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Post by Blue on Dec 24, 2014 14:07:57 GMT -5
bitbyter that is a fantastic write-up, thank you so much! I hope it's stickied or filed somewhere There's also Aunt Jeni's commercial grind around here, it seems very similar to Rad Cat, and it is actually labeled for Cats and Ferrets. I somewhat randomly picked Rad Cat based on a superficial reading of the ingredients, but really I know very little about the subtleties of the veggie fillers. Perhaps I'll take a picture of the label next time and post it here, and get an informed opinion
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Post by bitbyter on Dec 24, 2014 15:44:11 GMT -5
It's actually part of an e-book I have been working on.
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Post by Celene on Dec 24, 2014 17:21:31 GMT -5
That makes sense @poncesmom. I was just wondering since if they are identical meat why someone would pay extra for veal for their ferrets.
Then again, the only meat I eat is seafood and poultry, so maybe they taste different or something, I wouldn't know.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 24, 2014 17:25:19 GMT -5
That makes sense @poncesmom. I was just wondering since if they are identical meat why someone would pay extra for veal for their ferrets. Then again, the only meat I eat is seafood and poultry, so maybe they taste different or something, I wouldn't know. After you posted your question, I got to thinking about veal. I don't think that I have ever seen anyone on the forum talk about feeding veal. It could be because it's so pricey or maybe since we are all animal lovers, it's due to the way veal is raised. I don't know, but it was a very good question. :wave2:
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Post by bitbyter on Dec 24, 2014 19:16:06 GMT -5
It's not going to be much different than beef nutritionally as long as it isn't "white" or milk fed veal (that would be low in iron and maybe some other nutrients). It may have less of a "beef" flavour. Also, not all veal is box raised or solely milk fed. Crating veal calves is illegal in the E.U and slowly being phased out elsewhere (it is illegal in some U.S. States). Sadly this is one area Canada's meat industry is behind other countries. We have such a large dairy industry that as a result we have a large veal industry as well and crating is still largely in use.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 25, 2014 12:41:08 GMT -5
Mypetcarnivore does not use 4D meats either (not sure about hare-today) ferretbrah, what is 4D? I use Mypetcarnivore as it is local to me, and inexpensive. Their ground meat is approximately 10-15% bone, 10% organs and the rest is muscle meat. They don't claim their product to be organic, and they have to label them "not for human consumption" since it's pet food, but I think they use good quality meat. One of their suppliers, Schoenborn Farms from Michigan, also raises chickens for Whole Foods Market, the well-known health food store. They also use non-GMO Amish farm operation.
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Post by ferretbrah on Dec 25, 2014 21:38:03 GMT -5
Mypetcarnivore does not use 4D meats either (not sure about hare-today) ferretbrah, what is 4D? I use Mypetcarnivore as it is local to me, and inexpensive. Their ground meat is approximately 10-15% bone, 10% organs and the rest is muscle meat. They don't claim their product to be organic, and they have to label them "not for human consumption" since it's pet food, but I think they use good quality meat. One of their suppliers, Schoenborn Farms from Michigan, also raises chickens for Whole Foods Market, the well-known health food store. They also use non-GMO Amish farm operation. "First off, what do "3-D" and "4-D" mean? These terms are simply "shorthand" for animals that are deemed diseased, dying, down (non-ambulatory) or dead. It is also common to lump all of these categories into the simple phrase “condemned meat”, and animals that have tested positive for antibiotics, steroids or other drugs will likewise be condemned.
The "4th D" is generally reserved for only those cattle that are already dead when arriving to whatever processor they are sent. Our research has led us to believe that the vast majority of these animals are used primarily in kibble production (of MANY varieties and labels) as well as raw food for mink farmers (where healthy animals are not necessarily the primary concern). We stop short of accusing raw pet-food companies of using this 4th D classification of meat as we have no first-hand knowledge of any that do, but the meat is treated the same as those in the 3-D category, so consumers need to be keenly aware of the risk."
For more info: www.mypetcarnivore.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=125&Itemid=359&lang=enI'm not sure if Hare-today has 3D/4D meat though, I would assume it does not either, but you never know.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 25, 2014 22:21:48 GMT -5
Wow, this is a really good read! Thanks, ferretbrah! I usually order on their website before picking them up, but I had never seen this article. It sickens me to think that our pets are eating diseased meat... Another reason to put them on Frankenprey, where we know their food is "human consumption grade." The only thing is that I'd hate to stop buying from them! They are such good people! People at the headquarter is always nice too.
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Post by ferretbrah on Dec 25, 2014 22:53:43 GMT -5
If you pick-up locally, do you still have to pay shipping? If not, that is a super cheap price for their food haha.
I think their food would be fine for us to eat. I believe it is because they would have to go through all of the FDA regulations for human-consumption food, and would probably have to put anti-biotics and other things for certain meats. The FDA regulations would probably be very costly as well. Also, I'm not sure if we would even like the taste of a whole grind meat, with bones and weird organs haha.
Yeah, it seems like most kibble does source diseased/sick/dead meat, and that is how they are able to keep the prices down. I believe there was someone on here with the definitions of "Chicken Meal" etc, that they use and what that actually means.
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Post by RedSky on Dec 26, 2014 10:06:44 GMT -5
I'm in the UK and use a company called Durham Animal Feed, they are aimed at dogs but it is 100% meat, no fillers, veg ect just the meat and it says exactly what is in each one. Very important as our dog has allergies. The grinds don't say what organs are in or if they contain heart but you can buy 4kg of mixed sheep, pig and beef hearts for £9 (about 14 US dollars). And since you can't really overfeed heart it isn't too much of a problem if you are willing to add it in. They also sell chunks of meat so you can feed larger things to make them chew too, these vary in price depending on what you want, but stuff like kidneys are £5 for 4kg, just lamb meat (no bone ect) is £8.60 for 4kg (which is about 8.8lb) so about 1.50$ per lb for chunks of lamb. The grinds are cheaper, all less than £1 per lb. It states on the site All of our frozen products are manufactured to the highest standard, using quality ingredients collected from EEC approved establishments, where they are passed fit for human consumption. They are immediately refrigerated and fully processed within 24 hours of collection.
And if you order enough delivery is free or if you need it in a rush I think they deliver any amount for £10 otherwise you have to wait until the set date for your area. They are really nice as well, very helpful and polite. They will even put everything in your freezer if you are out! Very handy for us as our freezer is out in the shed and we both work during the week.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2015 23:43:07 GMT -5
bitbyter thank you for the write up! CeleneYour question about what others are paying for commercial grinds: I ordered the 24 oz Rad Cat (their largest) for only $14 at my local pet store. It is considerably cheaper than the kibbles (Wysong and Orijen) I've been buying. And I'll definitely be saving a ton of money since I can feed my cats the same diet. :3
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