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Post by Deleted on Apr 29, 2013 18:28:04 GMT -5
Basically you take the daily weight they are eating per day and multiply it be how many bone in meals and boneless meals you need per week (based on feeding once per day or twice per day). If you look back in the previous posts the number of meals of each is listed. ^ so based upon what you said in your earlier post i multiplied 5 by 9 and then four as i fill the girls bowl twice per day so they are fed two times a day... so i assume that means two meals? or is it one because they are fed the same batch twice daily? blegh anyway... i cam up with 180??? surely they won't eat 180oz between them per week? i'm feeling very stupid... but maybe you could write down how you figure it out? i'm sorry for my stupid-ness... half asleep
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Post by bitbyter on Apr 29, 2013 19:06:02 GMT -5
WEEKLY MENU:Weight of food they are eating per day = daily food by weight (currently 5 oz, last time I did this you said 3 oz)** 4 x daily food by weight (5 oz) of Bone In Meats = 20 oz 2 x daily food by weight (5 oz) of Boneless Meats = 10 oz 1 x daily food by weight (5 oz) of Heart = 5 oz 2 oz of liver x number of ferrets = 4 oz 2 oz of other organ x number of ferrets = 4 oz Your daily food by weight is going to change over time based on their age, the season, activity level, etc. Basically if there is no food left / stashed by the next day then you should increase the daily food by weight by a bit to make sure they are getting all they need. If there always appears to be leftovers or they aren't clearing out their stashes by the next day then you can probably cut back (if I find one or two pieces I am Ok with it, if I find more I cut back). When you cut back, don't cut back on Organs as that amount is fixed.** Technically we should be subtracting a bit of the daily food by weight to include the organ amounts, but this way you have bit extra in your menu plan if their appetite increases. It is always better to have a bit extra on hand than not enough. SUPPLEMENTS:1 egg per ferret per week as a treat (increase to 2 during shedding season). This is optional (though they are very nutritious). There is some new evidence that raw egg can assist in passing hair through their systems. 1/2 tsp of pumpkin every day or every other day per ferret (increase to 1 tsp per ferret every day during shedding season). Not optional as it assists in cleaning out the intestines and aids in good bowel movements. Ground Eggshell or Human Grade Bone Meal. A few pinches on their meat if you feel they are being lazy about eating their bones (just chewing the meat off and not crunching them up to eat them). This is based on observation. 1/2 tsp of oil (salmon, extra virgin olive oil, anchovies oil, etc - should not contain any other ingredients) each every two or three days as a coat supplement. Optional if they are getting a decent amount of fat in their diet. I think that's about as clear as I can make it. I always did find the "meals" thing a bit confusing. I think it's easier if you just go by how much they are eating per day by weight. I thought of another protein source you could look into at your pet store. Ferrets will eat insects & worms. If you want I could try and get some more information for you on this if the prices are reasonable at your pet store.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 30, 2013 18:12:03 GMT -5
hey just thought i'd pop in to mention that panda is evil anywayyy... just noticed the whole increase to 1 tsp per ferret every day during shedding seasoni haven't been doing that... oops!!! best get to it!!! also, would it be ideal to warm it up first in the microwave or something? i was thinking maybe they could have a bowl of egg mixed with 1tsp pumpkin as their treat before bed??? would they be into that do you think or just mix it with their breakfast bowl of numblies??? is it true that you can feed the whole egg? i was under the impression that egg whites were baaaaddddd..... so could you clear that up for me pleasies??? it would save me a lot of $$$ not having to keep buying eggs because the egg yolk bursts when i'm trying to clean off the egg white also... egg should be raw, right?... can i give them egg pumpkin and oil each day without it making them icky??? i want to make sure they are healthy ^_^ and is eggshell still ok even if they are crunching bones? i want to make sure they are getting enough... i'm finding less and less bones left over lately! still fedding them 5oz of mixed batch every meal, they still require refill before bed and it seems to be gone by morning or just a teensy bit leftover. is this good or should i increase??? anyway... i will stop asking so many questions now oh wait! last one! what kind of brush can i/should i use to brush my girls??? thought it might be nice for bonding ^_^ also; how is Wilma doing? byes! xxx
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Post by bitbyter on Apr 30, 2013 19:27:17 GMT -5
hey just thought i'd pop in to mention that panda is evil anywayyy... just noticed the whole increase to 1 tsp per ferret every day during shedding season i haven't been doing that... oops!!! best get to it!!! also, would it be ideal to warm it up first in the microwave or something? Doesn't matter to the ferrets as far as I have seen. i was thinking maybe they could have a bowl of egg mixed with 1tsp (each) pumpkin as their treat before bed??? would they be into that do you think or just mix it with their breakfast bowl of numblies??? is it true that you can feed the whole egg? i was under the impression that egg whites were baaaaddddd..... They are only bad if you feed them without the yolk. Egg whites prevent the absorption of a specific nutrient but there is so much in the yolk that it doesn't matter. so could you clear that up for me pleasies??? it would save me a lot of $$$ not having to keep buying eggs because the egg yolk bursts when i'm trying to