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Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2012 1:26:47 GMT -5
The rabbit isn't too bad, it's just that Bandit is eating SO MUCH. I pay about $6 for a rabbit which can yield anywhere from 8oz to 12oz depending on how bony it is. Right now we have them on pork organs and I pay about $4-$5 for a package of organs. So, for what Bandit has been averaging in soupie a week (going by the past few days) we have to buy 2 rabbits and 1 package of organs for $18 (which makes 2 batches of soupie for the week). I did the math by multiplying this by 3 each week for when Pogo and Mischief are finally on board.
What do you typically buy and how much does it cost you?
So far Bandit has been good with rabbit and pork. I think the next time I have a day off I'll make a batch of rabbit meat with beef organs and see how that goes (as the one time he had beef he kept throwing up, though that may have been due to other cicumstances). I have LOTS of protein options at my House of Meats, but I figured it would be best to maintain a consistent soupie for now while they are still getting used to it. I will eventually work back to chicken which will make things cheaper, but for now we are still avoiding that protein. The only catch is that even though I have LOTS of protein choices, there aren't many organ choices.
I meant to ask before, when you use store bought meat do you immediately feed it to your girls or do you let it stay in the freezer for a few weeks first? I ask because I hear people saying to freeze meats for a while to eliminate any parasites. I know this is typically for FRESH meat, but does this also apply to frozen meat you buy at the store, or for that matter, non-frozen meat you buy in the store?
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Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2012 2:33:44 GMT -5
Before Nyxie, I spent about $30 a month to feed 3 females. They eat about 2-3 oz each a day. My bone in meats are cornish game hen, chicken, and the occassional turkey neck. I use whole chickens which are about $1.29 a lb, and cornish game hen are about $2.4 a lb.
Beef, pork, and turkey make up my boneless meats. I pay about $2 a lb for beef and pork, and about $2.50 a lb for turkey. I typically buy these at save a lot because they have really cheap meat.
I do not freeze meat from the grocery store unless I don't have time to cut it up and prepare before it goes bad. The freezing before applies only to game meat really.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 16, 2012 23:23:23 GMT -5
So after reading a lot of threads on raw fed ferrets I keep seeing things pop up that raw feeders feed their ferts - like daily pumpkin, certain oils, vitamins/minerals, etc. So when I feed a soupie do I need to add anything else to their diet, or is the soupie enough until we get them to full raw? I'm sure I'll be asking this same question when I make it to that point (if Pogo and Mischief will ever LET us get to that point). OK, so this update will be similar to all those before. I will say that I am starting to understand what Sherry means when she talks about us going 1 step foward then 2 steps back when starting the switch though. Over the past 2 weeks I've gotten Pogo and Mischief to eat a little raw from the bowl, but if I miss a day due to work or I make a new batch we have to start ALL OVER. Today, it was all I could do to even get them to TRY the soupie I did manage to get Pogo to eat about a teaspoon full, but only after I put a little pumpkin on the top of the soupie, but at least he ate it from the bowl. We'll just have to keep working on it. I just hate makin them go hungry. Today they went without food for about 10hrs (of course fighting the soupie the whole time). As for Bandit - he is still going strong on nothing but soupie! Yesterday he ate a whopping 8-9oz Today, however, he only ate about 4oz. Is this normal? I know he'll eventually level out but I don't think it should be happening in a weeks time should it? We gave him plenty of soupe on multiple occassions, but he just wouldn't eat it all. Although, he is starting to tell me when he's hungry now. Typically, I've just been offering a bowl of soupie every time he gets up, but today he actually went to the feeding spots and either gave me 'belly' or sniffed at his brother's kibble bowl then looked up at me. Too cute! I want to add though that my boy is becoming a chunky monkey He hasn't blown his coat yet, and I don't think he's necessarily gaining his winter weight yet, but over the past month and a-half he has gained nearly a pound!!! And I think most of this has been over the past couple of weeks! After Gir died and we took the boys in for a BG test before starting the raw switch Bandit weighed about 2.5lbs. Today I weighed him and he is at 3.3lbs!!! He is SO heavy! I swear I thought he weighed a LOT more!
