|
Post by Deleted on Dec 14, 2014 12:45:21 GMT -5
Guys, there's something I need to get off my chest. I really dislike pet stores. I dislike how the animals are treated, I dislike how the animals are bred, and I dislike how they use the compassion of caring human beings and especially animal-lovers for profit. Now let me be very clear: - I am not judging those of you who've purchased your pets from pet stores. - I am not suggesting that your animal deserved to suffer in any way. - I realize that you helped that particular animal by purchasing it. What I am saying is that I dislike the way pet shops manipulate us and abuse our animals. The way dogs and puppies, fish, cats and kittens, rabbits, and of course our ferrets are bred relentlessly in poor conditions, kept in overcrowded and dirty habitats, and deprived of love. A lot of people (understandably!) decide to "save" an animal by buying it from the pet store. Please resist the urge if you can. You can help that particular animal without funding another litter from being born into that h*ll. Report animal cruelty to the ASPCA, let them bust the cruel individual(s) responsible for the pets' suffering. If you have questions, I've found the ASPCA FAQ very helpful, although you will need to look up specifics for your area. Try to rescue when/where possible!
|
|
|
Post by Heather on Dec 14, 2014 17:33:59 GMT -5
If it was only that simple. Even if all of us were to never buy another ferret from a pet store, you would do nothing to shut down Marshals farms. Their pet trade is a very small and insignificant portion of their business. They would continue to breed ferrets in terrible conditions and sell them to a market that doesn't care at all. The medical and cosmetic industry uses Marshals farms and is worth more than all of the pet store industry can ever offer. Some large city centers in Ontario have banned the sale of "pets" in their area. Now I believe that doesn't include small rodents and fish but I'm not entirely sure on that part....but I do know that within certain areas, pet stores are no longer allowed to sell kitten, rabbits, puppies, reptiles and ferrets. The rodents that are sold are considered "food". The stores that used to promote the sale of these pets now work with local shelters to promote the rehoming of pets that are in need of homes ciao
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 14, 2014 18:20:29 GMT -5
I do agree with the fact that animals in pet shops are kept in horrible conditions. And I also think about the fact that buying an animal there will only encourage them to "order" more. However, as Heather said, that is not the only part of the problem, unfortunately. I've been put through more than one situation when I had to think through the decision of getting or not getting an animal from a pet shop. Here in Finland, it is not allowed to sell "bigger" animals in pet shops. I think the most they can is fish and small rodents - and the conditions are strictly regulated. My first ferret came from Romania, from a pet store. He was kept in the pet store for 7 months, people taking him home and then returning him because "he bit them". He was kept in an aquarium, on wood shavings and nothing else, and fed cat food high carb, sugar and milk content. I couldn't leave him there. I adopted him, took him home and got him better. And I reported them - they never had ferrets since. The impact on his body must have been very strong, as he developed insulinoma. I lost him this year, after 4,5 years... ( One of my boys now was also adopted from Romania, when visiting last summer. We saw him in a pet shop, in an aquarium, with the same story, no attention. And he was TOO small - about 4 weeks old! He was crying all the time, and desperate for attention. They had absolutely no record or any info about his origins - later found out he is wild. However, we took him home - and reported the store. I don't know if it had any results, but at least it gave a small soul a chance to live. I was shocked to see what impact it had on his behaviour, after 7 months, he still is afraid of being left alone and still cries when closed in a small space. It's terrible to see what happens to animals that are isolated in a petshop, not just physically.... I thought through this decision for days and nights, and I decided to take him the day before our departure... It is not that easy to make a decision, and you have to balance the pros and cons. Nonetheless, I do state out loud that I am against pet shops and I know that one side of my decision helped them, but the other helped the little boy....
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 14, 2014 18:34:12 GMT -5
Marshalls is one of the biggest (if not the biggest) pet breeding farms out there. Wouldn't we still be betting off boycotting what we can? Not every breeding mill can afford to lose the capital they rely on from pet stores. I would think even a little damage is better than none at all. It's like letting one house burn because the rest of the city will be fine.
Besides, rescuing when/where possible can still get you a wonderful pet who needs you just as much. If you need to report a place, you can do so without lining their pockets. Call the authorities in your area, get them shut down/stop them from carrying ferrets, and look up a particular animal you might be interested in when it is transferred to a local shelter. They could better use your adoption fee anyway.
|
|
|
Post by Heather on Dec 14, 2014 18:38:30 GMT -5
It's a proven fact. They would loose about 1% of their total worth. No, it wouldn't bother them at all. The problem is we also cannot reach the whole population. If there was no Marshals we could probably cut over half of the shelter ferrets. ciao
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 14, 2014 18:40:52 GMT -5
Well, it must be possible to do something. Nevermind that 1% is more than 0%. Besides, 1% of Marshalls's budget is probably a significant amount. We can't sit around and do nothing.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 14, 2014 18:48:46 GMT -5
It all comes down to personal preference really, I've never gotten a ferret from a store, all 5 were adopted. Not because I didn't want a baby, I've always wanted a baby (most people here know that lol), not because I didn't want to support MF's for Heather's reasons (wouldn't affect them), but because... my shelter babies needed me, they were all over a year old, they came from a bad background, nippers, chompers, skittish ones that couldn't hold still for 5 seconds, nobody wanted my babies, they were older, they were thought to be "mean", they had issues, they were perfect. Babies in a pet store have a better chance of being adopted, sure they might not go to the best home but we can hope they would at least give it love and care. My shelter babies had been tossed around for years on end, my youngest who is 1yrs, she was in the system for 4 months, she was back and forth, nobody wanted her because she was nippy. She crossed my path and I grabbed her up, she only nibbles on me when she grooms me, she's playful, full of life, healthy, and a big piggy.