clean off the egg white also... egg should be raw, right?... Yes, raw eggs (you can give boiled but there is a chance they may not eat the yolk). I would only advise feeding eggs a few times a week. No really reason as to why but my subconscious says everyday would be to much. can i give them egg pumpkin and oil each day without it making them icky??? i want to make sure they are healthy ^_^ and is eggshell still ok even if they are crunching bones? I only give it if they are being lazy about eating their bones. i want to make sure they are getting enough... i'm finding less and less bones left over lately! That's great! still fedding them 5oz of mixed batch every meal, they still require refill before bed and it seems to be gone by morning or just a teensy bit leftover. is this good or should i increase??? I'd try increasing to 6 oz and see how much you have left over. anyway... i will stop asking so many questions now oh wait! last one! what kind of brush can i/should i use to brush my girls??? thought it might be nice for bonding ^_^ They should have cat brushes at your pet store.Glad that the gizzards are Duck. You have the minimum variety in your diet at this point. I'd like to see one other type of bone in meat but I don't really know what to suggest at this point due to food costs where you are.also; how is Wilma doing? She's Ok but it's a bit of a mystery at this point as her one foot is fine now but the other one is now swollen. Vet has no idea at this point as to what is going on.byes! xxx
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Post by Deleted on Apr 30, 2013 20:46:03 GMT -5
lol Wilma is a worry isn't she! i warmed up a bowl of pumpkin, there was just over two tsp so i just used it all. and i added two egg yolks and mixed it all up... the girls loved it!!! thinking i will do this once or twice per week. i will start adding a bit more pumpkin to their daily batch (gotta buy more pumpkin, can't find canned!!!) i've been searching for another source of bone in... but i'm either coming up with big $$$ or just a blank... i did find ox tails but i'm pretty sure you said they'd be too hard... ummmm...... lets see.... i did find wallaby but that was very expensive, quail is much cheaper. there was also wallaby mince which was a tiny bit cheaper but i'm not really comfortable with that butcher, i have never purchased from there before... i did find another source of bone in but it's in Hobart so not really an option i will keep looking, i will also ask on facebook too. i will start increasing their daily meals to 6oz and see where that goes regarding leftovers shall let you know, i was wondering if i need to add more bone in? their batches for this week and the next only contain 13.5oz bone in... and 6oz muscle meats... is that enough??? wasn't sure lol still struggling with the guide you gave me, i'm a bit dumb when it comes to mathematics give Wilma and Socks my love!
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Post by bitbyter on Apr 30, 2013 22:22:48 GMT -5
If you have having trouble with the math see if your boyfriend can give you a hand as it is something you really need to be able to figure out on your own when the amount of food they are eating changes. It is the only way you can determine if you are giving them enough. Currently if they are eating 5 oz it should be 20 oz of bone in and 10 oz of boneless per week for the two of them.
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Post by Deleted on May 2, 2013 6:55:33 GMT -5
lol i think i was sleepy, i showed my man and asked him to help and he just laughed and said go back to bed sable and panda are eating about 4oz now, is it normal for i to jump all over the place like that??? still struggling to find another bone source, but shall keep looking
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Post by bitbyter on May 2, 2013 8:29:54 GMT -5
Yes, they self regulate but they should eventually settle on a normal range. If they are less active on a certain day they might eat less. If they have been playing a lot they could eat more. Keep posting what they are eating each day and we should have you graduated in no time.
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Post by Deleted on May 3, 2013 6:50:14 GMT -5
oh no! you can't break free from me that easily ;p off topic question; i need tips for controlling the scent of my girls, i was permitted to get them provided that my house mates weren't bothered by the scent but since beginning raw feeding they have begun to smell more ferret like, which personally i am loving, but my room mates are getting fed up and i don't want to have to say goodbye to my girls and i can't afford to move... help?
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Post by bitbyter on May 3, 2013 7:25:58 GMT -5
Tell them it is temporary and to please be patient. Kibble fed ferrets dextox all the crap they built up in their systems from the kibble when they are switched to raw. I think I noticed the temporary increase in smell for a week or two if I remember correctly. Kind of like nip training, it gets worse before it gets better. Other than that all you can do is make sure you are washing their bedding weekly and keeping those litter boxes scooped daily (both of these are very important to keep their smell down). Believe me, when they are done detoxing they will smell about 75% less than they did when they were on kibble. Some people also purchase air filters for the ferret room but I don't think it's necessary as long as the bedding is washed regularly and litter boxes are kept clean. Oh, and make sure you find all those stashes!! Please keep posting the daily amounts they are eating and what they ate. If you want to keep a weekly log and then post it at the end of the week that works as well. Also, whatever you do, don't bathe them!! If you bathe them with any kind of soap or shampoo it will strip the oils out of their fur / skin and their oil production will go into overdrive and make them smell worse!!
