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Post by Deleted on Jul 30, 2012 15:53:24 GMT -5
Hey! So, baby Jasmine LOVES the raw mush. When I feed Meeko beside her while she's eating her canned Evo, she will repeatedly come over and try to take some from Meeko's bowl, even though her bowl's not empty yet... Only.... whenever I let have her more than maybe one lick at a time, she throws it up almost instantly. When I got her a a little less than a week ago, she would throw up anything she ate as she was eating too fast. We've worked a lot on that and now she hasn't thrown up her formula milk (almost done, not buying more) in 2 days, and she throw up from her canned only once every 2 days or so (I feed her about 4 meals of canned, and twice of formula a day). But whenever I try to give her what she REALLY wants (the raw), she throws it up every time. Should I try mixing it in with her canned for a bit? Could it be that she's eating the canned and milk better, but she's still going too fast with the raw? Or could it be that even though she wants to eat it, for some reason, her body won't accept it as food? She throws it up, I think, before it makes it to her stomach, or RIGHT after making it... Finally, I know this will be pretty gross sounding, but.... is it "normal" for her to eat her throw up? I mean, I can understand her because of her past (dying left alone outside... she probably got use to eating her throw up for a while to survive...), but is it normal for kittens to do that? Is it ok that I've been letting her to it half the time? Or should I prevent her from doing that? I've also tried giving her some Pure Bites chicken treats. Again, she loved, but threw up, then ate again... I've yet to try and feed her some freeze dried from the ferrets, but I'm certain she's eaten bits from when Lyla leaves her crumbs after "killing" her meat outside the cage, but I've yet to offer some. Should I first try it dry or re-hydrated? Thanks!  I have today joined the "catforum.com" to ask my car related forum, but I don't yet have full access... hence why I'm posting this here also... Thanks in advance! |
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Post by Heather on Jul 30, 2012 16:23:46 GMT -5
Just a thought....and it sounds gross but....let her eat the vomitted meat and see if she pukes it up again. I know, sounds horrible but she may actually lack the enzymes to digest meat. She may need a probiotic. If the food stays down a second time it's almost assured that this is indeed the problem.
Does she vomit all raw? Does it stay down if you mix it with the canned (again points to a digestive problem)? If she can keep it down when mixed can you start to back off the canned without her vomiting giving her enough time
ciao
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Post by Deleted on Jul 30, 2012 16:34:07 GMT -5
Could it not be from the mixture of eating raw with canned food at the same time? Have you just offered her raw without also allowing her the canned food?
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Post by Deleted on Jul 30, 2012 16:44:53 GMT -5
Hey Heather! Thanks for the tip, but... if she were unable to digest meat, she'd be unable to digest the Evo canned, right? Cause she digests that all right, poops come out nice and smelly ;D
So, you're suggesting : let her eat some raw, let her throw it up, then eat it up again. If she keeps it down the 2nd time, she may have the problem you stated, but if she throws it up again she may be "normal"?
I haven't tried to mix it in with her canned yet, as I wasn't sure whether they should be mixed...
And yes JacksMomma, I have tried raw alone (as a between meals treat), or a pre-treat to a meal.
The only time I was able to successfully let her eat raw and for her to not throw it up was when I let her have only one lick, then didn't offer any more... And when I was grinding up my meat, I gave mer tiny amounts (maybe 5) over the period of 10 minutes, and she didn't throw it up that time...
I highly suspect it's because she eats it too fast, but I'm very unsure, as I've never cared for a cat before...
Should I keep trying to get her to eat a meal or raw, or wait a while until she's older? She's only about 6 weeks old... Thanks!
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Post by Heather on Jul 30, 2012 18:44:24 GMT -5
The canned stuff is cooked. Evo is cooked meats....so she can eat cooked meats but not raw.
I've never had a problem with mixing raw with canned, only kibbles.
Young puppies eat regurgitated meats from their momma because they lack the enzymes to eat whole meat. The regurgitated meat is partially digested, making it easier for the pups to digest.
