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Post by Deleted on Nov 20, 2016 21:51:53 GMT -5
My first ferret I got as a kit, a totally normal and healthy girl. My second I adopted as an adult (unknown age, probably about 2) who was deaf. She was generally well-behaved, but bit too hard when playing. A few weeks with my first ferret solved this issue almost entirely...she was still more play-bity than I liked, but it was tolerable. They have both been gone for a few years, and I recently adopted another adult female that, go figure, is deaf. She was kept alone, as a pet for a large children's home. When I went to see her, she was in a large room with a few other animals and it *seemed* calm enough, but her fur was ratty and she just didn't seem very perky or healthy. She was in a tiny cage, with cat litter, and no place to hide. She bit me twice, and the adult showing her to me actually donned leather work gloves to handle her like it was no big deal. "Oh, if I put these on then she doesn't even try to bite!"  Of course I took her, because I love a challenge, and to make sad animals happy again...ha. 6 weeks on quality food, living in a large house with plenty of beds, and she looks 100% better. Her coat is thick and glossy, her eyes bright, and she enjoys coming out to explore. HOWEVER. She still bites. BOY, does she bite. If you try to pick her up when she is in her cage...bites. Really, she will try to bite about 90% of the time if you try to pick her up, so I just don't unless it's to scruff and give her a stern "No!" for biting my feet. She doesn't 'attack' bite, as in seek you out to bite you, any more. But time-outs don't seem to help, as she will just curl up and go to sleep. She isn't a big player...when she comes out she strolls around, but she doesn't go-crazy, roll and dook and act a fool like my other ferrets did, so being put away isn't a good enough 'punishment' for her. Anyone have any ideas?? I have freeze dried liver treats that she loves...so, maybe try light-training and see if I can positive-reinforce the behavior away instead? |
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Post by antismurffette on Dec 27, 2016 12:07:25 GMT -5
No one had any ideas?
How'd it go?
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Post by Sherry on Dec 27, 2016 12:10:28 GMT -5
Missed this entirely! She sounds like a fear biter. You should never punish for fear biting and that includes scruffing.
Teaching hands hold only good things is a long process and throughout "ignore" is best used.
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Post by msav on Dec 27, 2016 13:26:55 GMT -5
Big thing and sticks out to me is "She was kept alone, as a pet for a large children's home"
This says 2 things, She was probably handled roughly or even abused, and she probably did not get any time out of the cage. Ferrets need mental stimulation and being left in a cage can cause all kinds of behavior problems
Sometimes being let out to play will go a long way in relieving some of these behaviors after a few weeks to a month. Sometimes it requires some reassurance and some effort on your part. I hope you are able to break through that barrier with her.
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Post by abbeytheferret6 on Dec 27, 2016 13:41:37 GMT -5
Totally agree with above posts. All great ideas.
Good for you for rescuing.
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Post by Aftershock on Dec 27, 2016 15:36:33 GMT -5
Do be wary about too many liver treats, too much vitamin A can cause a toxicity. Patience, and a ton of time out of her cage should help. As Sherry said, sounds like a fear biter. You may want to take a look at this link: holisticferret60.proboards.com/thread/21908/fear-biting |
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Post by antismurffette on Dec 27, 2016 16:00:22 GMT -5
@amandarenee007 I hope things are going better.
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Post by LindaM on Dec 27, 2016 16:39:50 GMT -5
@amandarenee007 That's so good of you to take her in and give her a good, loving home. It can be hard homing and trying to change the ways set into all rescue animals, some more than others, but oh, it can be so worth it.
How is it going with your girl now? Any better?
I think the reason your girl doesn't much care for the timeouts is probably because they kept her in a small, dismal cage as long as they've had her. The poor thing probably still feels like that is her natural lot in life. I think with time she will come to understand that the large, nice house is her home, and the small one for timeouts only happens if she does something bad. But that can take a very long time to set it, and even remain to be traumatizing to the animal.
Positive reinforcement works wonders too I've found. I reward with praise, cuddles, and treats when my babies display good behavior. Freeze-dried treats are great rewards, but yes, be wary of too much of the liver ones. My ferrets love freeze dried chicken, duck, rabbit, turkey, lamb, salmon, and beef treats. I tend to have a packet of all of these in my house at all times for variety. PureBites is a good brand to try for 100% meat only ingredient freeze-dried treats (but I think their duck one is only liver). You can also try to get her to understand that your hands are where good, and yummy things come from by letting her lick things off your fingers by finger feeding her. Dipping your finger in soupies that they can lick off works like a charm, mine will often continue licking long after they licked off all the food.
