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Post by Heather on Mar 10, 2014 18:18:31 GMT -5
Name: HF Forum Username: beckie
1. Where did you first learn about natural diets for ferrets?
I stumbled across this forum when I was googling to find good food for the ferrets.
2. Please describe the type of diet you would like assistance in switching your ferret(s) to. Be sure to include if you are interested in feeding whole prey (live or frozen-thawed) and if you are wanting to FULLY switch to a natural diet or PARTIALLY. If you are unsure what kind of diet you want to put your ferrets on, please express that and we can help you find the best type of natural diet for your ferret.
I'd like to fully switch to a diet of frankenprey and whole prey.
3. Why are you interested in switching your ferrets to a natural diet?
Because I believe it's the best thing for them. One of my ferrets now has insulinoma and it wasn't until I started researching it that I realised the kibble I've been given him could have contributed massively.
4. Do you understand that switching your ferret to a natural diet can be a lengthy, arduous process? Its not an overnight switch. It can be a commitment of several weeks or even months. Your HF Mentor will be more then happy to assist you in switchng your ferret(s) to a natural diet, but you need to be equally as commited. If you aren't willing to tough out a potentially lengthy switching process, or if you have major life changes approaching (baby on the way, moving, starting school, getting married/divorced, etc) then it might be a better idea to wait on switching your ferret's diet until you have more time. Are you willing to make the commitment?
I am certainly committed to this and will do everything I can do get my fuzzies eating the way nature intended!
5. How many ferrets do you currently have? What are their names? Ages? Genders? Do they have any health problems? Are they overweight? Underweight? How long have you had each ferret for?
I have 2. George and Esmerelda. They were rescue and I think they are about 3ish.
1 male and female.
Esmerelda had to have a benign tumor removed last month, but other than that seems fit and healthy.
George is a different story. He has just had an operation for insulinoma and had 1/2 of his pancreas removed. Since he had his first percieved insulinoma attack about 3 weeks ago he has stopped eating everything apart from chicken mini strips cat treats, ferretvite and ferretone.
The vet thought his appetite would improve and he'd go back to normal after the op, but it's been 3 days and he is still snubbing proper food. We've tried him with 2 types of kibble that he usually eats, applaws kitten and also cat food, mackeral in brine, duck soup (Cooked chicken and liver) and most recently chicken baby food. He's not interested in any of it! I've stopped feeding him the ferretvite and ferretone after members on here advised me to, but I'm worried if I stop feeding him the chicken strips he won't be eating anything at all. We have been syringe feeding him, but he hates it and struggles a lot ad generally finds it very stressful.
Both ferrets aren't underweight (George was weighed at the vets today) and I've had them both for about 2.5years.
6. What diet do you currently feed your ferrets? (Please include all treats, supplements, etc) Do they already eat some form of soup?
They were eating James wellbeloved or ferret feast with no problems. Esmerelda is still eating that. Treats are those chicken strip cat treats, malt paste, ferretone and ferretvite. I've tried George with soup but he's not interested.
7. Have you ever tried to switch your ferrets to a natural diet in the past? If yes, what happened?
No.
8. What additional information about yourself or your ferrets would you like to share?
I think everything relevant is above, but if you have any further questions please let me know!
9. How often during the week do you have access to a computer?
Everyday.