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Post by Deleted on May 3, 2013 20:46:24 GMT -5
oh... i thought bathing them was good?... i don't bathe them often but they keep rolling in yucky stuff! but i was using ferret shampoo... should i just be using a damp cloth instead??? i have noticed that they eat a bit less lately but i'm still giving them 5oz just so i can e sure they have enough. yesterday morning their bowl was filled with 5oz of my mixed batch, and this morning there is STILL a teensy bit left over. a tsp worth at most. they weren't very active yesterday as i was helping a friend move house and my man had work, so they mostly slept... but i am concerned... is this just because they had a lazy day??? also (sorry if i've asked this before) but their meat seems to smell rather awful to me, i don't know how to tell if its gone bad, but they still seem to eat it... how can i tell if it's still ok? is it normal to smell so icky? and thanks for the smell tips bedding washing is weekly and poop is removed twice a day. so i guess i'm doing all i can? also would burning incense in my room, where they are kept, harm them at all? i was requested to do so to mask their scent i did it and they seemed fine, curios about the smell, but fine... will it hurt them at all??? and also thought i'd mention that i got all excited over a source of turkey... until i realised it was in melbourne still searching though it's probably right in front of me and i'm just blind
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Post by bitbyter on May 3, 2013 22:31:51 GMT -5
oh... i thought bathing them was good?... Unfortunately no i don't bathe them often but they keep rolling in yucky stuff! but i was using ferret shampoo... should i just be using a damp cloth instead??? Yes, really the only reason to bathe them is if they get into something nasty. Then just use a damp cloth as you guessed.i have noticed that they eat a bit less lately but i'm still giving them 5oz just so i can e sure they have enough. yesterday morning their bowl was filled with 5oz of my mixed batch, and this morning there is STILL a teensy bit left over. a tsp worth at most. they weren't very active yesterday as i was helping a friend move house and my man had work, so they mostly slept... but i am concerned... is this just because they had a lazy day??? Most likely. I'd really only worry if there was 1 oz or more left everyday for a few days or if the bowl is emptied everyday for a few days. In those cases then you should think about adjusting your amounts. They do self-regulate based on activity. If there is a lot left over multiple days, that's when you start observing to see if there are any signs of possible illness.also (sorry if i've asked this before) but their meat seems to smell rather awful to me, i don't know how to tell if its gone bad, but they still seem to eat it... how can i tell if it's still ok? is it normal to smell so icky? When you get it from the store it really shouldn't smell much at all and should be good in the fridge for a day or two. After 24 hrs at room temp it probably will have an "off" smell (which is why you pull any leftovers and toss it). Flushing it down the toilet is the best way to dispose of smelly meat. Raw lamb tends to have more of a scent than beef or chicken when fresh. All meat smells nasty when it is "off". I take it you don't cook with much meat? and thanks for the smell tips bedding washing is weekly and poop is removed twice a day. so i guess i'm doing all i can? also would burning incense in my room, where they are kept, harm them at all? i was requested to do so to mask their scent i did it and they seemed fine, curios about the smell, but fine... will it hurt them at all??? hmmm, I'm not sure. I know essential oils can be a problem but I'm not sure about incense. Post about it on the FB page as you will probably get a quicker response there than on the forum.and also thought i'd mention that i got all excited over a source of turkey... until i realised it was in melbourne still searching though it's probably right in front of me and i'm just blind Just because you don't see something out at a grocery store or butcher shop, doesn't mean they can't get it for you. Ask them if they can order it and what the price would be.
