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Post by Heather on Nov 17, 2014 22:46:13 GMT -5
Name: Jess HF Forum Username: tobydog 1. Where did you first learn about natural diets for ferrets? I started just looking up "best food for ferrets" and a lot of things pointed to raw/natural foods. 2. Please describe the type of diet you would like assistance in switching your ferret(s) to. Be sure to include if you are interested in feeding whole prey (live or frozen-thawed) and if you are wanting to FULLY switch to a natural diet or PARTIALLY. If you are unsure what kind of diet you want to put your ferrets on, please express that and we can help you find the best type of natural diet for your ferret. I'm not sure which would be best. I'm open to all suggestions, pros vs cons of each options. Something that's not going to cost me an arm and a leg... 3. Why are you interested in switching your ferrets to a natural diet? I like to eat healthy because it makes me feel good and with more energy. Sure, I enjoy some junk from time to time but my body then feels sluggish. I know my dog made big improvements when I switched him to a really good kibble - and I'm sure my ferret would feel the same! I feel I have to do my best in food offerings for my ferret (and dog!), because they're my kids and I don't want to be a terrible parent. 4. Do you understand that switching your ferret to a natural diet can be a lengthy, arduous process? Its not an overnight switch. It can be a commitment of several weeks or even months. Your HF Mentor will be more then happy to assist you in switchng your ferret(s) to a natural diet, but you need to be equally as commited. If you aren't willing to tough out a potentially lengthy switching process, or if you have major life changes approaching (baby on the way, moving, starting school, getting married/divorced, etc) then it might be a better idea to wait on switching your ferret's diet until you have more time. Are you willing to make the commitment? I understand. I'm thinking because my ferret is still very young that he should take to it quite well with a bit of encouragement. I've already got him obsessed with boiled chicken breast, he gets really excited for it! I'm definitely willing to make this commitment. 5. How many ferrets do you currently have? What are their names? Ages? Genders? Do they have any health problems? Are they overweight? Underweight? How long have you had each ferret for? I have just one ferret. His name is Fez, he'll be 11 weeks old this week. No health problems that I'm aware of. I've had him for 2 weeks now, and he might be a little underweight - he was the smallest of his litter group by far, but maybe he's just the runt? 6. What diet do you currently feed your ferrets? (Please include all treats, supplements, etc) Do they already eat some form of soup? Currently he's still eating Marshalls kibble... That's what he's been on always so I kept purchasing that while I slowly work on transitioning him over. 7. Have you ever tried to switch your ferrets to a natural diet in the past? If yes, what happened? Nope, never tried. 8. What additional information about yourself or your ferrets would you like to share? I'm a vegetarian, have been for a very long time - so I'll probably ask some dumb questions about meats. I don't really mind handling the meat, I've already got a separate cutting board, I'll need to get a bigger/better meat knife though. I know nothing about meat, nor do I have much luck finding meats just yet (been looking all year for turkey necks for my dogs!). But I'm a quick learner. Once I get a weekly meal plan and know/understand what I'm actually doing I think all of this will be quite easy. 9. How often during the week do you have access to a computer? All the time 10. Please post a picture of each of your ferrets (if possible). Hi and welcome to the mentoring program . In a little while your mentor (Kraesmom) will introduce herself and you can get started on a new adventure in natural ferret care and diets. Please remember to post regularly (daily or as per arranged with your mentor) so that your mentor can assist you move along safely in this adventure. If you experience computer difficulties or are going to be away, please notify your mentor and most of all relax and have fun :boing: . Your mentor is here to help you on this journey. ciao
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Post by kraesmom on Nov 17, 2014 23:55:40 GMT -5
Name: Shawnda HF Screen Name: KRaesMom
Location: Canton, OH
About Me:
My favorite color is: turquoise...leaning more toward peacock My favorite food is: Maybe it's easier to list what I *don't* like, which is lima beans (they're both dry AND squishy...ew), coconut, butterscotch, brussels sprouts, iceberg lettuce (it squeaks when you bite it) My favorite holiday is: Hm...I like long weekends...so any holiday that I can tack onto a weekend is a good one in my book. My favorite hobby is: I like to decorate, build stuff out of old pallet wood, fix stuff, I can sew...although it's not my favorite thing to do...and I seem to like cleaning. Actually I don't like the ACT of cleaning, but I love the result when the house is clean. I like to listen to: pretty much anything but country and hip-hop...oh, and metal (death, grunge, screamer...pretty much all metal hurts my head)...faves are definitely Pink Floyd, Rush, Muse... I collect: old stuff...wooden cigar boxes, blue canning jars with the glass lids, insulators, license plates from 1971. Fortunately, I don't collect beyond the space in our 1328 sq ft house.
