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Post by katt on Apr 23, 2011 15:08:36 GMT -5
So I have noticed that Koda is ALWAYS dehydrated. I don't know why or what to do about it. He's on all raw and whole prey obviously, and has a lock crock water dish that is kept full. His poops are OK, some good some not too great. I don't know how else to keep him hydrated. He had a blood panel done and his blood glucose, kidneys, liver, etc etc all looked good. Also this is not a recent thing by any means. I just always forget, or forget to ask. He is healthy and active otherwise, with the exception of his intermittent IBD issues. But again this is something that has been going on for quite some time now. Ideas/thoughts/suggestions? In the Omega thread Jackie mentioned ferret vite Liquid Sol something and it's meant to be put in their water. It's "tasty" so it might encourage him to drink more water... But I don't know if getting that regularly is good. Because he is on raw obviously he'd still be getting less sugar than kibble but he already gets more pumpkin because it makes a Huge difference in his IBD. Also, whatever Koda eats Kenai eats and vice versa so I'd be exposing them both to the sugar increase...
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Post by Sherry on Apr 23, 2011 15:31:11 GMT -5
I think I'd be avoiding the extra sugars if possible. As for the chronic dehydration, I think all you can do is keep an eye on kidney/liver values for now. As you said- he IS drinking already, and on raw, so a ton of liquid there. I don't know that drinking more is the answer(whatever that might be!). If he's still really active, and eating well, it seems that he's likely adjusted to it. Beyond that, I don't have a clue, Katt. I'd talk to your vet, get his/her ideas.
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Post by Heather on Apr 23, 2011 15:48:24 GMT -5
I agree with Sherry. Don't push it. It's part of what he is. You don't want to make his kidneys work any harder than they are. If he's not totally hydrated with the amount of liquid in his diet then it may be part of his own make-up, his own balance. As Sherry mentioned, keep a close eye on his kidney values and when he's having an IBD attack pay close attention to his intake and output. He will have less time than others who don't have his hydration issue ciao
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Post by Deleted on Apr 23, 2011 16:06:32 GMT -5
What method are you using to tell hes dehydrated? I find that the best/most accurate test for pets is a gum check, are the lighter in color than normal? If you touch them are they tacky feeling? I agree with Sherry on avoiding the sugars as much as possible plus putting something in the water to entice him to drink more may not do the trick, maybe its not that hes not drinking but that his body isnt retaining hydration, have you had his electrolytes checked recently? Is he urinating more that usual? If he is urinating frequently and you havent recently checked his glucose levels, I would do that asap.. I dont know if they do Hemaglobin A1C on ferrets (dont see why they wouldnt) but see if you can get that done since HbA1C (at least the human one..) checks glucose levels for the past three months. I know ur in alaska but do you keep the heat up? I dont know ur set up but is there anyway that he could be spending excessive amount of time near your iguana's heat lamps/rocks while your not around? Try to pinpoint any cause, even things that could generally seem insignificant. Also it COULD have to do with his IBD, im sure you know but just incase someone doesnt and is reading- diarrhea/gastrointestinal issues and dehydration go hand in hand.. if your still working on regulating his IBD, any 'attacks' can cause dehydration. I hope you figure it out
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Post by katt on Apr 23, 2011 22:34:06 GMT -5
What method are you using to tell hes dehydrated? I find that the best/most accurate test for pets is a gum check, are the lighter in color than normal? If you touch them are they tacky feeling? Scruff test. When scruffed, his scruff stays in "scruff" position for some time after releasing him. I agree with Sherry on avoiding the sugars as much as possible plus putting something in the water to entice him to drink more may not do the trick, maybe its not that hes not drinking but that his body isn't retaining hydration, have you had his electrolytes checked recently? Is he urinating more that usual? If he is urinating frequently and you havent recently checked his glucose levels, I would do that asap.. Reread my post. He had a blood test (full panel) very recently and checked out fine on all levels. Also his potty habits are the same as ever. And this is not a recent issue. This is very "normal" and consistent for him. I have never been overly concerned because he shows no other signs of illness (other than IBD and possible adrenal) and is active, happy, and healthy otherwise. I honestly can't remember the last time he wasn't dehydrated. I just finally remembered to ask. He has been seen by the vet several times recently and checks out fine. I dont know if they do Hemaglobin A1C on ferrets (dont see why they wouldnt) but see if you can get that done since HbA1C (at least the human one..) checks glucose levels for the past three months.See above. Blood test was all clear. I know ur in alaska but do you keep the heat up? Yes And it's not cold all the time. It's actually been a nice balmy 50ish lately! ;D I dont know ur set up but is there anyway that he could be spending excessive amount of time near your iguana's heat lamps/rocks while your not around? Try to pinpoint any cause, even things that could generally seem insignificant.Nope. They go nowhere near those. The reptile cages are strictly off limits. Also it COULD have to do with his IBD, im sure you know but just incase someone doesnt and is reading- diarrhea/gastrointestinal issues and dehydration go hand in hand.. if your still working on regulating his IBD, any 'attacks' can cause dehydrationIt could very well. But the thing is, he is dehydrated even when his IBD is stable and his poops are good and solid. Like last night. He had an almost perfect poop...but was still very dehydrated. I hope you figure it outThanks! Me too.
