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Post by Deleted on Feb 23, 2017 1:19:23 GMT -5
Hehe that must be a lovely smell while you're lying in bed.
I tried the gravy beef today. I tried to purée it but it ended up kinda thick. Had a hard time getting either girl to eat any from me. Surprised them both into tasting a tiny bit a few times, but not much interest. I figured they were just too busy. I'm surprised to find they've eaten very little. I'm sure Opal at least used to eat the beef mince I gave them, but maybe it was a different cut or something and tasted different. I also used to accidentally cook the edges in the microwave. Maybe she was mostly eating that part.
I put half an egg on it which they both love, and I've come back to find quite a bit of meat still in the cage about 7 hours later.i don't know whether to just grind up some more and see if they get hungry enough, or to make some soup and mix. Someone (likely Opal) has dragged some off the plate and put it in the interim feeding den I have there, so surely some was eaten.
It's so hard to know who eats what when they're together. They don't want to eat when I'm there because it's too exciting, but I can't see what they eat at other times.
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Post by LindaM on Feb 23, 2017 2:09:20 GMT -5
Actually, can't smell it with the meat. Air drying the meat out in our home which is kept at 72F year-round, actually doesn't make it rot or smell, it simply dries out. But erm.. I try to make sure the organ meats never get stashed... if I see it going to the bedroom.. I'll feed them in the cage or chop a bit smaller so they're less inclined to drag it off like they are with big chunks. I'm not gonna take a chance with that kinda stuff rotting by my bed... ewwie!
No, I'm just more concerned about juices getting into my carpet really, and of course, the organ meals do make me worry even more. So I need to get her new feeding den set up, but I need the hubby to cut the entrance, and he's been super busy with work deadlines.
Beef has a very strong smell and taste, my ferrets HATE beef on the worst days, and strongly dislike on the best.. while they will.. eat it.. they would prefer anything else to it and aren't too pleased with me when they get it. Yup, I've even had protest poops. Have you tried mixing the beef with another protein that they do like?
Again, here might be where you need to weigh the food you put out. Use a scale to zero to the amount of the empty bowl (if you have a double of that bowl, or just weigh normally with food and bowl if you don't), and then weigh with food in to get the food only amount, and when you check back on the bowl, just weigh it again. That'll give an idea of how much went missing, you could add back in the stashed amounts to get a more accurate reading too.
I'm lucky that my two don't like sharing food bowls.. so they each just eat out of their own.. I don't even know how they keep track, but each just eats out of the one I put down for them in the morning, and don't really go to the opposite one during the day. Can't complain though, makes my life a lot easier. I do for a fact know that they share stashed foods... I've seen Loki eat some of his madam's homemade "biltong", and she's the only one who stashes meat to end up like that.
You can try tiring them out a bit with play first, which will make them hungry and then hand over the food and see if they won't eat then while you are able to still watch them. You'll at least be able to see them get some of it in or if they don't or if one does and the other does not.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2017 9:27:29 GMT -5
Yes I would weigh it if you have a scale handy to see how much they're eating, both to see if their intake levels are high enough and and so you know on average how much they're eating so there's less wasted. If it's ever too thick for them you can always just add a tad of warm water to it to make it more appealing What kind of feeding schedule/menu have you been doing this week?
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2017 15:40:17 GMT -5
Tiring them out with play? I'm convinced they don't get tired So much energy! I weighed out most of the baggies before freezing them, but I'll admit to being a bit lax about weighing what's left. I put out about 90g (3oz)!of the beef. There was over 60g left. Yesterday I made soup with half pork belly, half chicken. Last time was 1/4 pork. They both devoured it! No hesitation from either to dive on the plate. I put out 3oz. I came back 6 hours later thinking I'd have to remove the old stuff and get fresh, but the plate was clean! I gave another 3oz and then took a little longer to come back than expected. Probably another 6 hours and the plate was clean again! So yesterday day they ate 6oz between them about would have had more if I'd realised. I've been trying to give a bone in meal once a day and trying to get other foods introduced in the other meal. My variety of bone in is still just chicken wings and necks, but pay day is Monday and I'll do a proper search. When I get them eating the pork chunks, I'll be able to give that and chicken feet to get a tiny bit more variety there. I also might buy some kangaroo or lamb this pay. That will give me more to motto along with the beef and pork. This morning I'm going to do hearts I think. Apart from what was in the the soup, it's been about a week.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2017 15:43:26 GMT -5
How are yours going Tess? Are they still doing well with the new diet? I feel like I know them a bit after reading your switching thread.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2017 19:23:50 GMT -5
