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Post by bitbyter on Oct 18, 2012 17:40:54 GMT -5
Her prolapse is definitely back. I'm going to try and get my vet / uncle on the phone tonight to determine when I can bring her in. As for splitting the organs sure I can do that but the one thing that is frustrating me with the raw feeding is how do I ensure they are eating a balanced diet? Last night I gave them one liver and 4 hearts minced and mixed with two chopped up chicken wings.
I can easily picture Wilma licking all the organs off of the wing chunks until she is full before she would tackle the chunks because she is such a lazy eater. I can only give them a balanced selection, I can't control what they choose to eat off of the plate.
Also, I am pretty much convinced at this point that her bum issues aren't something that is going to be fixed by medication. Even when they have only been eating bone in meals for a few meals or when they were on kibble her bum didn't look like Socks (again the only example I can think of is an innie bellybutton vs and outie).
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Post by Sherry on Oct 18, 2012 18:29:20 GMT -5
Okay, I thought they were still eating each in their own den. Only other way I can think of it is giving Socks her liver separately, that way there wouldn't be anything else for Wilma to lick off. That way, you could give Wilma a tiny bit of liver daily as a separate treat? Honestly, I don't know if this will work for you or not. One other idea is giving Wilma a liver/heart soup 2-3 times a week with a tablespoon of pumpkin mixed in, along with the eggshell. I'm just throwing out ideas here to see if one of them may work for you as well as for Wilma. Let me know if they will or won't work.
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Post by bitbyter on Oct 18, 2012 18:33:47 GMT -5
At this point I'm going to see what the vet says about her bum and go from there. I really don't think this is something that can be resolved by careful choices of food and medication. Socks has had no trouble at all with what they are being fed. I think Wilma's prolapse is something that is going to have be to dealt with surgically (most likely a purse string).
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Post by Sherry on Oct 18, 2012 18:35:54 GMT -5
Understandable. Lucrezia's was solved simply by more bone. But diet tweaking certainly doesn't work for all of them.
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Post by bitbyter on Oct 18, 2012 18:43:21 GMT -5
Pretty much every meal I give them was bone in and when I give them organs there is so much pumpkin and eggshell mixed in Socks poops are almost totally red/orange and look like they have confetti mixed in. Wilma's look similar but are rarely solidly formed. I think the only thing that gave shape to Wilma's stools while there were on kibble was the fact that they food was so dry. On raw due to the moisture difference and her bum being so loose the poop rarely has much shape to it. Even when her bum is "good" it never really totally "pulls in" if you get my meaning. As a matter of fact this outie belly button looks exactly like her bum when it is "good / normal". When it is bad it sticks out significantly and swells up (you've seen the pictures of that).
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Post by Sherry on Oct 18, 2012 18:47:21 GMT -5
I do understand what you are talking about with her "outie". Oh well, evidently the pumpkin eggshell isn't going to solve anything
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Post by bitbyter on Oct 18, 2012 18:53:00 GMT -5
No at this point I don't think it is. I'll keep you updated.
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Post by bitbyter on Oct 19, 2012 6:53:03 GMT -5
Sigh...this is so frustrating but also good news. Wilma's bum is back to normal again. Also, I think the winter weight gain may have started. There have been no leftovers for the last 3 meals in a row and last nights meal with 2 rat pups + Bone In Chicken + gizzards. The only thing left was half a rat head. Everything else had been eaten!! I'm going to given them rat pup again this morning to see how it goes.
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Post by Sherry on Oct 19, 2012 8:38:03 GMT -5
Good news on all fronts
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Post by bitbyter on Oct 19, 2012 18:56:17 GMT -5
So there are a few leftovers from this morning but it is a equal ratio of chicken and rat pup. At this stage I think they have accepted mice and rat pups. I'm going to try them on guinea pig tomorrow. If they regularly have whole prey in their weekly menu will that cover their organ needs?
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Post by Sherry on Oct 19, 2012 19:12:49 GMT -5
Only if it makes up a minimum of about 10 meals a week. Even feeding 7 meals if commercial raw I still give a half ration of organ meats.
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Post by bitbyter on Oct 20, 2012 12:26:56 GMT -5
So this morning I went to that meat wholesale / packing place I discovered last week. I purchased: 5 kg of Turkey Necks 5 kg of Chicken Backs & Necks 5 kg of Chicken Wings 16 Retail Quail at a great price ($8.99 for 8, about $2 cheaper than anywhere else I've found so far) 2 kg of Pig Tails (going to try these and see what they think) They have chicken hearts sold separately from the gizzards (what they were calling giblets I was hoping they were all the other organs from the chicken). They also have just about everything else you could imagine meat and offal wise. I'm going to be purchasing from them regularly now. So for there organs I am going to continue with Whole Prey (mice, rat pups, guinea pigs, baby chicks, baby rabbits), Chicken Liver and Chicken Hearts. Should I be looking for any other types of organs to make sure they are getting everything they need nutritionally or will the above cover it?
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Post by Sherry on Oct 20, 2012 12:31:37 GMT -5
If you find something else, great. If not, I'd not worry a great deal about it.
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Post by bitbyter on Oct 22, 2012 22:12:04 GMT -5
So, how to I graduate to "Raw Feeder" status? I think I am happy with where they currently are. They are eating whole prey, bone in meats (still have to try them on pig tails), ground meats and I am including a small amount of minced organs in every other meal if it doesn't include whole prey. But I don't think I have much more to do than maybe expand the range of whole prey they are will to accept.
I may occasionally update this thread with their weights just to let you know how they are doing but I think I'm happy with where they are at with their diet.
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Post by Sherry on Oct 22, 2012 22:17:06 GMT -5
What I need you to do is post a formal menu and we'll tweak it if need be
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