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Post by katt on Apr 23, 2011 22:34:48 GMT -5
I agree with Sherry. Don't push it. It's part of what he is. You don't want to make his kidneys work any harder than they are. If he's not totally hydrated with the amount of liquid in his diet then it may be part of his own make-up, his own balance. As Sherry mentioned, keep a close eye on his kidney values and when he's having an IBD attack pay close attention to his intake and output. He will have less time than others who don't have his hydration issue ciao Hmm that last part is good to know. That didn't even occur to me, thank you.
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Post by Sherry on Apr 23, 2011 23:33:51 GMT -5
Hey- what's that old phrase? Forewarned is forearmed? At least you are aware of the potential problem, and know to act accordingly!
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Post by Deleted on Apr 24, 2011 2:11:28 GMT -5
Maybe you can also get some sub-q fluids from your vet in case he gets too dehydrated
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Post by Deleted on Apr 24, 2011 3:18:55 GMT -5
Maybe you can also get some sub-q fluids from your vet in case he gets too dehydrated I was just thinking this exact same thing.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 24, 2011 3:27:40 GMT -5
Also it COULD have to do with his IBD, im sure you know but just incase someone doesnt and is reading- diarrhea/gastrointestinal issues and dehydration go hand in hand.. if your still working on regulating his IBD, any 'attacks' can cause dehydrationIt could very well. But the thing is, he is dehydrated even when his IBD is stable and his poops are good and solid. Like last night. He had an almost perfect poop...but was still very dehydrated. I don't know if this is the case with Koda, but ferrets with chronic intestinal problems, such as IBD (even if it's only intermittent), can have ongoing damage to the intestinal lining. Loss of the absorptive lining will not only reduce the uptake of nutrients but also the uptake of fluids in the intestines. So you might reach a stage when the ferret simply can't rehydrate himself no matter how much he's drinking or getting fluids orally. At that point the only way to rehydrate him would be with parenteral fluids (sub-q or IV).
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Post by Deleted on Apr 24, 2011 10:37:17 GMT -5
Hmm, Marie, I wonder if that could have anything to do with Koda's blockage surgery?
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Post by Heather on Apr 24, 2011 12:18:02 GMT -5
It's entirely possible that the surgery precipitated the issue. Any damage, such as scaring to the bowel can create an issue whether by disease or surgery to the absorption of nutrients. Marie is probably very understanding of this issue too as her little one (actually, I think she mentioned that she has a couple) that have received permanent damage from contracting ECE (this is a common problem associated with this disease) It would stand to reason that if the damage is severe enough to prevent the absorption of nutrients that all fluids would probably be impeded to some degree ciao
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Post by miamiferret2 on Apr 24, 2011 12:27:26 GMT -5
yes it may be the blockage itself or the surgery. but the IBD can also cause the intestines to become affected and malabsorption is an issue. one of mine had IBD and dehydration was also a problem. although vet strongly suspected that he had intestinal lymphoma but it was never officially diagnosed bc i opted not to do a biopsy since he was already 7-8 years old. try adding powdered electrolytes to his water 3 x a week.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 24, 2011 12:28:54 GMT -5
I might be wrong on the timeline, but didn't Koda's IBD appear after his blockage surgery? So both the IBD and perpetual dehydration could be linked to the blockage/surgery
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Post by Deleted on Apr 24, 2011 16:38:18 GMT -5
Yes, I have a similar problem with Tindra. She has a chronic inflammatory condition after her bout with ECE and she's drinking enormous amounts of water. She's also eating quite a lot to compensate for the obvious reduced absorption of nutrients and water. She's able to rehydrate relatively well, but it's obvious that she's not as hydrated as she was before this. I'm a little worried how this will affect her in the long run. I'll be interested to hear how things progress for Koda.
When all the ferrets were severely ill with the ECE they were all greatly suffering from reduced absorption of fluids. It went on for many weeks, months for some, and I had to occasionally give them sub-q to keep them going. Luckily, everyone seems to have healed more or less except for Tindra.
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