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Post by Deleted on Apr 4, 2014 9:37:11 GMT -5
Good Morning (wave)
No complaints with my oldest three. Everyone is eating well and eats whatever I put in front of them. Mika is still being picky. Tuesday, I heard some rustling noise under the couch and when I checked it out, I found Mika and a big stash of food. So, that may help explain her apparent lack of hunger. She will accept little pieces of food with bone, when I offer it to her, on my lap. Today, we are doing chicken drummettes and I know that she likes chicken. So we will see how she does. Her energy level is high. Thru out the winter, she seemed to sleep more than the rest of the others. Now, she is up and playing thru out the day. Yesterday, she even cuddled on my lap for awhile. I don't know if she is more active because it's spring or if it's because of the new diet.
I know how crazy these next few weeks will be for you. Don't worry about me, I'll keep posting and will update the googlechart at the end of the week.
:thankyou: Stef
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Post by katt on Apr 4, 2014 11:25:39 GMT -5
Mika and Wynstan went for a walk. It was Mika's first walk and she loved it. She was fearless and wanted to go everywhere. Wynstan is all about burrowing under the leaves. When we came back inside, Mika sat by the door for quite awhile.Aw, sounds fun! I can't wait to have time for summer walks with my boys. A body part that secretes is considered an Organ, right? I found several references that called the tongue an organ, because it is comprised of two tissues. But, for our purposes, we consider only parts that secrete, right? Paul wondered if the penis, like those goat penis's (?) that we saw on FB are an organ. www.holisticferret60.proboards.com/thread/13628/defines-nutritional-organ-meatWhen we refer to "organs" here, we mean secreting organs. See link above. Testicles are a secreting organ, but the penis is not. RE tongue having two tissues...just about every single part of your body has multiple types of tissue except perhaps cartilage. Bone for example contains hard bone, fat, blood, immune cells. Muscle has muscle cells and connective tissue and vasculature. etc. Now based on the secreting organs definition, lungs wouldn't be an organ as far as diet is concerned. But if you ever find lung it is super good to feed - just mix it into their organ meals but make sure it is less than half and isn't taking up too much of the "other organ" category. Hope that makes sense.
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Post by katt on Apr 4, 2014 11:30:34 GMT -5
No complaints with my oldest three. Everyone is eating well and eats whatever I put in front of them. Mika is still being picky. Tuesday, I heard some rustling noise under the couch and when I checked it out, I found Mika and a big stash of food. So, that may help explain her apparent lack of hunger. Rotten girl! I'm not surprised, but glad she is eating. Definitely clear out the stashes and keep working on hand feeding Mika - or should I say the Royal Princess - the bone gravy until she decided to chew the bits. She will accept little pieces of food with bone, when I offer it to her, on my lap. Today, we are doing chicken drummettes and I know that she likes chicken. So we will see how she does. Her energy level is high. Thru out the winter, she seemed to sleep more than the rest of the others. Now, she is up and playing thru out the day. Yesterday, she even cuddled on my lap for awhile. I don't know if she is more active because it's spring or if it's because of the new diet/It could be a combination of the 2. Let me know how chicken goes, maybe she will take to that better. I know how crazy these next few weeks will be for you. Don't worry about me, I'll keep posting and will update the googlechart at the end of the week.Yep - 5 weeks. It's not enough. I'm ready for summer but I need more time! One of those weeks is finals so that leaves 4 weeks to learn everything. Ahhh! *breathes into paper bag*
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Post by katt on Apr 5, 2014 23:27:00 GMT -5
Just popping in (wave)
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Post by Deleted on Apr 6, 2014 9:39:06 GMT -5
Good Morning (wave) Everything is going well. My menu plan called for turkey wings on Saturday, but I couldn't find any at the grocery store. We did chicken instead. I made up two plates, one with soup and one just pounded chicken. Everyone loves the soup and will eat it like crazy. I put chunks of chicken and gizzards in it and it was finished quickly. I made about 8 ounces of soup. I also put out a plate of chicken chunks/heart hunks and chunks of liver. Wynstan will eat anything in front of him, bones and all. Roamy eats a little more delicately, but will also eat anything that I offer him. Juliet loves,loves,loves soup. When she comes across a chunk, she runs off with it. But, she does eat it and then comes back for more. Mika is still my holdout on bones. She does love soup and loves having me hold her and feed her on my lap. She will accept chicken with crushed bones, but doesn't willingly go to the bowl and eat on her own. I left a bowl of chicken and crushed bones, next to their bed and it was almost all gone in the morning. Tomorrow, I will weigh everyone and post my feeding chart.