Something about me you might be surprised to know: I can draw animals...and program computers (primarily web design/development). My day job though, is as an insurance agent/customer support manager.
I became a mentor because: I want others to feel the same type of joy I do when I'm drifting off to sleep and hear someone crunching on bones, 'cause I know it's good for them and I'm trying to be the best ferrent I can be.
About My Ferrets:
1. Foster - my first baby. I'd been wanting a ferret for quite a while, but my OH surprised me for Christmas 2012 with a tiny sable (poley) kit. He came to us with ECE and had been eating Marshalls food soaked in water. I did research and created a mix of higher quality kibbles and thought I was doing right by him. Foster is the troublemaker. There aren't many places in the house that he can't get to...he climbs up the shelves at the end of the counter and plays in the kitchen sink, he jumps up onto the toilet and then up onto the vanity in the bathroom... It's bad when someone forgets to close the lid. He will wall walk, wedged between the dresser and the wall to get to the cat kibble. (headwall) And he does NOT like tables to hold THINGS. The THINGS must go. All THINGS. Foster was my lone hold out with a frankenprey menu. He liked FDR and CFR, but did NOT want to have to CHEW!
2. Avery - I went to the store to buy pet supplies in May 2013 and found Avery. He is a chocolate and I thought he had the sweetest look to him. I now know that the "look" is indicative of Waardenburg Syndrome. He really is sweet. And very routine oriented. If I go into the bathroom, he'll follow me and look at me with a Pez Head because he's expecting food. I defrost in a bowl of water on the counter, and also mix up FDR in there. He was the second one to convert to raw, and our breakthrough happened thanks to a frozen quail.
3. Kimble, my "Bubby" and "Baby Love" - Easiest switch ever. I gave him meat. He ate it. Boom. One Tuesday in Jan 2014, I saw him at the same store where I got the other two and instantly fell in love. He had just come in the shipment that day and was such a tiny little sable, not more than 6-7 weeks old. He was in a cage with a bitey little beige boy that kept beating him up. I didn't take him home right away though, as my family objected to additional ferrets. They get into stuff you know. I went back to see him twice more that week and found i just couldn't get him out of my head. He gave the best nose kisses and held onto my arm like a baby monkey. I warned my OH and went back that Saturday and snuck him into the house. That's how he got his name...Kimble...The Fugitive. Eventually the kids found out and all h*ll broke loose, but it was too late. He was MINE. He is truly the happiest little guy ever. He laughs all the time and plays with everyone...the dog, the kitten, the other ferts...and ME.
In addition to the 3 ferrets, we also have a 10 year old toy poodle/toy fox terrier doglet, 4 cats, a leopard gecko, a corn snake, and some fish. My daughter wants a tarantula, but...ick.
Oh yeah, the skin kids...daughter is 18. Son is 16. Daughter's boyfriend is living here too. Not the ideal, but we had to get him out of a bad living situation.
About My Natural Feeding Experience: I've been feeding the ferrets raw exclusively since Dec 2013. We've tried the gamut from raw extruded dry food, to freeze-dried (FDR), commercial ground frozen (CGR), frankenprey, whole prey and I've recently begun with live prey. I can't believe how much healthier the ferts are and how soft their fur has become. I think that if I ate as cleanly as they do, I'd probably be a much healthier person...but...nachos...
Type of Mentor: freeze-dried (FDR), commercial ground frozen (CGR), frankenprey, whole prey and I've recently begun with live prey.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 21, 2014 0:16:14 GMT -5
Well, hi!!
Not sure how I didn't get the notifications on here (must have to figure out my email notification settings..), good thing you emailed me directly, I would never have known about the thread set up!
So, where do we begin? I think for the most part he's accepting all kinds of meat really, really well. Just got heart for the first time the other day, no issues! He'll take anything, really! I just need to get a bit better with the amounts of everything... I'm fairly sure I'm giving too much heart and liver, but I don't know.
Are we supposed to take before/after pictures? Cause Fez has pretty much been on raw since I bought him home. Just hasn't been 100% raw until several weeks ago.
