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Post by Deleted on Sept 11, 2015 0:42:09 GMT -5
Hi again everyone! I decided to start this self-switching thread because I'm still quite a ways off from being able to sign up for the mentoring program, and I know that you all will jump in and make suggestions (which is greatly appreciated!!) So, I finally was able to find a scale, which I know is important, and I weighed the little beast. He came in at a whopping 1lb 1 oz as of two days ago. He will be 10 weeks old on Saturday, and so far he is doing great with the eating. When I got him he was on some awful log looking things that were mixed with water to form a mush that made my whole house reek. After two days of that, I started feeding him CGR and he has been eating between 2-4oz per day. Yesterday, I started weighing and documenting what I'm offering him and what he's eating, and I've started giving him chunks of meat (we skipped the soup and sliver stage, but he doesn't seem to mind.) Yesterday, I gave him 2oz S+C duck at 6am, and it was gone by 4:30. At 4:30 I gave him 2.5oz of S+C duck, plus 1 oz of chicken breast chunks, .3 oz of chicken heart and .4oz of gizzards. He ate the majority of that, but he doesn't seem to like the duck/CGR and prefers the chunks. He eats the chunks of meat like a starving creature! Today, he got 2.2 oz of CGR beef and .8oz of chicken breast chunks in the morning, and there was .8oz left tonight. It's also been hotter than normal, so the meat is looking kind of gross by the end of the day which might be why he wasn't interested. I've been giving Haggis a frozen water bottle in his cage, and he has two fans blowing, but it's still kind of warm. I found the local Mexican market and I bought a selection of chicken hearts/gizzards, beef heart, beef liver, pork kidney, Cornish Game Hen, Quail and Chicken thigh. I have some rabbits in the freezer, as well. I left him happily chomping on a Cornish Game Hen quarter and a chunk of beef liver, which he chomped with a little bit of coaxing. I have the menu files and I will post my intended menu tomorrow, I know that things haven't been super balanced up until this point, and I hope to have him eating more bones in the next couple of days.
Now, for the questions: He has eaten about 1/2 the bone from a chicken wing tip, without it being crushed up. Is that the best way to get him to start eating bone? Am I rushing him? I've been hoping that the CGR will give him everything he needs, but should I crush up the bones more in the Game Hen, or just let him keep trying and giving him CGR to supplement? I'm sure I'll think of more...but until then, thanks for letting me blather on!
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Post by Deleted on Sept 11, 2015 1:29:30 GMT -5
Fantastic! Its a great idea to start a self switch until you can get a mentor. ^^ Wow! What a big boy! Hopefully he will be an easy switch considering he's still quite young.
Its great that you have a market that has a big variety of meats. Gizzards are especially good for keeping their teeth clean and builds jaw strength. You sound like you've got a good idea on starting so far. I look forward to seeing more~ Have you got photos of the little one?
There are many ways to get him on bone in meats. So far you said that he's already started eating the wing tip so far, so you may as well keep trying that way without having to crush it up. I'm not quite sure what CGR is, so hopefully someone else can pop in and advise you on that one. ^^ Good luck on your self switch~
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Post by FireAngel on Sept 11, 2015 13:26:15 GMT -5
Looks like you are off to a great start! I think CGR is commercial ground raw? Complete grinds will give him everything he needs nutritionally but it is best for him to not make them the main diet. He needs the whole bones to chew on and breakdown for teeth and jaw strength and health. He is young and a tummy with teeth so he will likely eat almost anything you give him or at least try to until he finally figures out how to! :heehee: What is the end goal for your diet plan with him, frankenprey or whole prey or a combination?
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Post by Deleted on Sept 11, 2015 20:00:17 GMT -5
Thank you for the comments! Yes, CGR is commercial ground raw, and my eventual goal is Frankenprey, just because I think that is going to be easiest with all the meat variety I have here. I won't have to order anything, just go to the grocery store! Anyway, I left him with 1/4 of a Cornish Game Hen with a little bit of CGR just in case, and when I came home, all but the wing had been eaten. I will probably crush the wings up a bit just until he gets the hang of it. I'm very lucky, because he will pretty much eat anything. He's already chowed down on chicken heart and beef liver. And he loves chicken! The wing is kind of gross and jerkified from this morning, but it was about a 5.5oz chunk of meat that he ate most of, so I'm not entirely concerned that he isn't eating enough. I will post some photos, just let me go read the thread on how to do that ... Thanks again, I'm so glad that I'm on the right track!
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Post by Deleted on Sept 11, 2015 20:04:41 GMT -5
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Post by FireAngel on Sept 11, 2015 20:28:00 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Sept 12, 2015 14:34:33 GMT -5
Awesome! Thank you for that, tons of good info! I smashed his breakfast this morning (the leg and thigh of a cornish game hen) and he started on it immediately. He ate a meal of hearts and gizzard last night, but he had some gross diarrhea this morning. It seems to be formed again, but when do you start worrying about it? I know that he will likely have a soft stool when I switch meats until he gets used to it, and I figured that he probably needed some more bone, but he's so little, I know that diarrhea can be much more taxing on him than it is on my large dog. Anyway, things seem pretty good right now, he MUCH prefers the whole meat to commercial ground raw. I will post a menu later tonight or tomorrow, I would love to have some input on it! Thanks!