I bought the Divergent book, and should begin reading it, this week.
I hope you get to relax today and enjoy your Sunday. :thankyou: Stef
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Post by katt on Apr 6, 2014 14:37:57 GMT -5
Everything is going well. My menu plan called for turkey wings on Saturday, but I couldn't find any at the grocery store. We did chicken instead. I made up two plates, one with soup and one just pounded chicken. Everyone loves the soup and will eat it like crazy. I put chunks of chicken and gizzards in it and it was finished quickly. I made about 8 ounces of soup. I also put out a plate of chicken chunks/heart hunks and chunks of liver. Wynstan will eat anything in front of him, bones and all.Go Wynstan! Show them how it's done! (dance) And go mommy for being adaptable! lol Roamy eats a little more delicately, but will also eat anything that I offer him.
Bones and all? Good boy. Juliet loves,loves,loves soup. When she comes across a chunk, she runs off with it. But, she does eat it and then comes back for more.Is she eating the bones okay too? Mika is still my holdout on bones. She does love soup and loves having me hold her and feed her on my lap. She will accept chicken with crushed bones, but doesn't willingly go to the bowl and eat on her own.Keep hand feeding the bones, and work on increasing the bone size for all of them. You can also work on hand feeding in lap, move fingers towards spoon, spoon feed in lap, move spoon towards bowl, put bowl on floor, put ferret on floor in front of you instead of on lap but with your hands still on her, then without hands, etc etc. Gradual weaning. I left a bowl of chicken and crushed bones, next to their bed and it was almost all gone in the morning. Tomorrow, I will weigh everyone and post my feeding chart.I bought the Divergent book, and should begin reading it, this week. Ooo yay! I enjoyed it! I am looking forward to seeing the movie when we have time.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 6, 2014 18:41:32 GMT -5
Good Evening (wave) I just wanted to pop in and say that I had a little more luck with Mika and bones, tonight. I crushed a chicken wing up into small pieces, then I woke Mika up and hand fed her some pieces. She ate them all, about five generous pieces. After she was full, she tried to stash some and I let her stash a piece and then fed her some more. Then we went for a walk. They seem to eat better, if I offer the same meal for two or three days. It's like they get used to it and start to enjoy it. Tomorrow we will have pork, and I can test this theory and see if they like pork again, as much as they did last week. We know they like any chicken, they will eat hearts and liver, love gizzards, they have tried beef, they loved pork last week, and will eat CGH and turkey. So, I think we've made some progress. It's a bone thing now! :thankyou: Stef
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Post by katt on Apr 6, 2014 23:33:32 GMT -5
That is great! Keep it up, she'll get there They have great protein variety, but more is always better so don't hesitate if you see some new and interesting meats at the store to pick some up. How are they doing on organ chunks?
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Post by Deleted on Apr 7, 2014 9:48:39 GMT -5
Good Morning (wave)
How are they doing on organ chunks?[/b]
No one is crazy about hearts or liver, on its own. Since I followed the menu plan, they only had one and a half meals of organs, last week. It seems like they need to have something new, several meals in a row, before they really accept it well. Should I try some organs, for two or three days in a row?
This morning was pork and everyone ate a few pieces. No reluctance, so I consider Pork has been officially accepted. It was a boneless pork chop, so I'll make sure that there is bone in meat tonight.
I will also weigh everyone today and post the google chart with this weeks menu plan.