I'm not saying don't save the pet store babies, they deserve a good home as much as any other ones, what I'm saying is, I didn't choose my ferrets, they chose me.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 14, 2014 19:04:18 GMT -5
The city of Chicago has banned sales of dogs and cats that come from mills. That's a truly wonderful idea on the surface, but the reality is that people are just going to drive to one of the nearby suburbs and buy their cats and dogs at one of the many stores there. For every one person that decides that he/she is going to never buy an animal from a store, there are probably 5 more who will. The average consumer truly doesn't care where an animal comes from. The average consumer generally won't know how to even properly take care of said animal, so why would they really care? Heather is right. Marshall makes the bulk of their money selling the kits to labs. Even if they completely exited the pet market, they wouldn't lose out. Why? They'd have more ferrets to sell to more labs. My first ferret was a ~rescue~ from Craigslist. Where'd they buy her? Petco. If Petco didn't sell ferrets, for that family to have purchased her, how would I have adopted her? Rescuing isn't always for the faint of heart. I adopted Coconut 2 months ago, and she still hates my guts, and I haven't a clue about her previous life at all, to even determine why she is the way she is. The average, uninformed consumer would have returned her right away. To say that everyone should stop buying from stores and adopt is an incredibly naïve and idealistic notion.
|
|
|
Post by Heather on Dec 14, 2014 19:25:28 GMT -5
I thought I would do a little research. Marshals Farms is also known as Marshals Bioresources and have breeding facilities in North America, Europe, China, South Korea, Japan and India. They are known by a number of names, Marshals Biotechnologies in China, Woo Jung Bsc in Korea and Sametek Instruments in India. On this particular site I eventually was locked out. As I continued to prowl their various information sites I discovered this. These are the suppliers of their breeding stock, I think you will recognise some familiar names * B&K Universal, Ltd. Euroferret Isoquimen, SL Marshall BioResources Sierra For Medical Science, Inc. Triple F Farms, Inc. I also tracked this down too....note there are some Holistic or all natural products that this company has created Marshall BioResources / Marshall Farms Group 5800 Lake Bluff Road North Rose, NY 14516 Phone: (315) 587-2295 Fax: (315) 587-2109 Web: www.marshallbio.com, www.marshallbioresources.comContact: Scott Marshall, President & CEO Notes: Laboratory animal supplier (dogs, ferrets, pigs). See also: Clyde, NY. Marshall also supplies ferrets and rabbits to the pet trade and produces ferret food, dried apple pet treats and other products; these companies– including Marshall Pet Products, Peter's Boutique Bunnies and Orchard Sweets– Just thought you'd like to know what you're really coming up against. ciao
|
|
|
Post by ferretbrah on Dec 14, 2014 20:46:58 GMT -5
Has marshals ever commented on the quality of their food or a raw diet?
They responded to a question I have them on facebook about putting them in ferret nation cages with their products to show them off and sell more hammocks etc vs their aquariums by saying they are in there for "safety" .
I wish they would just display them in ferret nations and also have their playpen outside the cage with their octopus and other toys for them to actually be able to move around.
Then have pet store workers put them in the cage when it's adoption day or something with dogs.
It just frustrates me how they can easily have knowledge on how to provide them better care and they don't .
|
|
|
Post by Heather on Dec 14, 2014 23:47:44 GMT -5
They don't need to. As mentioned previously, they don't care. They really don't care. Their ferret kibbles is one of the worst on the market. They've not changed the recipe since the time they purchased the recipe from the mink and fitch farms they were linked to at the time. Think about it, are they really going to care....these people supported fur farms. The pet portion of their business is a hobby. FN isn't their product, ferret mansion is so they wouldn't do a display set up in a FN. There is another product they've not bothered to change or modify for the safety of ferrets. Their play products are too small for anything except kits and small jills. People are going to buy their product even if they don't set up their cages or their playpens. They know that they have the market tied up with products. Do your little ones a favour and support the many shelter supported ferret play products instead of supporting Marshals products. I think it would be much easier and more supportive to check out the various shelters and their ferret friendly products ciao
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 15, 2014 0:31:51 GMT -5
Personally, I currently work at a pet store. And honestly, I know that we take the quality of our animals very seriously where we are. (By quality I mean their health, quality of life, general care, all that good stuff that leads to a happy and healthy animal.) Whenever we get a new animal, we make sure to take note of any little thing we see that we don't like. This is all reported to the breeder (we actually changed reptile breeders a little while ago because the reptiles we were receiving were coming in thin, ill, and it wasn't changing no matter what we said). I and the people I work with truly care about our animals, and it shows (at least, that's what customers have said!) so not every pet store has bad quality animals or provides poor care for them. In fact, at my pet store, if we have a policy in place that isn't to the benefit of the animals, we do have the ability to change it.
