took him back to the vet last night. He prolapsed again and worse. I brought in a fecal sample. She sent me home with some meds(can't remember the name off the top of my head) to help with the diatrhea. She called me last night after looking at the fecal sample, and he has an overload of cocci bacteria. I will be picking up another medication(Baytril) to use with the other one. I suspect he's had this for some time now, as his poops have been soft since he stsrted getting the canned food. I told the other vet that his poops were soft every time i saw her, and she chalked it up to the added water from the canned food. I've read that stress of diet change can trigger coccidia, so perhaps that's what happened. I just hope the meds help him fast. My poor boy feels so yucky
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Post by bitbyter on Oct 6, 2015 11:27:21 GMT -5
BTW @nikkita969 Coccidia is a parasite, not a bacteria. It is usually spread via fecal contamination but there are other possible sources such as eating dirt or certain insects. It usually responds well to meds.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 6, 2015 18:12:01 GMT -5
Poncesmom, The canned food is Hill's a/d Urgent care. The vet told me to supplement his diet with it when he was first diagnosed with insulinoma because he easn't eating enough kibble on his own. I took him back to the vet last night. He prolapsed again and worse. I brought in a fecal sample. She sent me home with some meds(can't remember the name off the top of my head) to help with the diatrhea. She called me last night after looking at the fecal sample, and he has an overload of cocci bacteria. I will be picking up another medication(Baytril) to use with the other one. I suspect he's had this for some time now, as his poops have been soft since he stsrted getting the canned food. I told the other vet that his poops were soft every time i saw her, and she chalked it up to the added water from the canned food. I've read that stress of diet change can trigger coccidia, so perhaps that's what happened. I just hope the meds help him fast. My poor boy feels so yucky This is what I found for ingredients on Hill's a/d Urgent care. Is this the product? www.hillspet.com/products/pd-feline-ad-caninefeline-critical-care-canned.htmlWater, Pork Liver, Poultry Liver, Chicken, Corn Flour, Pork Protein Isolate, Fish Oil, Chicken Liver Flavor, Calcium Carbonate, Sodium Tripolyphosphate, Guar Gum, Potassium Chloride, Taurine, Choline Chloride, Vitamin E Supplement, Magnesium Oxide, Ascorbic Acid (source of Vitamin C), Zinc Oxide, Ferrous Sulfate, Thiamine Mononitrate, Beta Carotene, Manganous Oxide, Copper Sulfate, Niacin, Calcium Pantothenate, Vitamin B12 Supplement, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride, Riboflavin, Vitamin D3 Supplement, Biotin, Calcium Iodate, Sodium Selenite, Folic Acid.
In the ingredient list, after water then comes pork liver, poultry liver, chicken (okay) corn flour (not okay and can lead to digestive distress) followed by fish oil, chicken liver flavor and then the added vitamins and nutrients. That looks very high in liver and oil to me and I would think would be very rich and also way too much liver. Liver is fat soluable and remains in their systems. Aside from giving them very loose poops, Liver is full of Vitamin A and too much can build up to toxic levels with a host of side effects. I'm taggin at Sherry for her opinion. I think your problem may lay in this product not agreeing with your boy's tummy.
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Post by Sherry on Oct 6, 2015 18:54:35 GMT -5
That is one heck of a lot of liver! As a supplement if you really need to it would be okay, but not as a main part of the diet. I would try cutting it out, or at least cutting it back a LOT and see what difference it makes. One of the ways on raw you can tell if you are feeding too much liver is the stools are loose and blackish
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Post by Deleted on Oct 7, 2015 8:33:33 GMT -5
Yes that is the food. I have send my vet the information and suggested i switch hin to carnivore care due to the high level of liver in the Hill's A/D Urgent Care. This all makes me very sad. I also asked to switch the Metronidazole they have him on. He really hates it, and upon ready another post on the forum about how much stress it can cause for them, i am very concerned about ulcers. Especially since he's already predisposed to them by being on Prednisolone.
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Post by Sherry on Oct 7, 2015 10:42:47 GMT -5
Good luck, and hoping your vet listens.
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