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Post by crazylady on Aug 26, 2015 17:49:15 GMT -5
Heather is correct Russia, Poland, Budapest chec republic and I have seen black selfs in Denmark ( to be honest the black self ( mink x polecat) is popping up all over the world Norway I have even heard of a couple of breeders in England the problem is adding it into the gene pool could cause huge problems due to there life span it could reduce the health of the true ferrets is it worth it for a nice colour in my eyes no why fix something that wasn't broken for cosmetic reasons colour can be added by careful breeding there is no need to take a short cut that results in an early death take care bye for now Bev
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Post by katt on Aug 26, 2015 22:31:23 GMT -5
Bev do you by chance have any pics of these "Dalmatian ferret" mink hybrids? Google search only pulls up pictures of Nemo. lol
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Post by Deleted on Aug 27, 2015 4:59:18 GMT -5
Crazylady: What? Are all black self-ferrets related to mink-ferret-hybrids?
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Post by crazylady on Aug 27, 2015 12:49:11 GMT -5
Sorry katt I don't have any pics (I was too busy judging lol ) as to your question riot ferret yes all black self come from a ferret mink hybrid I was judging a show in Denmark ( I wont embarrass anyone by mentioning names ) and a number where entered in the show at first arguments of no no mink in them where thrown at me when I pointed out obvious markers I was given a simple shake of the head after the show a big breeder over in Denmark ( who like I say I wont mention ) came to me and admitted yes I was right but it was 2nd generation from mink and wanted to ask questions I think she was simply surprised I could pick out what carried mink blood and what did not lol it does get embarrassing when you have been around the block as many times as I have lol I have even been to shows abroad and picked out English ferrets at shows ( no connection to me ) I guess I am used to the size of English skulls lol take care bye for now Bev
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Post by Celene on Aug 27, 2015 13:37:53 GMT -5
katt, here are some photos I found whilst googling Apparently "domestic mink" - bred in Russia and imported to the US as a pet. No information on whether it is a ferret hybrid or not, but very spotted! Most of the other information I could find was on dark coloured hybrids, apparently known as Khonorik (although wikipedia states that the word actually refers to an EU polecat/mink hybrid).
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Post by lyles on Aug 27, 2015 14:07:06 GMT -5
Very pretty!
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Post by Deleted on Aug 27, 2015 14:07:57 GMT -5
Those minks are clearly american mink aka the one kind of mink that's not compatible with ferrets. The khonorik are ferret mixed with european mink that looks less like a american mink and more like a ferret. But what I can't find is european mink that has "fancy" colors like american mink. Since the eu-mink is wild and not breed for it's fur, I can't find a connection between the spotted ferrets and eu-mink. I can however believe that the eu-mink can eventually have been bred with ferrets and thus creating a black self-ferret. But i'm not ruling the inbreeding out either, Iv'e seen some sorry excuses for ferrets that's been black-self.If they where a mix with eu-mink wouldn't they look...healthier and not all inbred and wrong?
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Post by Celene on Aug 27, 2015 15:37:06 GMT -5
I think ferret x EU mink is the quickest route to a black self, but I also have heard of one or two breeders who have created black selfs through inbreeding (similar to angoras). crazylady, do you happen to know what type of mink they use to crossbreed to get dalmatians? When I tried looking up more information on the topic I ended up finding a youtube video of a hob "mounting" a female cat.
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Post by crazylady on Aug 28, 2015 13:13:47 GMT -5
Hi they can easily cross an albino ferret ( mother ) with an Eu spotted mink (father) to get the so called dalmatians remember each kit is given 50% genetic make up from each parent so in a litter of say 6 two or three may take after the fathers colouration but have more of the mothers appearance in head and body shape ( most cross mink ferret end up with smaller pointier heads ) not flat and short like 100% mink ) and there eyes appear small and beady the coat is also tight and short ( like a minks waterproofing ) and in some cases there is slight webbing between the toes to create the black self mink must be in the line at some point they simply inbreed to keep it in the line or they would breed it out over future generations and thus loose the black self appearance because with each breeding the original line would recede in too the background weakening it until it was completely bred out resulting in a normal ferret for example if I wanted to keep a line I would breed mum A polecat to dad B mink ( 50% poley 50% mink ) one of those kits then went to a poley her kits contain 75% poley 25%mink ( overall appearance of ferret but darkness of mink ) now to retain the darkness of the mink I would have to go back to a mink with a kit from this litter or even put a kit to the grandfather a lot of line breeders do not go out this far they often return back into the line a lot earlier sorry its hard to explain lol its like with angoras they are often bred but raised by ferrets ( because angoras cannot nurse and often a lot of angora mothers are lost during pregnancy and delivery maybe nature is trying to tell us something )some angora breeders use a ferret mom to an angora dad and call the resulting kits angora ( 50% 50% splits they think then by breeding one of these to a male angora they then have a pure angora wrong the resulting kits would then be 75% angora still carrying 25% domesticated now if you say well they can put in angora again they still have not reached there goal because 12 1/2% domesticated ferret would still be carried forward and so on until your back to the reason why you had to put in the domesticated ferret in the first place ! the craving for colours can cause no amount of problems I love what nature designed why mess with it ?each colour is adorable for its personality coat colour counts for nothing if it results in a ferret being passed on genetic defects just to look nice hope this helps take care bye for now Bev
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Post by Deleted on Aug 28, 2015 19:57:58 GMT -5
I will have to photo my Jace because he is a Marked White ferret and he has a stripe buts it's spotty all along his back and a tiny spot on his head. He is very beautiful.
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Post by crazylady on Aug 29, 2015 13:39:55 GMT -5
Hi you can get marked white ferrets often these are simply ferrets who have a little silver mixed with albino ( more albino than silver ) resulting in specks of colour here and there ( classed as any other colour or a mutt lol) the difference is the tightness of coat ( compared to a mink cross ) yes normal ferrets get a tight coat after the winter shed but mink x tend to keep a tight coat all year round I would love to see your jace luv4ferrets take care bye for now Bev
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Post by Deleted on Aug 29, 2015 21:49:00 GMT -5
Such a pretty little mink! I love the black spots!!
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Post by FerretsnFalcons on Aug 29, 2015 21:57:50 GMT -5
Those mink are so beautiful, it's a shame that their color compromises their health.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 30, 2015 8:01:13 GMT -5
It looks so big!! SO adorable!! I read somewhere about Dalmatian ferrets, but I'm yet to see one covered in spots. First thing I thought of was cow mink~. Its kind of cute. Mink are so adorable!! It's kind of hard to think that they're being bred for the purpose of human's greedy sense of 'fashion'. I don't think there are mink (pets) in Australia. Knowing Aus, they probably banned those as an exotic pet from here also.
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Post by Heather on Aug 30, 2015 11:21:17 GMT -5
I had a "dalmation" type ferret.....we call them Mutt's here or holsteins but the shows refer to the colouring as a mutt. I've had one, his health was poor from the get go and he lived to be about 3 yrs old. He was deaf, had constant stomach issues and died of lymphosarcoma. He was a rescue but under a year when I got him and had not had a hard life.
ciao
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