:thankyou: Stef
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Post by katt on Apr 8, 2014 1:51:03 GMT -5
No one is crazy about hearts or liver, on its own. Since I followed the menu plan, they only had one and a half meals of organs, last week. It seems like they need to have something new, several meals in a row, before they really accept it well. Should I try some organs, for two or three days in a row?Hmmm well the issue with that is poops. If you wanted to give that a try, you could do a daily organ snack so it isn't a full meal. It would be tricky trying to catch them when they are hungry. Some people just keep the organs as a soup since some don't like the texture of organs. It's more convenient to not have to blend up all of the organ mixes IMO, but there's nothing wrong with keeping organs in soup form either. It's up to you really. Hearts they should probably eat whole though, heart is similar to skeletal muscle meat so it is probably more a taste thing than a texture issue. This morning was pork and everyone ate a few pieces. No reluctance, so I consider Pork has been officially accepted. It was a boneless pork chop, so I'll make sure that there is bone in meat tonight.Good fuzz! They are making great progress. I will also weigh everyone today and post the google chart with this weeks menu plan.I wish there was an easier way to look @ the chart on my phone. I need to just pin it as a tab on my comp. Then I can refresh it and check it whenever I check the thread. BTW - do you have text messaging?
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Post by Deleted on Apr 8, 2014 8:31:13 GMT -5
Good Morning (wave) I wish there was an easier way to look @ the chart on my phone. I need to just pin it as a tab on my comp. Then I can refresh it and check it whenever I check the thread.
BTW - do you have text messaging?
No, Text Messaging here. We have very little cell or wireless capability in this little town. When we moved here, I lost my cell phone and can't connect my Kindle to any wireless. I thought the chart was easier for you, if it's not, I can try posting the chart here (without the link). If there is nothing wrong with using organs as a soup, I would love to do that. Mine all love soup and eat alot of it. That makes me very happy. Yesterday, we worked on bone with crushed chicken wings. Everyone ate some and of course, Wynstan ate the most. Even Mika ate quite well. I took duck wings out for today. We played a foraging game yesterday. I cut several dried turkey hearts into little pieces and hid them under blankets, tubes, boxes etc... Juliet and Wynstan enjoyed searching for pieces, and they both love the dried heart pieces. Since the fresh hearts aren't as popular, it must be a texture thing. I haven't built this weeks menu yet, but I will do that a little later. :thankyou: Stef
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Post by Deleted on Apr 8, 2014 9:51:25 GMT -5
Wynstan and I just spent some time in the kitchen, setting up this weeks menu. Wynstan was very helpful and approved all of my menu. He even taste tested the liver from our roast chicken dinner tonight.
I'll just write out the menu, and wait and see what you say about the google chart. If this way is easier, I'll just write it out weekly.
Mon: a.m. CB was chicken wings p.m. CB was chicken wings
Tues: a.m. MM gizzards p.m. CB quail
Wed: Organs pork kidney/pork heart Question? is it okay to have this meal, a.m. and p.m.?
Thurs: a.m. MM beef strip steak p.m. CB beef marrow and chicken wings
Fri: a.m. CB quail p.m. CB quail
Sat: a.m. MM pork p.m. CB pork riblets
Sun: a.m. duck hearts p.m. chicken necks
Another question. I'm a little confused about beef. Everyone really liked the beef sirloin, but I'm not sure what beef falls under, muscle meat or bone in? Beef bones are too large and so I guess, beef is muscle meat? What is the best cut of beef for our purposes?
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Post by katt on Apr 9, 2014 3:52:02 GMT -5
No, Text Messaging here. We have very little cell or wireless capability in this little town. When we moved here, I lost my cell phone and can't connect my Kindle to any wireless. Bummer! I have become so dependent on my phone. lol It's pretty bad really. :/ I thought the chart was easier for you, if it's not, I can try posting the chart here (without the link).Um really anything that lets me see the whole week at once is nice. It's really whatever is easiest for you. MY issue is I closed the tab and just need to go back a page to reopen the link, but I have been mostly on my phone the last week. If there is nothing wrong with using organs as a soup, I would love to do that. Mine all love soup and eat alot of it. That makes me very happy.Soup's just fine for organs. lol I would like to see them eating chunks for hearts though. You can do half a meal of heart-soup with the organ soup if you like, but I'd prefer to see them get to chunks for the full heart meal. Don't cave to their pickiness, they WILL come around! Soup is great for them to recognize, but chunks are important for their teeth. Yesterday, we worked on bone with crushed chicken wings. Everyone ate some and of course, Wynstan ate the most. Even Mika ate quite well. I took duck wings out for today.(dance) Good fuzz! Keep it up Mika! I wonder if her objection was more to the Quail than to the bones. Let me know how Duck goes... We played a foraging game yesterday. I cut several dried turkey hearts into little pieces and hid them under blankets, tubes, boxes etc... Juliet and Wynstan enjoyed searching for pieces, and they both love the dried heart pieces. Since the fresh hearts aren't as popular, it must be a texture thing.Oooo sounds like fun! Yes, it probably is texture thing. Will discuss heart in my reply to your menu.