bahahahha that's how I feel about poppy, she seriously NEVER STOPS. EVen if she's out for 5 hrs, she still rages when I put her to bed. That girl is going to be the death of me. She's only 6 mo though. Mauser is... holy poop I missed her birthday, she's THREE now. Awe I need to post pictures of her or something. Oh yeah anyways Mauser finally comes see up to cuddle and falls asleep on me when she's tired finally 😂 The girls are doing so great though, Mauser still rules the roost. She regularly steals food right out of Catalina's mouth and then a hissing fit ensues while they tousle over it. Mauser always wins. Poppy and Mauser are good buddies and love to wrestle together but Catalina is mausers best friend when it comes to cuddling in bed. Catalina's coat is so soft and fluffy right now, she feels like a bunny. She hates when I cuddle her though lol. They're doing fantastic on raw though the other day I found an old opened bag of kibble in the closet of their bedroom, and I spilled it all over the floor trying to pull it down off of the shelf. I panicked when I realized all three of the girls were gathered around my feet, but they didn't even care about the kibble they just wanted the crinkly bag. It was such an awesome moment for me, even Catalina the kibble addict ignored it completely. Plus they're all eating everything I give them! Even fish and eggs, something they just suddenly decided they liked. Which is okay with me Yes hearts are very important because of the taurine levels they should have a total of one and a half meals of heart per week. have you been shown the basic Frankenprey menu yet? The one that shows how many of each type of meal you need per week to make it balanced? they are actually eating bone now though right? Not just eating the meat off of it? Also just to clarify when you say you're feeding the soup, is it the raw soup recipe from here? Just made with half pork half chicken for the muscle meat portion? Back to bone in: It's okay that it's just chicken for now. I would look for turkey necks, rabbits, duck etc. I use pork riblets for one of mine, I just have to smash the beejeebus out of each bone to get it broken for them to gnaw on. Chicken feet are good for bone it, just serve it either with muscle or do a organ meal right after. This was a long post sorry!
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2017 22:14:37 GMT -5
Hehe, nothing wrong with a long post. I'm so jealous of your cuddly ferret. I suspect Charlie might cuddle when she's MUCH older. Right now there's just too much to do. She's the one that's most interested in me. Opal comes to see me, but Charlie does way more. I can just imagine Poppy.. with mine lots of time out is the difference between really energetic or totally manic. I'm so happy for you that they were completely not interested in the kibble. I haven't tried fish yet, but mine love eggs. It's good because I have chickens Yes the soup was the recipe with the liver and heart and egg shell powder. Just half and half with the muscle meat. I've seen the basic menu. I'm starting to get closer to following it. I think I pretty much got all the elements introduced last week. Definitely more variety required. I think they're both eating the bone now. I don't seem to be picking up many pieces. Mostly whole bits they didn't get to yet. Like a whole chicken neck that fell out of the cage the other night. I hear a fair bit of crunching.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 25, 2017 18:56:53 GMT -5
Putting a little egg on new meats is a great way to get them to try it since they like it! But it looks like you already know that. Having some left over bone bits is totally normal, as long as they aren't leaving the majority of it So if they're eating the soup on their own now, why don't you try adding a few very small pieces or muscle meat into it? I know you're wanting to up your variety, but if they're eating bone in chunks I don't see why they wouldn't start eating muscle meat chunks have you gotten to try the liver yet?
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Post by LindaM on Feb 26, 2017 0:08:20 GMT -5
I agree with Tess. If they're happily eating the bone-in pieces, they should just as easily eat the muscle meat, only difference is a lack of bone.
Other than a drizzle of egg on new meats, you can also do a bit of a raw soupie that they already love, or a little bit of salmon oil, I've also had success with a sprinkling of a crushed up FDR treat. Since yours already love the raw egg, it shouldn't be an issue, though I've seen some stubborn ones just lick the egg off and forsake the meat, and thus needing to try another method to get them to try it. Some people have had luck by adding some water with their meat.. it kinda makes like a slightly bloody water puddle which some will happily lap up and others will prefer licking the meat then because it makes some meats a little slimey coated, though that particular method only worked on chicken for me, but I guess it could work on some others too.
And if they still refuse to take to chunks, which I can't see why they really would at this stage, you can start making your soup coarser and coarser by simply blending it less, or try switching to a ground meat with some water to make a coarse soup, then switch to either ground meat and start adding little pieces into that, or into the soup, and slowly keep increasing the amount ratio to "more pieces-less soup/ground", and then just start upping the size of the pieces until they eat chunks.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 5, 2017 2:20:41 GMT -5
Wow, I knew I had to update, but I didn't realize it had been as long as it has!
So what we're up to:
Chicken hearts: love them. I can give these whole. I hope to get some other types of heart soon.
