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Post by Deleted on Jan 21, 2015 8:32:53 GMT -5
Hi everyone. I just posted on the Facebook sute yesterday and realized I should have posted my questions here instead. I have a 6 year old boy Alvin who is a healthy guy but at his last vet appointment his sugars came in low for him and really close to insulinoma levels. The vet wants to watch his sugars and suggested not starting medicine but I am hoping to make some changes that will hopefully help him keep sugars at a good level.
He loves eating and really loves his treats. He eats totally ferret active, bandits treats and really loves chicken Nbobes. All have a ton of sugar! He also loves chicken babyfood and ferretone.
I would love to start him on eggs and maybe a healthier oil to start as I begin reading through the FAQ and other threads on this forum. A suggestion of tears were given in response to my FB post and I'm going to look for those.
I am hopeful that with a lot of patience and education I can make the switch for Alvin. I'm also looking forward to getting to spend this extra time with him as an enrichment exercise.
Thank you all for your suggestions!
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Post by Deleted on Jan 21, 2015 10:02:24 GMT -5
Hi Alvinsmom. Welcome to the forum we are glad to have you!  What was Alvin's sugar or BG level? If he is borderline insu taking the sugar away is a very good idea. Sugar contributes greatly to insu and removing it from his diet would be best. My ferts LOVE chicken baby food and it has helped my switch to raw in many ways. I've had great luck with Olive oil and they can have 1 tablespoon per week. If you want to try eggs, you either have to give the entire egg (whites & yolk) or just the yolk never just the whites. Again on egg per week is good but if you can find quail eggs they can have 3-4 quail eggs a week due to their small size. Are you interested in switching Alvin to raw? Feel free to ask us all the questions you have we are here to help and we are happy to help. We also love pictures so if you have one of Alvin we'd love to see it.  |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 21, 2015 11:30:04 GMT -5
Hi and Welcome to the HFF  Your Alvin must be very special to you. At six years of age, he has already decided what foods he likes and doesn't like. Unfortunately, the treats are full of sugars and carbs as you know. The key to managing Insulinoma, is to keep his Blood Glucose levels stable. You will want to take those away and find a diet for him, that will keep his levels stable. Ferrets are obligate carnivores and are designed to eat meat. Kibble has to have starches/grains and or fruits and veggies in it, so that it holds it shape. All of that will lead to unstable BG levels. You can't reverse Insulinoma, but you can manage it and help Alvin live longer and more comfortably. Signs of an unstable blood level will be staring into space, he may have hind leg weakness and he will sleep alot more and play less. Usually, when a ferret gets older, we attribute their sleeping more and playing less to age. The thing is that ferrets rarely are fortunate enough to die of old age. Some illness will take them. The best thing that you can do for Alvin, is to become familiar with Insulinoma. Learn the signs and symptoms and get him on a good diet. He may need medication at some point and it would help to learn about that also. People make their own best health advocates by learning and as Alvin's ferrent, you will want to be his health advocate. We have alot of ferrents on the forum who are all too familiar with this disease. Everyone here wants the best for you and Alvin. Don't hesitate to ask questions or for advice. The forum is also a great place to share fun stories and pictures, get tips on all things ferrets and to have fun with other ferrents. I wish you and Alvin all the best and hope to see you around the Forum.  |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 21, 2015 13:36:07 GMT -5
Thanks! Unfortunately I am very familiar with insulinoma but I'm hoping that we caught it early this time to help prevent the sugar crashes and give him some more time. His BG was 84 at his last check up a month ago. Alvin is my kiddo so I do want to do what is best for him, as I know all of you do. I talk regularly with the vet, my local ferret rescue and hopefully this forum and all of your expertise will be a great addition to helping me make Alvin a happier and healthier little guy! I posted a picture of Alvin on FB yesterday and I'm not quite sure how to attach a photo here. I love sharing my pics and videos of him so careful what you ask for!  ? Anyways, I have a lot to read and learn and I would like to ask as many questions as possible! Once I buy the scale and find out where I can get the good quality (I'm thinking organic for antiobiotics and hormone free) meats and organs should I sign up for a mentor before my 15 posts? Thanks again! Kim and Alvin |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 21, 2015 13:37:38 GMT -5
Frown face in my last post was a grinning face in my browser. Happy smiley face.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 21, 2015 14:07:11 GMT -5
Hi and welcome! Good to know you want to switch him to a healthier diet! Where do you live? I just recognized the kibble brand as it used to be (maybe still is?) quite popular here. You can start by reading all the info pinned tabs and start your own switching thread until you can apply for a mentor. Even without a mentor, you will receive advise, everyone here is very nice and helpful  You can post all the questions about the diet there, and good luck, can't wait to see your fuzz  |
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Post by crazylady on Jan 21, 2015 14:24:36 GMT -5
Hi I am a raw meat feeder once you get your baby on to eating meat could you split his meal into three and feed him 3 or four times a day ? this would mean his body is given food at regular times ( rather like a diabetic ?) I have no experience with insulinoma but with regards to the eggs I can help lol it is better to feed eggs cooked ( scrambled or hardboiled )because the advin contained within the white binds with the biotin ( vit b7 and vit h ) and can cause biotin deficiency and also by cooking eggs it causes irreversible structure damage to the advin so biotin can easily be absorbed you also have the peace of mind of knowing by cooking you are also killing off any bacteria mine like to play with hardboiled eggs and eat there way through the shell into the yummy part lol its fun watching them roll them about I often give in and peel a tiny bit of shell away to give them a head start lol hope this helps take care bye for now
Bev
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Post by Deleted on Jan 21, 2015 15:24:48 GMT -5
Thanks! I bet Alvin would love to play with a hard boiled egg. If he eats part of it all the better!