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Post by Deleted on Sept 16, 2012 23:47:38 GMT -5
OK, quick update to the update - So either Bandit felt really bad today or he was playing me cause he just ate another 2oz, making 6oz for the day, which is about what he's been averaging.
I did have another question - Bandit has been gradually getting bad breath since we've had him, but I don't really see any plaque build up, but his breath is WAY worse now that we are feeding him the raw - is this normal? I NOW know that he himself and his poopies will be super stinky for a while (man does he ever REEK, my poor baby), so does his breath factor into this as well?
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Post by Deleted on Sept 17, 2012 0:30:24 GMT -5
Vitamins/oils arent necessary, but they can be beneficial. As for adding it in now I wouldn't worry about it unless you already have the stuff on hand. I try to give salmon oil daily because my Pixies coat is pretty rough looking. Pumpkin can be given daily, 1/2 tsp per ferret. And just so you know, their appetites will fluctuate. Some days my girls barely touch their food. Unless you see some other symptoms I wouldn't worry about it And for the breath. The only thing I can think of is the lack of bones maybe? Bacteria cause bad breath, and raw has quite a bit of bacteria, so maybe the lack of bones is causing it? Could it be related to his stone issue? I know it's tough getting them to try it, but they'll get there just keep at it, you're doing amazing and I know we'll get there soon
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Post by Deleted on Sept 19, 2012 1:31:19 GMT -5
OK, so a couple more questions - 1) Is it normal for raw-fed ferret poops to almost look bloody? Rabbit is light colored, even with the organs, so Bandit's poopies have been on the lighter side, but they often have a reddish tinge to them - not like straight blood but like blood was mixed in somewhere. 2) Since soupie is kept in the fridge, what can I do to warm it up? I do microwave it for about 10-12 seconds per 1-2oz, but lately I have been noticing that the raw is cooking and clumping together, so I guess we'll be giving lukewarm soupies. But is this 'clumped' soup bad for Bandit? 3) Should the poopies look almost the same as it did going in? Bandit's poopies often look like he just took a small ball of soupie, wrapped it in a lil package, and sat it down on the floor near his booty. Could this mean he isn't processing the food properly? 4) Should I be giving something like a probiotic during the switch to help their systems deal with the new load of bacteria coming from their new food?
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Post by Deleted on Sept 19, 2012 13:16:57 GMT -5
Man I just lost a huge post! Anyway I'll try to recap as much as I remember. Poops will be dark now that you've added liver/organs. That is perfectly normal. If you are concerned about his stools, posting a pic would be the best way to gauge the issue. Could the reddish be some pumpkin maybe tinged with brown? For making soups warm I do one of two thiings. 1) Leave soup on countertop until room temp and then add a little hot water. or 2) put container of soup into hot water and let sit for a while. Microwaving should be fine but the "clumping" is the meat cooking. My kids don't really like that so I usually avoid teh microwave. But it is harmless and won't hurt your baby The probiotic isn't necessary, but you can add it if you'd like. Most ferrets adjust fine without it
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Post by Deleted on Sept 21, 2012 1:09:25 GMT -5
OK, so we've hit a roadblock. Bandit is still good with the soupie, and he even eats the chunks my blender leaves behind like a champ (though if they are too big he will spit them out)! But Pogo and Mischief are still in their rut. We ARE able to get them to eat some on their own without a fight now, but every time we make a new batch we often end up at square one again. For most of the week this week we have held back their kibble for the day and pushed the raw on them, but it's always the same - they will eat about 1/2 tsp to MAYBE 1tsp in a sitting each, but they will only do this at best twice in a day. SO essentially they are going about 10 hours with no kibble and only at best 1oz of food. I just don't know where to go from here. The only idea we've come up with is for my BF to take their kibble out of the cage when he leaves for school in the morning (which won't be easy as they'll want to get up then and Momma WON'T as she gets to bed much later than Papa). Then, I'll be able to make them raw for breakfast and lunch and only have to put the kibble back in the cage at night and/or when we go to work. I swear, it just seems like we just can't get these boys switched!
On another note, we are talking about at least getting them back on Zupreem to maybe avert any problems their current kibble might be causing in relation to the stones. My only worry here is that Bandit might eat some since he liked it so much before, and he can't have any chicken based kibble.