And most importantly, just take your time with her. Sometimes it can take a lot of time and patience for abused animals to begin understanding that you are different, and you will not treat them the same way, especially if that is all they've ever known.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2017 20:55:59 GMT -5
Missed this entirely! She sounds like a fear biter. You should never punish for fear biting and that includes scruffing. Teaching hands hold only good things is a long process and throughout "ignore" is best used. Yay, that is what I ended up doing! I was plowed at work for the holidays, and completely forgot that I even made this post. I just ignored the biting, and was very careful to avoid situations that led to biting for her, kept my feet out of range, didn't try to pick her up to put her back in her cage, etc. She was totally unimpressed with 'scruff and No!', being deaf AND and adult set in her ways, I figured it wasn't ever going to work with her the way it usually does with youn'uns. Do be wary about too many liver treats, too much vitamin A can cause a toxicity. Patience, and a ton of time out of her cage should help. As Sherry said, sounds like a fear biter. You may want to take a look at this link: holisticferret60.proboards.com/thread/21908/fear-bitingFantastic, thanks for the link!!! I also have freeze dried chicken, and freeze dried salmon treats I alternate, and I'm not very generous with the treats. I was afraid of doing more harm than good as far as Little Miss Nippy was concerned! However!!! New problem. I took in a fabulous pair of brothers, Martin and Bukowski, from someone who wasn't able to bond with them (she lost her last three in quick succession to cancer and her boyfriend thought they would be a good gift, fella meant well, but, well). They're happy, healthy, fantastically well cared for, and I feel so lucky she chose to give them to me.  I have had them about three weeks now. They have a nice two-level Ferret Nation cage. The first week, kept in the same room, separate playtimes. Second week, I let the boys and little-miss-nippy Daisy interact through the bars of their cages, if they wanted, during separate playtimes. Then, I turned the middle pan of the FN backward to close off the two halves, put the boys in the top and Daisy in the bottom, so she could come out and go in on her own during play time (I still try to avoid picking her up whenever I can). Now, Daisy is absolutely entranced by them. When the boys are out, she watches them and hops around her cage, making faint dooking noises. The boys sniff at her now and then, but they're relatively unimpressed since they're used to having a ferret friend at all times. They've had nose-to-nose sniff-outs, and no issues. But here I was tonight, during the boy's playtime, thinking about how best to start letting them play together, and Daisy bites one of the boys through the cage. Nothing out of the ordinary happened. Martin was just playing on a box next to her cage, had his side pressed against it, and she sniffed at him, then bit. I'm not sure if it was as mean-bite. I grabbed Martin immediately. One of them squeaked, honestly not sure who, but Martin seemed unfazed and kept playing after I set him on the floor. I think part of Daisy's biting is what SHE thinks is play-nipping, but is much harder than any play-nip I've experienced before. Any thoughts on how I should progress with this?? |
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Post by antismurffette on Jan 23, 2017 2:56:03 GMT -5
I would think if he didn't seem to mind that you could let them play together and see what happens. You can always break it up if you think Miss Nippy is being too aggressive. If she is play biting it might even help her figure out how to bite softer. When we first brought Satan home he bit so hard... Baby Bear just grazed you, after introducing her to him her play bites got a little harder at first but eventually Satan stopped bitting so hard now we no longer need to worry about surprise bites. If the boys aren't trying to run away while pooping themselves I would consider everything fine. I am by no means an expert, fairly new to this ferret business.. lol.. but I have had other pets... maybe the other people who answered will come back and answer this too Heather or Sherry or LindaM Aftershock |
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Post by LindaM on Jan 23, 2017 3:48:12 GMT -5
Neither of my two are deaf, but I have had to deal with my little girl being a real nasty little nipper when we first got her.. she didn't bite Loki, my male ferret, so much when we got her as he usually did the domination most.. but my poor cat.. even now there are some days when she finds that he offended her and responds to him by biting at his toes till he screams and runs away.
It could well be that your girl was just trying to get his attention. Even those of us who have ferrets that have been trained not to bite, will occasionally receive a bite to a toe from one in an attempt to get attention if we do not respond fast enough. And remember.. what hurts you, might not even hurt them as bad, ferrets do have tougher skin after all.
I would try to introduce them slowly to each other in a neutral play area with some toys and yourself, try to pick a closed off area, so they will be more keen to interact than simply run off to explore other things. Sometimes it can help if you sit in on that play and just be there to watch what they do. You can always step in if it seems things are going south. Chances are little nippy Daisy will definitely get a few nips in on them, but they might also be great teachers to her when it comes to biting as they will respond with body language that she doesn't need to hear, so much as witness and feel.
Keep your eye out for the usual signs of trouble... blood, fear poop, fear pee. You may hear some screams and witness some efforts of trying to run away, and while you should keep an eye on this, it doesn't necessarily mean something is going wrong. There are ferrets who scream even when they are punch-drunk happy and the one doing all the attacking versus being the victim. And some ferrets will just try and bolt, period. I felt so bad for Loki when we first got Athena, as he kept trying to do the dominance fight, and all she kept doing was slip out from under him and run away, she wasn't even scared, she just wanted to run off every time, lol. And it's something she does even to this day while they are playing.. she'll do most of the running away, but if he stops chasing her, she'll go back and taunt him until he follows again.
I would also check everyone over after any play times to make sure nobody got injured anywhere. I even do that with my ferrets and cat and while I know they won't hurt each other, accidents can always happen, so it's just good practice.
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Post by Sherry on Jan 23, 2017 12:04:55 GMT -5
She may have been trying to get his attention, but being female it was more likely "You are invading my cage I BITE YOU!!!"  The females tend to be much more dominant than males. Just a heads up- when you DO intro please expect some likely very noisy dominance battles. Unless someone is pooping while running away to hide and not come back out- try to let them work it out. General rule of thumb is "no blood, no poop, no foul" |
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Post by Heather on Jan 23, 2017 14:45:56 GMT -5
One of the things to note as well, ferrets play rough and deaf ferrets can and are often very loud. Biting is communicating for ferrets and when they set up their domination games it looks like a major battle but if there is no blood or poop....ignore the screaming. The less you interfere with these processes the shorter they will last. No matter how the game is played she will win in the end (even if the boys are 3x her size). I usually introduce one at a time to prevent the ganging up on a single individual (bonded pairs are notorious for coming to one another's aid). There is no magic combination, though introduction on neutral territory helps, some people bath them so they all can share their combined misery together and everyone stinks the same, others take them out for a walk together (make sure if you do this to have a friend who's not afraid of being bitten with you)
ciao
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