We are in Colorado.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 21, 2015 15:29:48 GMT -5
Try raw, he may like it more and it keeps all its nutrients better |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 21, 2015 15:45:53 GMT -5
The start of the New Year has found us with a waiting list for Mentors and some Mentors who are overwhelmed with work and have been sick. So, I would go ahead and sign up now. You'll have your fifteen posts. In the meantime, follow along on some of the Mentor/Member switching threads and see how the process works. You can also start your own thread and the Mentors will pop in and help you along until you are assigned your own Mentor. A Mentor will almost always start you off with a raw soup recipe. The idea is to get them to eat the soup and then begin adding slivers of meat. The soupie is balanced and will give Alvin all his nutrients until he makes the move off of soup and onto the Frankenprey diet or Whole Prey. The soup recipe is simple: 8 ounces of raw chicken thigh 1/2 chicken hearts 1/2 chicken liver 1/2 tsp of dried eggshell powder. Simply save up your eggshells and let them dry out for a day or two. Then you grind them up into a fine powder. I bought a small coffee grinder for this, but you can use a blender or magic bullet. The dried eggshells store well in a dry place. Puree this into a soup. You can add some warm water to thin it, or freeze it until you are ready to serve. Alot of ferrents use ice cube trays. Then you just pop one out and add warm water to make it soupie. Alvin will probably prefer it thinner at first. So, then you sit on the floor with him. Put him on your lap and dab your finger into the soup and wipe some on his mouth. He will lick it off. If he jumps off and runs away, pick him up and try again. He may be stubborn and convinced that you are trying to poison him, but keep trying. If he takes to the soup, then with him sitting on your lap, place your hand under him to keep him there. Take a small spoon and offer him some soup. Once he is eating the soup, you can lower the spoon to the plate and let him eat from the spoon on the plate. It may take a few attempts, but he will learn to like the soup. That's when you will start adding tiny slivers of chicken to the soup. The idea is to slowly increase the slivers and their size and decrease the amount of soup. When he is eating all slivers or bigger pieces, we move him to the next stage. Finding chicken hearts can be a little difficult sometimes. Tyson's sells packages of gizzards and hearts, but you are lucky to get two or three hearts in a package. Talk to your butcher or look for a good Asian market. Once Alvin has moved from soup to bone in meals, you will need liver and organs. So, it's not a bad idea to look around now. How does that sound, any questions? And of course, the most important thing...pictures! :banana: Most of us use a photosharing site like photobucket. Here is a link to posting pictures: www.google.com/search?q=holistic+ferret+forum+posting+pictures+and+videos&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8 |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 21, 2015 23:21:18 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Jan 21, 2015 23:24:52 GMT -5
Thanks for the soupie recipe. I'm going to send my hubby to the store tomorrow to ask about getting the heart and liver. We have a great row of asian markets not too far so that is certainly an option for us as well. How many eggshells do you estimate I will need to get the 1/2 tsp powder? Another ferret expert uses lactose free milk added to an egg mixed with ferretone and ferretvite as a quick option. I know that still has a lot of sugar, but what about the lactaid milk? Is that an option if he likes the taste added to the egg?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2015 17:26:18 GMT -5
I loved the pictures of Alvin. He is a very handsome boy. That's great that you have access to some good markets. That will make shopping so much easier. I usually do a batch of eggshells and make a container full. I've never done just one. I'd guess though, that one eggshell will easily make a little more than a 1/2 tsp of powder. Ferretone is controversial. It contains two cancer causing agents, BHA and BHT. The forum doesn't recommend it. Ferretvite is full of sugar. As you know, ferrets little bodies are not designed to process sugar. They are already little cancer machines, and Ferretvite is simply Insulinoma in a tube. Alvin will learn to like eggs and I would stay away from relying on the other options as a way of encouraging him to like things. Here is a good article on why ferrets should not have dairy or lactose free milk: docs.google.com/document/d/1v_mR6I-D5AW6SdRg3XB3kzvcfnlVhyt6cuYwqTzh_8Y/edit |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2015 19:06:51 GMT -5
Thanks poncesmom! I know my vet said to stay away from the ferretvite with my other insilunoma babies so I'm glad I asked again! I really wasn't certain about the milk as I was pretty sure there was sugar components in it. I also looked at the ferretone bottle last night and noticed how many ingredients are in there. Does olive oil provide any other nutritional benefit (other than being a bit tasty)? I see some folks using a mix of olive oil and salmon oil I believe? Is that any better?
Hubby checked our local organic market and they do sell the gizzards and livers by the pound but the hearts are special order. I'm guessing that if they have to order it is shipped frozen. I am supposed to go on work travel for a couple of days so I may start this weekend with an egg and an alternate oil. Travel will give me some time to really do reading and then come up with a plan before trying to switch him and then leave.
Thanks for everyone's suggestions! I'm glad I found you all.
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