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Post by kraesmom on Nov 21, 2014 10:57:19 GMT -5
Well, since Fez is a young fert, I would imagine he's pretty accepting of just about anything. That is good and we need to take advantage of this time in his life to expose him to as many acceptable proteins as possible, as well as chicken or turkey baby food. That way, those items will be imprinted in his brain as "food" and he'll accept them later. Anything that isn't imprinted now will be more difficult to get him to eat later. Too much heart can be okay, too much liver can cause Vitamin A toxicity, so we need to make sure we don't overdo it.
I have developed a routine in my house to make sure I feed a balanced diet. It has evolved over time and I'll let you in on my secrets as we go. You don't have to do it my way, it is what works for me, but it might give you ideas to develop a routine that will work well for you and Fez.
How much does Fez weigh? Can I see a top-down photo of him please? How are his energy levels? What types of proteins is he currently accepting? What foods do you have on hand? What is his favorite?
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Post by kraesmom on Nov 21, 2014 11:03:24 GMT -5
Oh yes...and do you have an emergency kit put together for Fez? There are some things you should always have on hand just in case: 100% pure pumpkin puree (not pie filling) vaseline beechnut turkey or chicken baby food (I also have Freeze Dried Raw on hand in case we ever have a power outage) There's a whole thread with ideas for your kit here: holisticferret60.proboards.com/thread/16795/preparing-ferrets
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Post by Deleted on Nov 21, 2014 22:37:15 GMT -5
What does vitamin A toxicity entail? He did have incredibly gross smelling pee last week, probably around the time I gave him an amount of liver.... I may have also given him quite a bit of liver last night, oops! Okay, as for the questions.. How much does Fez weigh? 2.58lbs as of tonight Can I see a top-down photo of him please? This is not an easy task haha, I'm trying my best.. Not sure if any of these are sufficient enough.. Otherwise I can keep trying, maybe when he's a bit more worn out. How are his energy levels?I assume his energy levels are pretty normal, he's pretty go-go-go when he's out of his cage. Unfortunately that isn't much the past week as work has gotten even busier right before the holidays, but he still gets a good 3+ hours, on my days off he spends almost the whole day out here in the living room with Toby and I, and then he knows it's okay to go take a nap somewhere, he still does sleep a lot... but he's a ferret, right?! What types of proteins is he currently accepting? He happily takes anything I offer him, thankfully! At the moment the main things I get and have tried is chicken, pork, beef (only heart, does that count still?), and CGH. What foods do you have on hand?We've got chicken wings, chicken stripped necks/backs (however that thing is worded), CGH parts (not sure what's left exactly), beef heart, chicken livers. What is his favorite?All of it. He literally makes no complaints, and he gets antsy waiting for me to open up the baggie and hand it to him while he waits at the open door to his cage to take it to his bowl. And no, haven't thought about an emergency kit. What kind of issues/reasons would it all be needed for? I have been wanting to make an emergency/first-aid/in-case-of-disaster type kit(s) for my dog, might make a combo one for Fez too.
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Post by kraesmom on Nov 22, 2014 15:18:43 GMT -5
Fez is a good weight and looks healthy. I'd like weekly updates on his weight so we can make sure he stays healthy.
Periods of high energy play followed by sleep is the norm. Mine are caged during the day and when let out, usually play for two hours or so and then find somewhere to take a nap.
Those are good sources of protein. If you can find some rabbit, lamb, duck, turkey (now is the time, as it is CHEAP around thanksgiving. I just bought two of them yesterday for $0.69 per lb!), quail...basically anything you can find and afford, get him used to it while he is so accepting.
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Post by kraesmom on Nov 22, 2014 15:21:21 GMT -5
Re: emergency kit. If he eats something he shouldn't and gets a blockage, he gets sick, or you have a storm that knocks out your power...any of those things can happen and it is good to be prepared.
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Post by kraesmom on Nov 22, 2014 15:29:59 GMT -5
So tomorrow, I will chop and cut the turkeys into chunks and put them in snack baggies...about 4oz each. I then put those in labeled gallon bags in the freezer. I have separate bags for each protein.
Each week, I go to the deep freeze and pull out the entire weeks worth of balanced meals based on my printed menu (https://docs.google.com/a/chuaa.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AoY6UKl2WeP2dE9xX3plUjFOcm1rTE9mUHJqbHlWM0E&usp=docslist_api) and put them in the upstairs freezer. By doing that, I can rotate meals to keep the poops from getting too firm or soft and or worry about too much liver etc.