Also, I posted a thread tonight in the Emergency section concerning Bandit and his poos today. It is titled 'Very little poopie with frequent potties'. I'm rather concerned about Bandit tonight. He has tried to poo MULTIPLE times over the past several hours and has only produced tiny pencil eraser size poos part of the time, sometimes nothing, and sometimes only a string of clear mucous. I fed him pumpkin because I felt his poos were just so small and squishy and it all came out great, but now we are having problems. I'm trying to make sure he is at least urinating, but with the places he is going on it is difficult to tell if he actually is. Of course I'm going to be worried about this due to his current stones.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 23, 2012 2:44:59 GMT -5
Still working with Pogo and Mischief (it is hard to do soupie on the weekends as my BF and I work a TON Fri-Mon). Will update you later this week when we try a different tactic. As for Bandit - I think the Metacam is making him feel a bit better. Over the past few days he's only been eating about 5oz when he had been eating about 6-8oz. Yesterday, he would barely touch his food until later in the evening many hours after the metacam. After the metacam he CHOWED down, same for today. He's still having side effects from the gastroenteritis (trying to potty a lot), but it isn't quite as frequent, and he doesn't seem to be in any pain. I just hope this stuff will pass so he's not so uncomfortable. On a side note - Bandit is becoming a HUGE baby and totally playing his Mom! More and more he keeps acting like he doesn't want to eat even though I know he must be hungry (I don't leave the soupie out; instead I just feed him randomly throughout the day). So of course I either dip my finger in the soup and bring it to his mouth or I use a spoon, and OF COURSE he's hungry then ;D Needless to say, I am obviously getting played and he is using his cute, sickie tactics on Momma so she'll baby him Should I not feed him with a spoon though? I don't want him to keep up this habit, but he really is rather stubborn and won't eat sometimes unless I do actually baby him.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 23, 2012 12:19:44 GMT -5
Instead of using a spoon, try just bringing his face to the bowl, or gently scruffing him when he's near the food. That usually works for my Pixie. Lol they are TOO smart for their own good.
As for your other boys, I think it'd be a good idea to get them off the kibble that's causing the issues. And definitely see if you can get some morning soups into them, since that's when they'll be most hungry.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 23, 2012 16:25:43 GMT -5
So my BF decided to ignore the fact that the boys might have eaten kibble before he got them out of the cage and fed them raw immediately - But it worked!!! (So glad nobody threw up though). Anywho, they are eating the soup from the bowl (with a little extra pumpkin on top only though), which is awesome, but still they only eat about a teaspoon to a tablespoon at a time. So far today I think they've only had about 2oz each at best. I'm sure I can probably get another ounce or two in them, but will this be enough? We are thinking about holding their kibble thru the night, but do you think they are eating enough to do that? Or should we just try the raw throughout the day and put the kibble in the cage at night?
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Post by Deleted on Sept 23, 2012 16:39:27 GMT -5
If they are eating from the bowl, I would say go ahead and try taking the kibble away.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 25, 2012 0:21:02 GMT -5
So we are ALMOST there!!! Yesterday Pogo and Mischief started to like the raw (thanx to my BF finally helping out and forcing it on them when I wasn't available). Today they are eating out of the bowl with very little help (just a single finger lick and they are good to go). Both days we only left the kibble in their cage at night for about 6 hours and while we were at work/school (simply because we were both gone for nearly 9 hours) - which we did because even though they are liking the raw they are still only eating about 3oz a day right now and I didn't want them to go too hungry. HOWEVER, tonight they have taken a HUGE turn and are taking to the raw like champs. UNFORTUNATELY, we weren't calculating in the AMOUNT they would all eat in a day so we ran out tonight before I feel they were full. Here is the problem now - if we go by how much Bandit is currently eating (6-7oz a day) and multiply that by 3 we have 24oz a day. That equals nearly 3 BATCHES!!! To make a long story short I have calculated that we will need 9 rabbits and 4 packs of pork organs to make enough soupy to last 1 single week, which totals $85 A WEEK and about 9 hours of prep time (we have to butcher the rabbits - they are cleaned but still whole) Needless to say this is going to be a huge burden as it adds up to $300 more a month than we currently spend and probably 3 days of prep a week. We are going to have to figure something else out here. But if we change up their primary meat will we have to start all the way back at square one again??? That would S U C K!!! Also, if they seem to be taking well to the soupie does that mean they won't eat the kibble anymore? I haven't noticed Bandit touching the stuff, but I wonder about Pogo and Mischief because I really do worry about them eating enough right now. And even though I HATE the kibble, I'd rather them eat a little if they were hungry. I've already seen Bandit dry heave due to hunger and it really bothered me (this was the day we took him to the vet - he wasn't feeling well and wasn't eating so he went nearly 15 hours without any food).