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Post by katt on Apr 9, 2014 4:08:21 GMT -5
Wynstan and I just spent some time in the kitchen, setting up this weeks menu. Wynstan was very helpful and approved all of my menu. He even taste tested the liver from our roast chicken dinner tonight.Oh what a good little helper! I'll just write out the menu, and wait and see what you say about the google chart. If this way is easier, I'll just write it out weekly.Either or. Google is nice bc then we have a running tally so to speak. Forum posts let me do my copy/paste type reply. It's entirely up to you. Mon: a.m. CB was chicken wings p.m. CB was chicken wings
Tues: a.m. MM gizzards p.m. CB quail
Wed: Organs pork kidney/pork heart Question? is it okay to have this meal, a.m. and p.m.?
Thurs: a.m. MM beef strip steak p.m. CB beef marrow and chicken wings
Fri: a.m. CB quail p.m. CB quail
Sat: a.m. MM pork p.m. CB pork riblets
Sun: a.m. duck hearts p.m. chicken necksBone looks good, watch poops and adjust as needed. RE the Wed Organ meals, not really the way you have it set up. First of all, their organs should be at least half liver so kidneys and heart are good, but they need the liver in there. The other thing is doing that would actually put you up to 2 full meal equivalents of heart instead of 1.5 WHICH IS PERFECTLY FINE. [You can't really overdo hearts (as long as everything else is still balanced and poops are good etc obviously). There is absolutely nothing wrong with 2 meals of heart though - I'd rather see that than one honestly.] BUT then you only have 1 meal of organs (2 half meals of soup) when they should ideally get 1.5 meals a week. The other big issue is liver. Could you perhaps make the soup 1/2 liver, 1/2 kidney (and/or brains or other variety of non-liver organs) and feed that for one meal Wed, then the second meal Wed could be half soup and half heart slivers. This would be a good way to start to intro heart chunks too. And it would put you at exactly 1.5 meals heart, 1.5 meals organ (half liver, half other). I hope this is making sense. It's late, so I'm sorry if I'm being confusing. lol Soupies btw can be frozen in ice cube tray and stored in baggies. Then you can thaw however many cubes are needed. So you could grab 2 organ mix soup cubes to thaw and 2 blended heart cubes (or equivalent of slivers, chunks, whole hearts, whatever) for one meal, and 4 organ soup cubes for the other. Another question. I'm a little confused about beef. Everyone really liked the beef sirloin, but I'm not sure what beef falls under, muscle meat or bone in? Beef bones are too large and so I guess, beef is muscle meat? What is the best cut of beef for our purposes?Any meat that isn't organ or heart is pretty much muscle. Bone only counts if they eat a significant amount of the bones. So say pork riblets - if they eat them it can count as a bone meal, if not then it's only a muscle meal. Beef is purely muscle. Any cut is fine really. Steak sirloin, T-bones, stew cubes, ground hamburger meat, butcher scrap cuts.... As long as it is raw, unseasoned, unprocessed, and unpreserved they can eat it. Fatty cuts tend to be cheaper, and fat's good for ferrets bc they use it for energy and it helps balance out how lean the poultry meals are. So to review the balance they need every week: 1.5 meals heart 1.5 meals organ (half liver, half other organs) 7-9 meals containing significant amounts of edible bone leaving 2-4 meals for boneless muscle meats (beef, pork, etc). You can also take something like beef (boneless) and toss in some chickens feet (basically bones with no meat on them) to create a "bone-in" meal. Mix and match! Let me know if that all makes sense. Don't hesitate to ask for clarification, or to tell me I'm speaking nonsense!
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Post by katt on Apr 9, 2014 4:09:28 GMT -5
Just found the google doc and pinned it to my tabs so I won't lose it BTW. Love the notes.
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