If I remember, I can put the next day's food in the fridge to thaw, but usually just take it out of the freezer and float it in warm water for 10-15 min.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 22, 2014 19:30:03 GMT -5
Okay, this is the work-in-progress menu I've got up on my fridge at the moment, and my freezer organization (... it's getting there). As for his weight, he saw the vet today to get his rabies shot, and the vet said he's a little pudgy, got a bit of a belly. I can feel that on him too the past few days. I also noticed today (and I feel bad I only just noticed, lighting in my apartment is terrible which is probably why), but his skin is actually turned pinkish. A coworker in the grooming department brought it up when I took him in there to see them, it's obvious in some spots where his fur isn't as thick. And then come to think about it he has been itching a lot lately... Again, couldn't get a perfect picture cause he won't stay still. The pictures don't show it very well, but somewhat of an idea.. The vet noticed it too and thinks it might be an allergy to something possibly. Maybe one of his meat sources, but unsure... Uh oh :S Not sure what to do. What about the vitamin A toxicity thing? How do I know how much liver and heart to give each time he has heart/liver on the menu?
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Post by kraesmom on Nov 23, 2014 13:04:38 GMT -5
As far as the pudginess, I wouldn't worry. It is winter. They tend to be very fluffy and pudgy, particularly their first winter. Next summer, he may drop as much as 40% of his body weight. As for liver, he should have1.5 meals of 1/2 liver, 1/2 secreting organ. He should also have 1.5 meals of heart. I have simplified this for my fuzz. You can do it the above method if he's eating all of the parts well. My boys pick around the liver and don't eat well if I throw organs in there, so I have made a puree. It is 2 lb heart, 1 lb liver, 1 lb organ. I freeze it in ice cube trays and feed 3 meals per week. Liver IS high in Vitamin A but you'd have to feed a LOT of it to become a problem. We just mention it because it IS a possibility. The ferret would have horrible runs long before getting Vit A toxicity. One of the Vit A dangers is Cod Liver Oil. CLO is very high in Vit A and if feed that frequently along with a raw diet (which included liver) then that would be a possible route to Vit A Toxicity. That is why we do not advocate using CLO Your menu looks good. One thing that I would recommend is trying to work in maybe some chicken thighs for some meals instead of wings. They are usually similar in cost, but the darker meats have more taurine, which will be good for Fez. He may have trouble with the thigh bones at first, but if you whack and break them with a cleaver, hammer, or meat tenderizer mallet, he should be able to do the rest.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 23, 2014 14:33:31 GMT -5
2lb heart, 1 lb liver, 1lb organ, for the whole week? Between your three... or for one? Is 2oz heart too much for one meal..? I think I measured out 2oz of liver as well, for each meal..
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Post by kraesmom on Nov 23, 2014 19:59:14 GMT -5
Oh no no no...just per batch. I freeze it in ice cube trays and once frozen, pop them out into a gallon freezer bag. One meal for my three boys is about 4 cubes. Today, I made about three blenders full of organ/liver/cow tongue puree and am freezing it for future use. That way, I don't have to do that unpleasant task as often. I also spent about three hours chunking up two turkeys and bagging them up in 5oz meals. I think I got about 110 3-ferret sized meals out of the two turkeys for about $25. :thumbsup: Makes me not feel so bad when I buy them some quail or rabbit!
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Post by Deleted on Nov 23, 2014 21:04:24 GMT -5
That's a pretty good price for that many meals! I must be way over feeding! Haha.
I don't have a blender to puree anything, but he's happy to eat it in chunks, I just need to figure out how much to give him as one meal. I like the ice cube idea though.
I finally found some beef kidney today! So I've finally got another organ to go with the liver, just gotta cut it all up still and figure out portions.
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Post by kraesmom on Nov 23, 2014 23:47:16 GMT -5
Well, to figure out how much he eats, you can weigh his food before and after he eats. I try to put enough food in the cage that there is just a tiny bit left by the next meal. That way, I know they've had enough to eat so they aren't hungry, but we don't have lots wasted either.
As for the red skin, I've been reading your other thread. Does the rash come and go, or is it there all the time? Is it always in the same place? Do you use a flea preventative? Do you want to try an elimination diet? I would recommend that you take out all of fez's bedding and wash it in "free" detergent. Something without perfumes or colors.
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