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Post by Deleted on Sept 25, 2012 0:26:39 GMT -5
Oh yeah - depending on how much they eat in the morning I may hold their kibble for the day, but I'll make that decision in the morn. However, since I don't work until Wed night I think I'll probably hold the kibble Tues nite and feed only raw throughout Wed and Thurs and then see what comes Friday. By the weekend I hope to leave the kibble out all together. It will be hard for them Fri and Sat though as my BF and I work at least 9 hours each nite. I'll try to cram as much soupie down them as I can before we leave, but depending on how much they actually eat we MIGHT have to leave the kibble in the cage. I REALLY hope we won't have to go that route, but we'll have to wait and see how they do over the next few days. Unless you have any better ideas !?!?!?!?!?!
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Post by Deleted on Sept 25, 2012 1:25:36 GMT -5
So we are ALMOST there!!! Yesterday Pogo and Mischief started to like the raw (thanx to my BF finally helping out and forcing it on them when I wasn't available). Today they are eating out of the bowl with very little help (just a single finger lick and they are good to go). Both days we only left the kibble in their cage at night for about 6 hours and while we were at work/school (simply because we were both gone for nearly 9 hours) - which we did because even though they are liking the raw they are still only eating about 3oz a day right now and I didn't want them to go too hungry. That is GREAT progress! WOW! Great work 3 oz is still a good amount, not all ferrets gorge in the way Bandit is. HOWEVER, tonight they have taken a HUGE turn and are taking to the raw like champs. YAYY!! UNFORTUNATELY, we weren't calculating in the AMOUNT they would all eat in a day so we ran out tonight before I feel they were full. Here is the problem now - if we go by how much Bandit is currently eating (6-7oz a day) and multiply that by 3 we have 24oz a day. That equals nearly 3 BATCHES!!! Wow that is a LOT of money. and a Lot of soup! To make a long story short I have calculated that we will need 9 rabbits and 4 packs of pork organs to make enough soupy to last 1 single week, which totals $85 A WEEK and about 9 hours of prep time (we have to butcher the rabbits - they are cleaned but still whole) O.O Needless to say this is going to be a huge burden as it adds up to $300 more a month than we currently spend and probably 3 days of prep a week. We are going to have to figure something else out here. But if we change up their primary meat will we have to start all the way back at square one again??? Okay, so we need to start exploring alternative meat options. Do you want to maybe try some turkey or pork? I know we are avoiding chicken for now, but that might be a really huge savings when it comes to cost. Whatever protein you feel comfortable with adding in next, I would add it into their current soup, maybe a 75% current soup/25% new protein. See how they react and adjust accordingly. If they reject it, add some more of the normal soup to make it less new stuff. If they accept it fine, just continue to slowly increase the new ratio until its all new soup. That would S U C K!!! Also, if they seem to be taking well to the soupie does that mean they won't eat the kibble anymore? I haven't noticed Bandit touching the stuff, but I wonder about Pogo and Mischief because I really do worry about them eating enough right now. Kibble can be tricky. I know some do successfully feed both, but from my own experience and observations, it seems like ferrets pick one or the other. And if they start eating kibble, they will reject the raw (& vice versa). And even though I HATE the kibble, I'd rather them eat a little if they were hungry. I've already seen Bandit dry heave due to hunger and it really bothered me (this was the day we took him to the vet - he wasn't feeling well and wasn't eating so he went nearly 15 hours without any food). I understand what you mean. I think if you keep up on the switch, they will be on bigger chunks soon, and kibble won't be an issue at that point.
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