If she throws up the meat after eating it a second time you may be looking at another issue...maybe a sensitivity.
ciao
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Post by Deleted on Jul 30, 2012 20:18:25 GMT -5
Very interesting concept! May that be her case? Since she doesn't have a mom to pre-digest, she may be doing "all the work" on her own?  Today, I let her lick the ferret raw bowl clean after feeding Meeko. There was some left, but very little. She was not sick. I will try again with a tiny spoonful later tonight before her meal before bed. Thanks for that tip, Heather! |
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Post by Heather on Jul 30, 2012 23:01:58 GMT -5
It may be that because of her shaky beginnings her digestive track just hasn't matured as quickly. Another issue might be her near starvation and low weight (you've no idea what state her mother was in either). She may be like starving a person, just can't eat too much of a good thing all at once just yet. Wait until her body can start to process all this good food....then you won't be able to fill her  ciao |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 31, 2012 0:43:07 GMT -5
Wait until her body can start to process all this good food....then you won't be able to fill her I already can't fill her! I have to give her what I "think" would fill her stomac, because she just won't stop if I give her too much, and then she gets sick from over-eating....  But good news! (I think!) I mixed that spoonful of raw into her canned, and she ate it slowly (I have her milk an hour prior to ensure she wouldn't eat too fast), and everything went down great! Maybe I was just trying to push the raw a little too early... I'll give it time and see how things go... slowly |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 31, 2012 7:27:10 GMT -5
This is a long shot but maybe its a learned behavior?
I have a rescue cat (she lives at my inlaws now) who showed up at my family's farm in really bad shape. I brought her home and she did the same thing, eat/vomit/repeat, even after the vet gave her the all-clear.
Watching her I figured out hers was a learned behavior, probably from living rough. I think she learned to eat it and then vomit it up, if she didn't get sick then it was safe to eat and she'd tuck in. Every couple of bites she would repeat the process.
If I distracted her sometimes I was able to stop the process, she liked tummy rubs from her head to her belly in one firm slow motion.
Its been 13 years but she still does this.
Just my two cents worth.
~Kelli
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Post by Deleted on Jul 31, 2012 10:15:25 GMT -5
I had a cat for 16 years that puked up his kibble a lot (ate too quickly) and one of the other cats would always come running over to eat it. She would eat his puke the whole 14 years we had her. Crazy animals can be crazy. She would eat her own vomit as well, though she rarely vomited. I'd find all these hairballs lying around with the puddle of vomit missing. I did appreciate the help cleaning up sometimes.  |
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Post by Heather on Jul 31, 2012 11:13:10 GMT -5
I had a cat that did nothing but vomit his kibbles. He was the reason why I switched to raw feedings. Samurai....he was 12. I had just put his brother down because of diabetes and had brought Samurai in because he was doing nothing but puking (I had gone through just about every kibble I could think of from the very cheap to the ultra expensive). He weighed (if I remember correctly) about 7 lbs...that's light even for a siamese. We did the necessary blood work and it came back as liver/kidney failure. The vet said he might have 6 months but not any more than that to take him home and make him comfortable. He was so thin and emaciated. His coat dry and brittle, eyes were sunken....he looked deathly ill. I asked her at the time was there anything I could do for him, I had just lost his brother I couldn't bear to loose him too. To top it off Ninja (samurai's brother) had been rather like my son's therapy cat. My son has Aspurgers, those cats were his lifeline (and mine) to sanity. She gave me some milk thistle and told me that he was a good age for a kibble cat. She explained that when she first started practice, cats lived forever (not really..... ) now, since the introduction of kibble, 12 or 13 was common with them being seniors by 7 yrs. I asked her then about what should I be feeding....that's when she explained that vets don't really get a nutritional education. That they were taught how to use the Hills products for the different diseases but she hadn't seen any great improvement using it. She told me to go do some research and maybe find a recipe for a cat's diet. She never meant raw, but she didn't say that. I think she thought I would find some cooked diets....instead I found rawcanada on yahoo. At the time, I believe there were 200 members (I believe they're now well over 2000 members now). They were all about dogs but they helped me with my cat the best they could. Samurai stopped puking (still puked up the odd hairball, and projectile vomited anything that had hooves...violently allergic) when he converted to raw. The next time the vet saw Samurai, he was 19 yrs and had taken a bad turn. The vet couldn't believe what she was seeing. Despite being very ill, he weighed in at 11lbs, his coat gleamed and his teeth were clean. She asked what I was feeding, what was the recipe. I told her raw meat....she held up her hand and said "end of discussion". She didn't agree with what I had done and refused to discuss it. She put Samurai on some antibiotics, said he shouldn't be alive anyway and to let her know how he came out. Samurai was finally given his release at age 22 yrs. He was in complete organ failure and was so arthritic I could no longer control his pain. Explain to me how a raw diet isn't appropriate.... ciao |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 31, 2012 12:31:47 GMT -5