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Post by FireAngel on Sept 12, 2015 15:58:10 GMT -5
Muscle meat meals will always give you looser stools as will organ meals. Unless they are loose or liquid for a few days it is usually just meal related. If you are ever worried about a poop though please do not hesitate to post a picture of it and let us know what he has eaten in the last day and how long the poop has been like that.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2015 0:34:10 GMT -5
Thanks FireAngel. His stool is back to normal now, it was just that one really gross heart day. I'm sure he'll get used to it. Here is my menu, I will up the variety as I find other meat sources...I haven't gone to the asian market yet, but I'm planning to next weekend. Monday am: Whole Quail Monday pm: Left over Quail Tuesday am: Chicken necks Tuesday pm: alternating Chicken gizzard/ beef chunks/ pork/salmon/venison/salmon Wednesday am: Chicken wings Wednesday pm: (beef or chicken) heart Thursday am: Cornish Game Hen Thursday pm: Cornish Game Hen leftovers Friday am: rabbit (until it’s gone...I have three in the freezer) Friday pm: ½ heart + ¼ beef liver + ¼ pork kidney Saturday am: Chicken neck Saturday pm: Alternating chicken gizzard/heart/beef/pork/venison/salmon ---or Egg Sunday am: S+C duck duck goose/turkey until I can find other meat sources for variety. Sunday pm: ½ beef or chicken liver + ½ beef or pork kidney
How does that sound? Oh! And I gave him a quail this morning and he's been working on it all day. All that's left is a leg bone, and a meaty leg that I'm sure he'll eat by tomorrow. I love watching him chow down...and he's gained about 1/2 a pound this week. At this rate he'll be bigger than my German Shepherd by the time he's a year old!
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Post by FireAngel on Sept 14, 2015 13:28:57 GMT -5
That looks good! It's one of my favorite things to do, watch them eat too! :heehee: they certainly gain quickly but he will even out soon, but the thought of a German Shepard sized ferret is pretty amusing!
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Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2015 14:35:55 GMT -5
German Shepard size ferret! Well, why not? They had that person who thought they bought poodles only to find they were ferrets on steroids. That's a popular news article running around. www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2305310/Man-gets-shock-toy-poodles-turn-GIANT-RODENTS-steroids.htmlNote the article calls them rodents, sigh... I always think my Wynstan looks like a Collie. He is my big goofy puppy of a ferret. One small note on your menu. It's good to have a red meat meal. Red meat is high in Iron and Vitamin B. Since you don't want a chicken heavy menu and you have beef heart, use that for the heart meals. Chicken is a common allergy/intolerance so look for other protein sources with small bones and use as little of the chicken as possible. That's hard when Bone In meals are 7-9 a week and chicken has such nice little bones. You and Haggis are doing so well. He is simply beautiful and I loved his pictures. :wave3:
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Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2015 14:36:25 GMT -5
Thanks! I'll print it and put it on the fridge. That was the easiest switch ever.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2015 14:38:38 GMT -5
Oh okay! I will add chunks of beef as muscle meals, too. I have a bunch of both kinds of heart, I'll alternate! I love those poodle ferrets, they make me crack up every time.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 16, 2015 1:02:54 GMT -5
Updated menu: I went to the Asian market today and they had no interesting meats, but I live close enough to LA that getting weird meat shouldn't be a problem if I investigate a little, or travel a bit. But, I went back to he Mexican market and found goat/sheep mix and pork tongue. I haven't given any to haggis yet, but I'm sure he will eat it, he's eaten everything else I've given him so far... Here is my updated menu.
Mon am: quail Mon pm: quail not finished
Tues:bone in Chicken (either thigh, neck, wing) Tues pm: mutton/goat meat
Wed am: Cornish game hen Wed pm: beef heart
Thurs: bone in chicken (either thigh, neck, wing) Thurs pm: 1/2 heart(beef or chicken available), ¹/4 beef liver, 1/4 pork kidney
Fri:rabbit Fri pm: rabbit and egg
Sat: bone in chicken (thigh, neck, wing) Sat pm: mutton/goat or salmon, beef or pork muscle meat
Sun: turkey wing tip or bone in chicken Sun pm: 1/2 beef liver, 1/2 pork kidney
How does that look? I can swap muscle meats easily each week for some variety...
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Post by Deleted on Sept 16, 2015 4:25:50 GMT -5
My baby would eat the wing without the drummette part --it would take her a while but it would be totally gone:)
I always warn people about knuckles because my senior was rolling one around in her mouth--I always get rid of knuckles. When I feed gizzard, I slice them thinly with scissors.
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