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Post by Deleted on May 4, 2013 1:29:07 GMT -5
shall answer you shortly, just had a bit of a panic and need advice... sable just threw up everywhere moments after eating. i've separated her with food and water to monitor her, panda is showing no signs of illness. sable threw up in three different places whilst running around making her distressed noise, at first i thought she and panda were fighting until i heard her gag... she is gulping down water and ignoring food. i am going to post on the facebook page. i will update you of any changes. i will also tag you in my post on facebook as i will upload pics of the puke just in case. i'm scared
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Post by Deleted on May 4, 2013 8:25:56 GMT -5
Hey, I'm back. Quick update; Sable is fine. was unable to weigh them today so shall do it tomorrow. now... to business... brace yourself! ... i was wondering some things... i was trying to think of ways to make this raw feeding thing go a little more smoothly... currently i am undergoing a process in which i make up batches of food based on per week, and keep this batch in the fridge over a week... sadly, the meat seems to be going bad towards the end of the week and i worked out a better program for them... again, brace yourself... so; taken from your previous post; 4 x daily food by weight (5 oz) of Bone In Meats = 20 oz
2 x daily food by weight (5 oz) of Boneless Meats = 10 oz
1 x daily food by weight (5 oz) of Heart = 5 oz
2 oz of liver x number of ferrets = 4 oz
2 oz of other organ x number of ferrets = 4 oz
but... this is inaccurate... i realised today that i am not feeding them 5oz per day,,, it's 5oz per MEAL... not exactly though, in the morning i top up their bowl with somewhere between 5oz and 5.10oz (it's hard to get it dead on 5oz) usually their bowl is empty by the time i go to bed, or just a teensy bit left over. at which point i scoop their bowl contents out and put them back into the weekly batch and mix it all up to dish them out a new batch of 5oz (probably a bad idea...) which would mean that every 24 hours they consume roughly 10oz... not 5oz... but that being said, a fair bit does get hoarded and goes off and as a result is thrown out... which would mean they aren't getting everything they need per week!!! ARGH!!! anywayyy... few ideas and questions to present, feel free to tell me they're amazing or awful ok, idea one; instead of making up weekly batches of food and storing it all in the same container, i shall do this; every pay day, which occurs fortnightly, i go to my butcher and supermarket... i will purchase a bag of chicken wings and necks, hopefully equalling somewhere around a kilo a large piece of gravy beef and a bag of duck giblets 2 lamb hearts a lamb liver 3-4 lamb kidneys a pumpkin (cannot locate canned) a dozen eggs i will make up batches of food per week which currently consist of the following (which may or may not need correcting? ) 13.5oz bone in meats(chicken wings and chicken necks) 6oz muscle meats (duck giblets and gravy beef) 4oz lamb heart 4oz lamb liver 4oz lamb kidney then separate the batch into zip-lock bags, one for each day... then freeze them but keep two in the fridge, and then each night pull out another one to defrost so that the meat is ready but isn't left too long in the fridge... i was thinking of maintaining a shedule, i feed them 5oz into their bowl at 8am, i leave to go to uni to study at 8.45am and return around 5pm usually, then i weigh their leftover food after checking their cage hoarding places (as they would not be out of their cage whilst i was not home) and put it back into the fridge for later, then let them out for their play time when i arrive home and don't lock them back away until they are sleepy, which likely wouldn't be until around 7pm, then i was thinking i would feed them the rest of the days food which should be around 5oz and leave it with them overnight... then the next morning i weigh it again, toss any leftovers and start off with a fresh days' batch... my concern here is; 13.5+6+4+4+4=31.5... if my girls are eating almost 10oz per day(i am still in the process of weighing this, it's difficult because they have a secret hoarding place which has just been discovered!) 31.5 will not cover a week worth... it would need to be 70oz... my next concern is this... if i am tossing leftovers from certain days... surely this will mean they aren't getting what they need per week?! but it will go off if i keep it in their cage... which is better? to risk off meat or risk them not getting enough? or should i start using supplements? now, i was also thinking that every day, probably overnight, they would get their "treat" which is warmed pumpkin mixed with egg yolk, they love this! and it will move things along... will this be ok daily? or maybe every second day??? i was planning to give them 1egg yolk mixed with 1tsp pumpkin (cooked and pureed)to share. or should it be each??? also, i cannot find salmon oil! but i was hoping you could suggest something else, i will keep looking of course... but i was thinking of adding a tsp of this to their daily treat? anywayyyy.... that's basically all the ideas i had... lemme know what you think!!! shall answer your previous post now too
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Post by Deleted on May 4, 2013 8:32:26 GMT -5
ok, answering your post now... damp cloth... got it! is it good to bath them at all, ever? can i just fill up the tub with some plain water and stick them in there? it's fun for me and funny too ^_^ but i dont mind a wet cloth if i'm just using a cloth, should i just wipe them down once a week on nail trimming/ear cleaning day? (sunday) their bowl jumps everywhere, it's either got a teensy bit left or is empty, it's more often empty which is a reason why i was considering increasing to 7oz per meal... but they seem to be eating just under 5oz today so blegh just gonna keep weighing also i should apologise for not posting their daily weights of food, i probs won't have time to post it every day but will do my best to make it regular, at least every second day! i'm not using anymore incense after miss sable decided to puke everywhere!!! scared the poop out of me... (not literally!) so, let's not worry bout that ^_^ and have asked stores and butchers, no one can get turkey! grrr.... anywayyyy... i'm falling asleep at my desk... hugs and kisses for Socks and Wilma! and you too! xxx
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