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Post by Leah S. on Apr 17, 2018 22:21:40 GMT -5
Hello everyone! I’d love some helpful advice from all of you who may have gone through something similar or know a lot about freeze dried raw. My ferrets are currently eating a kibble mix of origin cat & kitten as well as the Wysong Digestive support. My younger ferret really loves freeze dried but seems to like it most when I break it up into tiny pieces and he likes it dry. Which makes me worry about dehydration. My other ferret WILL NOT, and I mean WILL NOT go for it in the slightest bit. I’ve tried: grinding her kibble with a coffee grinder (I bought specifically for her while I was transitioning her off of marshals) and putting itty bitty pieces of freeze dried raw into the ground up kibble with water. I have tried giving her little pieces of dry FDR as a treat, I’ve tried rehydrating and mushing it up to a soupy consistency and have repeatedly tried the “grab & dab” method. She absolutely hates it. Even when I have the tiniest bit mixed in with the water and ground up kibble she refuses to touch it as if she can faintly smell it. So far for FDR I’ve tried the Wysong archetype rabbit, and Stella and chewys duck duck goose for cats, (They no longer have pea fiber in the ingredients or the extra vitamin k) I’m not having trouble with my younger ferret because he’s a little chub and loves it all. It’s my picky little girl that refuses nearly everything. SO, here are my questions: 1.) What else can I do to get my little girl to start accepting the FDR? 2.) Would I be able to keep a bowl of kibble out in the cage at all times as well as the FDR? Or does that cause too much risk for stomach upset and infections? 3.) Can I break the FDR into tiny pieces and sprinkle it in their kibble (I’m satisfied with the origin & Wysong & would like to still keep that in their diet as well) Is it bad to mix it in with their kibble? 4.) As for FDR do you prefer Wysong or Stella and chewys? I personally have liked the Stella and chewys since it’s softer and easier to break apart, the Wysong can be really dusty with some really hard chunks. Side notes: * I’m not ready to do a Frankenprey diet for my ferrets at this point, maybe someday in the future but not right now due to several reasons. The $$ for the FDR is not an issue for me. **My fuzzies get their teeth brushed every other day with CET enzymatic toothpaste for cats. ***I plan to alternate between Stella and chewys duck duck goose, chick chick chicken, tummy ticklin’ Turkey & absolutely rabbit.
In conclusion I really want my ferrets to both be willing and wanting to accept the freeze dried raw, but is it possible to still keep their kibble in the mix. I care about my babies more than anything in the world & put my life, heart & soul into taking care of all my pets. ♥️ Thank you everyone in advance, any advice I will greatly appreciate. I spend hours on end researching this type of stuff online but it makes it so much better to make my own post so I can share how things are going.
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Post by Sherry on Apr 18, 2018 10:28:17 GMT -5
If you are going to feed fdr and get the benefits from it, then you NEED to feed rehydrated twice a day You can leave a bit of it dry for between meal munching later on. Take the reydrated FDR(not a lot right now), grab a ferret and a spoon. Sit ferret on lap, flat dish with FDR, and with one hand holding ferret so they can't run off, start offering by the spoon. Actually hold the spoon in front of ferret's mouth and gently pinch scruff to trigger lick response if necessary. Hopefully they will start eating from the spoon after a couple of attempts. If not, then do a "scruff and stuff". Meaning every 5 to 10 minutes while ferret is out playing grab a ferret, dab some on the nose, then release. After a few times, try the lap/dish/spoon scenario again. Repeat until ferret is eating from the spoon.
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Post by Leah S. on Apr 18, 2018 12:57:14 GMT -5
Sherry, thank you! What are your thoughts on the kibble. Can I keep that in the cage at all times as well?
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Post by Leah S. on Apr 18, 2018 13:02:41 GMT -5
Would I be able to keep kibble in at all times, and place a bowl or plate of the rehydrated freeze dried raw in twice a day? (Once I figure out how much they will consume per serving?) Then they can eat the kibble as a backup or as they get hungry? Or does that pose too much of a threat for infections in their gut?
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Post by Leah S. on Apr 18, 2018 13:09:21 GMT -5
Ideally would I be able to keep them on their kibble (Wysong & origin) and then supplement a FDR meal in the morning and evening?
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Post by raynebc on Apr 18, 2018 13:30:58 GMT -5
If both foods are kept dry, I don't believe that poses a bacterial problem. But if dry kibble is always available to your picky ferret, she may never cave and start eating the FDR. You might have to out-stubborn her.
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Post by Leah S. on Apr 18, 2018 13:35:51 GMT -5
I just don’t want to dehydrate them with dry freeze dried. I don’t want to fully replace their diet with all FDR, mostly just supplement with it. So I’m trying to find the safest and best way to do so. Would it be a better idea to serve two rehydrated meals of freeze dried a day (more so a snack for breakfast and dinner) Or Break up the freeze dried and sprinkle it over their kibble every day. Without rehydrating it.
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Post by raynebc on Apr 18, 2018 13:48:00 GMT -5
In that case you probably would have to alternate between wet and dry instead of having both out at the same time. Probably best to follow the same rules for kibble to raw transitions where you remove the dry food for 1-2 hours before and after they have wet raw food, then they can have the kibble back.
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Post by LindaM on Apr 18, 2018 15:29:02 GMT -5
Kibble honestly dehydrates your ferret already. Any kibble-fed ferret is already toeing the line of dehydration. Ferrets are obligate carnivores, and as all carnivores they are meant to get the majority of their hydration from their diet. Kibble does not provide that. Hence, after switching to raw owners notice the ferrets pee much larger puddles than they did on kibble, which is because they are finally properly hydrated and can get rid of excess liquid without worry.