Organs: I gave a mix of 2oz chicken liver, 1oz lamb kidney, 1oz lamb brain. They took to the liver so well the first time I gave it, that I thought I'd try to puree the organs together. I hoped the lamb taste would help with the kidney.. I added a few small pieces of each as well. Firstly ewww, that was gross. When I looked at it later I thought they hadn't eaten much, but when I weighed it, 2oz was actually gone. Hopefully they ate about half that amount each.
Chickrn wings: I give fairly large pieces and they seem to be eating bone and all.
Chicken necks: I was finding they weren't eating much of this, and certainly not enough bone. Are these harder to eat than wings? I smashed these up some, and that was far more successful. I'll gradually work up to whole necks.
Pork belly: both ferrets are now munching on chunks of this. Yay!
Gravy beef: I've been grinding this with chicken thigh. It's a thick texture without chunks. First I gave 1/3 beef, 2/3 chicken. Next I moved to 1/2 and 1/2. They seem to be eating it so far, although they didn't eat as much of the 1/2 and 1/2, so I'll do that again before doing any higher ratio beef.
Variety: I found turkey wing pieces! I haven't tried them yet, but I hope that goes well. The bones seem quite thick. Should I be trying to get tips only? I smashed them up a fair bit, so hooefully they go ok. I talked to the local butcher the other day. He's getting me a price on quail and rabbit and has my phone number. He asked if that was all and I said I'm pretty much looking for anything unusual, so we'll see what he come up with. My friend reminded me we know someone who works at the duck processing place. I'm going to ask if he can get a good price on anything. Is there a particular part I'm looking for?
So the current status is they won't eat just anything I put in front of them, but they're doing ok. If kits still take time, I can't imagine what it must be like with older ferrets.
I'm going to try and make a menu for the week later tonight and start trying to be more balanced.
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Post by FireAngel on Mar 5, 2017 12:05:05 GMT -5
It looks like you are doing great. Turkey bones can be very thick and even bone experianced ferrets can have a hard time with them. Wing tips may be a fine idea. Duck necks are a little lareger then chicken necks but smaller then turkey necks but are a good bone in source. Also wing tips and chunks of meat are fine. If you wanted to introduce them to grinds having a whole bird ground (including the feathers) is great too!
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Post by Deleted on Mar 5, 2017 17:41:27 GMT -5
Thanks for the info So I introduced the turkey wing last night. I offered some tiny pieces and Opal was straight into it. She didn't want much because she was busy, but she didn't hesitate on the bits she did eat. Charlie wasn't real interested at all. I snuck some tiny bits into her mouth, but she wouldn't actually take any. I decided to try the wing in the cage overnight. It was fairly chopped up because I was worried about the size of the bones, but still would have required chewing.. I put in roughly 3oz. All I can find this morning is a little piece that fell out of their cage and I'm sure there'll be some tiny bone fragments. So verdict is I don't think Opal would eat that much alone overnight. They've been averaging about 2oz between them for their night feed. Surely Charlie must have ate it too!
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Post by Deleted on Mar 6, 2017 3:15:13 GMT -5
I've made a menu for the week that I'm going to try to stick to. I still need much more variety, so this isn't my final menu. I want to try and get a couple more proteins. I also want a second heart source and a couple more organ meats.
Monday: Am: (muscle) pork belly Pm: (bone in) turkey wing
Tuesday: Am: (muscle) beef and chicken thigh 1/2 and 1/2 ground Pm: (bone in) chicken wing
Wednesday: Am: (heart) chicken hearts Pm: (bone in) turkey wing
Thursday Am: (muscle) beef and chicken thigh ground. Ratio depends on how well the last meal went. Pm: (bone in) chicken wing
Friday: Am: (heart and organs) 1/2 chicken heart, 1/4 chicken liver, 1/4 lamb kidney Pm: (pseudo bone in) chicken feet with pork belly
Saturday: Am: (muscle) beef. Hopefully alone. Depends on how well the mixes have been going. Pm: turkey wing
Sunday: Am: (organs) 1/2 chicken liver, 1/4 lamb kidney, 1/4 lamb brain Pm: chicken wing
For the next week I'll have another pay day and I'll try and get some more variety then.
Thanks to everyone who has been helping me and my girls along the way.
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Post by FireAngel on Mar 6, 2017 11:34:30 GMT -5
That menu looks great! Yes more variety would be awesome. It can be so difficult some tomes to find more then just turky and chicken and beef for them. I know you will though! You could try them with some fish too, like salmon or sardines or anchovies. I wouldn't give them fish any more then once a week but it is a great addition and easy to find in the store.
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