Now, I know that not every pet store cares about the animals it gets, where they come from, how they are treated before they arrive, etc. But some do. So I don't think we should all be "anti-pet-stores." I think it should be more of a balance. You know, do your research. Does that pet store around the corner from you care at all or do they jam 12 rats in a cage big enough for 2? (Ugh, my local Petco...I've reported them several times leading to a crazy overhaul...long story for a different day.) Or does that pet store have people working there who truly care, and does the store make an effort to provide quality care?
I also strongly feel that animals should be adopted from shelters or unwanted homes. I don't want to come off as though I think we should always or only buy from stores. But I don't think we should always bash them. There are some pet stores who get animals from great breeders who truly care. And there are some who definitely don't. And then there are some animals who were taken home by someone who wasn't meant to have them, and then they stumble into your life. I think all the ways are excellent for finding an animal who is a perfect fit for you.
As for protesting the poor quality of life that happens with mills like Mashall's, I would say you have to attack the source (the Marshall's company), not the branches (pet stores). Report the living conditions to the ASPCA, to PETA, to Animal Control, to anyone who will listen. Get them sued for their poor choices. If the way they make their money is by selling their ferrets to labs, then contact the labs. There are a lot of things that can be done that can bring attention to the company (whenever the public is angered, companies have to change quickly or lose all support). So, bring the negative aspects to light for the world to see. make people care about it. Make people want to change it. =]
|
|
|
Post by RedSky on Dec 15, 2014 7:31:09 GMT -5
As a child I honestly thought you could only get dogs and cats from rescue centres, we got our first family dog when I was 3 from the RSPCA. I didn't understand that people abandoned animals of all species at shelters, I thought you kept them for life or if you couldn't there was always a friend or family member to help out until you could have them back (medical reasons and such). I also didn't realise that pet shops usually ordered in stock and didn't care for their animals as they should. For my 8th birthday my parents bought me a rabbit and guinea pig (bad pairing but very common at the time), these were both breed at the pet shop and I was allowed into the area upstairs where they kept the breeding animals. It was well lit, smelt of hay and shavings nothing nasty and all the cages were always pretty clean. Thinking back the animals were probably over bred and in cages that were far too small but at 8 and without knowing better I thought it was amazing.
My point is, I think the majority of people when they think about getting a hamster, rabbit, fish and other pets only think about going to a pet shop. Do they realise there are rescues out there for other animals? Even the RSPCA rehomes rodents but I didn't know that when I bought my 3 gerbils from pet shops (1 from a local shop and 2 from pets at home to be her cagemates). And heck I only got the other 2 because I bothered to look online and join forums to understand better care for them.
Another point on pet shops is the knowledge of the staff, some pet shops like mentioned above are pretty good. Okay so we can't be sure where the animals are coming from or their previous care but the cages are clean, they have food and toys and interaction from the staff. The staff are helpful and fairly knowledgeable and offer good advice. Then there are other pet shops, ones that tell me that my new gerbil is a boy (wrong) and that 'he' because 'he' is 'male' should be kept on his own (males are usually more accepting of other males, easier to introduce and less likely to fall out). And oh this habitrail cage (tiny plastic units connected by plastic tubes) is perfect. ALL WRONG! But I didn't think to research before I went out to get one, I thought the pet shop was really good before all this and knew their stuff. I'm glad I learnt and that the 2 gerbils I got from pets at home as males were also females...
I will now only get pets from breeders and rescues I have researched. Unless of course I have that instant connection with an animal, no-one can turn away from love at first sight.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 15, 2014 15:50:50 GMT -5
Thank you @freyjasdiciple and RedSky for adding to the conversation. I agree; there are exceptions to every rule, and there are good pet shops out there, and good pet shop owners. I personally know one of them, and I support her endeavors because I know her pets are all from small, reputable breeders. I also agree with the fact that we need to boycott/protest Marshalls from the source as much as humanly possible. I don't buy anything they make. I've got a local network of NJ ferret shelters that might be able to tell me who to write/call/etc. And much as both frey and redsky said, I've got as many beefs with bad pet shops as I do with Marshalls itself. I'll never forget the first parakeet I ever had, the poor, sickly, little boy. Yes, there are good shops out there, but in my experience, they are far outnumbered by the bad. The idea that "most people don't care so it's not a big deal" is known as the "ad populum" fallacy: it's bad logic based on what the majority of the human herd does. WE, as the caring pet owners, need to make what difference we can. We need to look out for the babies who need us while not engendering more suffering.
|
|
|
Post by racheld on Dec 15, 2014 22:17:31 GMT -5
I agree with you, Alex. Having watched video from breeding facilities that (used to) provide animals to pet stores, I cannot in good conscience buy one of their ferrets and encourage their business. Money talks, and when you buy products or animals from those companies you're telling them to keep doing what they're doing.
|
|