Personally, if your budget allows, I would do ONLY rehydrated FDR and stop offering kibble entirely. When you are still feeding a kibble, even a higher quality one, you will still be dealing with kibble issues. The little bit of added raw isn't going to do much to prevent that as compared to switching their diet entirely onto a raw option such as FDR or heck, even frozen commercial raw (honestly cheaper than FDR, but of course stored in the freezer not on the shelf, so there's that).
You may well be shooting yourself in the foot trying to do both really. I have experienced both sides of that coin. A) Ferrets refuse to touch the kibble ever again once allowed the option of raw and B) ferrets refuse to actually touch the raw in favor of the kibble and will hold out for it instead.
If I may ask, is there any specific reason you do not want to commit to full raw? We may be able to set your mind at ease about it.
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Post by Leah S. on Apr 18, 2018 20:27:04 GMT -5
In all honestly I’m gone working a 9 hour shift all day and I don’t want them getting hungry while I’m gone. The evenings are when I have all my play time with them & was planning to do their FDR meal since I keep hearing mixed things about sprinkling it into the kibble dry.
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Post by Leah S. on Apr 18, 2018 20:29:29 GMT -5
I would be open to switching to full FDR in the future, as of right now after months of trying all of these methods I still can’t get one of my ferrets to even look at the freeze dried... rehydrated or not. She’s already on the small side, and I don’t wanna take away her kibbles to cause her to lose even more weight right now.
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Post by LindaM on Apr 18, 2018 21:26:09 GMT -5
The Grab'n'Dab method works the best to introduce rehydrated FDR. Sherry has explained it above, but I'm gonna include it again below in a steps process.
I used it a few weeks ago, to switch my newest rescue as well, and it does work. You just need to be patient and persistent about it, really persistent. It took me two or so days to switch him to eating S&C, but I tried several sessions throughout the day. If you're leaving the kibble out all the time, then that's likely the problem right there. They know they can just wait for the kibble. You should take the kibble away a few hours before offering the rehydrated FDR, and after a play session or something to burn energy would work really well too.
Honestly, on other methods of raw such as Frankenprey or Whole Prey, the food can safely stay out even longer than commercial raw such as frozen grinds and FDR. Feed twice a day, AM and PM. Buy your meat, portion it out into meal portions, freeze, then just thaw and pop into their dishes. Only thing that will take a little time to get done is going to the your initial switch onto it. But if you can get them onto FDR fully, that's also an acceptable method of raw as long as it's okay with your wallet and you are okay to continue brushing teeth.
Grab'n'Dab Method Grab your ferret and place them in your lap. Dip your finger in the soup/oil or pick up the piece of meat. Dab onto your ferrets mouth/nose/gums. Wait a moment for them to start licking themselves clean. Release them.
NOTE: This method requires patience and persistence. It may take several tries before they will start willingly licking from your finger/the item. You can practice this method throughout your day or even in smaller sessions of 20-30 minutes, dabbing every 5 minutes.
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Post by Leah S. on Apr 19, 2018 9:53:10 GMT -5
Linda - At this point I’m all for putting my ferrets on a raw diet but I’d like the convenience of the freeze dried or commercial just because as of now I’m living in a house with 5 people and I know they wouldn’t be happy with all the ferret food and raw meat and organs, hearts etc. in our freezer. I plan to be moving within the year & my boyfriend and I will have our own place so I’d be more open to switching them to Frankenprey. This has just been so hard, I wish I would have switched Haven while she was young (she was imprinted on Marshall’s until I got her onto better kibble and it was a VERY long and hard process.) I’ve been trying the grab and dab method with freeze dried for MONTHS now. I’ve tried several flavors as I want to use at least 4 if I have them fully on Stella and chewys. I can’t even explain how many hours a day I spend researching these topics and how to go about the switch. At this point when I have the freeze dried out and she sees it, she RUNS because she knows I’m gonna make her try it. She’s smart and knows what’s happening and I don’t think she could be any more stubborn, it’s been about 4 months since I started introducing her to FDR. She’s so picky it took me over two weeks to get her to take to salmon oil, giving her small amounts at a time. I feel like I’m stressing her out and making her hate me by trying to get her to eat this, as soon as she knows I have the food and I pick her up, she freaks out as fast as she can and runs. Which isn’t like her because usually she’s a cuddle bug who loves being held. I’ve tried spoon feeding, dabbing on her nose, dabbing on gums, scruffing her to get her to try a little in her mouth but she spits it out immediately and runs, I’ve even syringed some of the FDR rehydrated liquid into her mouth so she could get used to the taste. Months later nothing has worked. Desperately what I’ve recently tried doing is crushing up the duck duck goose and mixing it in with her Wysong and origin kibble soup. (I use a coffee grinder for the kibble to make it extra fine) I know this poses a threat for bacterial overgrowth but she hasn’t had any diarrhea (other than when she ate a raw egg yolk). Should I continue to do this & slowly increase the amount of freeze dried in the kibble soup? I have two ferrets and I know If I keep her on the kibble he’s just going to keep eating it as well. He loves FDR but I started him really young, he likes it more crushed up and dry, but I’m slowly adding more liquid because I don’t want him to get dehydrated and he’s starting to take to it well. I don’t worry about him with the switch, it’s my picky stubborn little girl. I’m so stuck.
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Post by Leah S. on Apr 19, 2018 10:12:09 GMT -5
I just don’t know what to do. I just want the best for my babies. They have a vet appointment coming up in two weeks for their rabies shots with a really good ferret veterinarian, maybe she can help me out with deciding what to do with their diet because I’m so frusterated.
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Post by Sherry on Apr 19, 2018 10:16:43 GMT -5
If being gone for several hours is the issue against full on raw, larger chunks are usually left out for 12-24 hours During a transition, kibble is only removed for a couple of hours and then given back.
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