I had a cat that did nothing but vomit his kibbles. He was the reason why I switched to raw feedings. Samurai....he was 12. I had just put his brother down because of diabetes and had brought Samurai in because he was doing nothing but puking (I had gone through just about every kibble I could think of from the very cheap to the ultra expensive). He weighed (if I remember correctly) about 7 lbs...that's light even for a siamese. We did the necessary blood work and it came back as liver/kidney failure. The vet said he might have 6 months but not any more than that to take him home and make him comfortable. He was so thin and emaciated. His coat dry and brittle, eyes were sunken....he looked deathly ill. I asked her at the time was there anything I could do for him, I had just lost his brother I couldn't bear to loose him too. To top it off Ninja (samurai's brother) had been rather like my son's therapy cat. My son has Aspurgers, those cats were his lifeline (and mine) to sanity. She gave me some milk thistle and told me that he was a good age for a kibble cat. She explained that when she first started practice, cats lived forever (not really..... ) now, since the introduction of kibble, 12 or 13 was common with them being seniors by 7 yrs. I asked her then about what should I be feeding....that's when she explained that vets don't really get a nutritional education. That they were taught how to use the Hills products for the different diseases but she hadn't seen any great improvement using it. She told me to go do some research and maybe find a recipe for a cat's diet. She never meant raw, but she didn't say that. I think she thought I would find some cooked diets....instead I found rawcanada on yahoo. At the time, I believe there were 200 members (I believe they're now well over 2000 members now). They were all about dogs but they helped me with my cat the best they could. Samurai stopped puking (still puked up the odd hairball, and projectile vomited anything that had hooves...violently allergic) when he converted to raw. The next time the vet saw Samurai, he was 19 yrs and had taken a bad turn. The vet couldn't believe what she was seeing. Despite being very ill, he weighed in at 11lbs, his coat gleamed and his teeth were clean. She asked what I was feeding, what was the recipe. I told her raw meat....she held up her hand and said "end of discussion". She didn't agree with what I had done and refused to discuss it. She put Samurai on some antibiotics, said he shouldn't be alive anyway and to let her know how he came out. Samurai was finally given his release at age 22 yrs. He was in complete organ failure and was so arthritic I could no longer control his pain. Explain to me how a raw diet isn't appropriate.... ciao My vet is mystified how the UK ferrets are so much healthier than the ones over here in the US, how they don't get adrenal etc. She wondered aloud why. I told her flat out it was diet- lack of kibble crap, kept outside away from lights and late altering, if any. The only point she seemed to agree on was the later altering. Whatever. Vets are so stupid in this country now a days, pushing kibble and pills. Do what I ask you to for my pet lady, it's my money. If I want a des implant in a healthy ferret as an attempted preventative measure for adrenal, it should be my choice as long as it's not hurting the animal. |
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Post by goingpostal on Jul 31, 2012 14:57:38 GMT -5
Is she regurgitating it right away or vomiting it up later? Have you tried the raw alone, no canned? My cat you can't mix the two, she'll yak but separate is fine.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 31, 2012 18:24:08 GMT -5
Wow! Thanks for all those! I'll try to answer it all  I don't think it's "learned" for her to throw up ( I think she eats too fast, because she's throwing up much less now.. .still gags, but hasn't thrown up in almost 2 days!  ). But I do 100% agree that eating the throw up is probably learned from her hard beginnings where water and food were VERY hard to come by... She probably learned to eat up whatever came out as a survival method... Poor thing  Heather, I 100% agree!! I believe Meeko is another of those cases where they're supposed to be leaving, but then a switch to raw happens and Poof! The pet is looking great and seems to have survived by a miracle... When people tell me "Oh no! They'll get sick from raw meat!", I answer two things... one: Oddly enough, Kibble's been around for approx 100 years, and pet health has been going downhill from there... coincidence? And think of wolves and lions, sometimes the meat's fresh, sometimes it's weeks old.... think they cook their food? What about a feral cat? Is he gonna cook that bird or mouse?" That usualy shuts them up ;D Goinpostal, yes. I have tried now every combination. Raw alone. Raw first, then canned. Canned first, then raw. And raw completely mixed in the canned. If the raw is offered alone, she "regurgitates" I should say, as it's immediately, barely a few minutes later, not hours later... But for three meals now I've been mixing the raw in the canned, and she has no problem with it. Odd part is that she seems to MUCH prefer the raw to the canned.... I feed her first, then I sit down and feed Meeko not too far away, and she constantly leaves her bowl for Meeko's bowl of raw... I have to feed Meeko on the table for her not to leave her own bowl.... Silly goose.... |
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