10. Please post a picture of each of your ferrets (if possible).
Hi and welcome to the mentoring program (wave). In a little while your mentor (Sherry) will introduce herself and you can get started on a new adventure in natural ferret care and diets. Please remember to post regularly (daily or as per arranged with your mentor) so that your mentor can assist you move along safely in this adventure. If you experience computer difficulties or are going to be away, please notify your mentor and most of all relax and have fun (dance) . Your mentor is here to help you on this journey. ciao
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Post by Sherry on Mar 11, 2014 8:28:20 GMT -5
Hello there! I'm Sherry, and I'll be your mentor for their switch First, a little about me. I'm 55, and have my own housecleaning business here in Calgary Alberta. I have 4 cats, ranging in age from 11 yrs, to 19(only one would eat raw, unfortunately ). I also have 8 ferrets. Boris and Vincent(rip) came first, two brothers, a sable and albino. Then Sinnead(rip). I got her when she was 4. She passed at almost the age of 8, had adrenal for 3 years, treated with lupron for 2 of those. After that came my first deaf ferret, Lucrezia(adrenal). A marked DEW. Then two foster ferrets, whom we fell in love with and adopted- Zeus(DIP) and Athena(DIP), both two years old at that time. Both were adrenal, and on lupron until they passed from adrenal related lymphomas at the age of 5. After that, a little abused ferret we called Willow. She was the worst fear biter I've had, although now she's become a sweetie. She has also developed insulinoma due to a variety of issues. Then, Emily. 1 month younger than Willow, and those two have bonded strongly. She's the only one Willow wasn't terrified of. Suki is the last one, I swear! She was a little 8 month old darling the pet store was having a hard time selling, so were getting ready to send her back! While transitioning the first four, Boris was my hold out. EVERYTHING I gave him was poison, in his mind . Worst little drama queen I've seen yet . Twisting to get away, gagging, retching- he did all of it! Then one day- he ate it! Every single piece on the plate ! Those four haven't looked back. The next two for transitioning were the fosters. Until we adopted them, I could only supplement with raw. So in order not to cause unnecessary tummy upsets(mixing kibble and raw too closely can cause some problems- more about that later), I'd give them raw one day, and kibble on a different day. So, by the time we adopted, they had no problem with 100% raw diet. With Willow, I brought her home, and she flatly refused to eat the totally ferret kibble, so I went back to the pet store and got her a small bag of the crap they were feeding them there, and brought it home. I tried to give her some, but she just upset the dish. So- I tried her with some chicken breast. She ate it up! Hasn't had kibble since . Emily came to us as a raw fed ferret, so no issues there. Suki was another kibble head, but caging her in the daytime with Miss Emily showed her how to eat raw. And now- we've added Mr. Frodo, who essentially switched himself second day he was here That's me and mine in a nutshell The reason I started looking a raw feeding was something my vet said to me. I was, at the time, giving them small pieces of fruit for treats. She told me that was VERY bad for them, and in fact, some studies have started to link early feeding of sugars with insulinoma later in life. So- I started thinking. Kibbles are full of carbs. It's all those grains/veg/fruits in them. Those are converted to sugars by the body. To me then, sugar= potential insulinoma. So, I started checking out various diets. I had no idea what an obligate carnivore was at the time. I found out! Not much wonder there was soooo much poop in the box! I may as well have been tossing my money in there. They can't process anything that's not meat based! So I feed meat Their fur is softer, their energy levels are amazing- no mad rushes then crashing. Even my three year old's teeth are amazing. No plaque whatsoever Healing is faster, and if they do get ill, they have more reserves to rely on than when they were just kibble fed! And there is a LOT LESS POOP!!!! Yay! I'm looking forward to helping your little ones get on a much healthier diet, and having fun while we're at it We adopted 4 more from the local rescue just over a year ago, bringing our numbers back up to 9 again 7m old Cody as well as a bonded trio of 2yr old males, Judge, Indie, and Odin(also adrenal). All are also now fully raw fed
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Post by Deleted on Mar 11, 2014 13:07:28 GMT -5
Yaay thanks Sherry. You have quite the ferret clan at the moment!
I've had 2 ferrets in the past, named Itchy and Scratchy. Kibble fed rescues with a history of biting. It took about 6 months but they turned into lovely little fuzzies. Sadly Scratchy died of adrenal at about 3, but Itchy lived til he was about 8 and died in his sleep.
My dad always had ferrets when I was a child, but he's very much of the working ferret type person. They lived outside and were used for rabbiting. I knew from the first time I met his first ferret Freddie that I'd love to adopt some when I was older and the rest is history really!
I guess you want to know where I'm at with my fuzzies right now. Esmerelda: Es was eating kibble soup mixed with chicken, but has backtracked a bit and is back on kibble. She's sniffed at the meat we give George and also taken some and hidden it, but that's about as much as she'll do at this stage.
George: You may remember my early posts as George stopped eating completely and we really struggled trying to get something in him that wasn't a chicken cat treat. Well it turned out all he wanted was some proper meat! He will now eat chicken meat, hearts and gizzards are his fave and he'll eat some liver if it's mixed in with the heart. I also sprinkle most meals with bone meal for him (Prob 7/10 meals). I've tried him on turkey but he's not so sure so at the moment I'm just trying to sneak a bit into his chicken.
I'm not sure what else you need to know right now, feel free to ask anything I've missed!
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Post by Sherry on Mar 12, 2014 8:28:54 GMT -5
Okay, that sums it up nicely I gather George has zero interest in the kibble ATM? If not, no problem removing it from the cage for 3-4 hours prior to trying a raw soup with Esmerelda, just so she has an appetite when you try her with it. Since she's backtracked on the kibble soup, we may as well "go for the gold" Make it up according to the link in the original post in the mentoring app. What you'll want to do is start dabbing it on the end of her nose then put her back down. Do this every 5-10 minutes when you have them out playing. After a couple hours of this, pick her up and offer her a taste of it from your finger. Some will accept it at this point, some won't so don't be discouraged if she doesn't. Also- don't be surprised by ANY reaction from her. Whether it's spitting, gagging, retching, coughing, whining, twisting to get away from it, anything. That's just a ferret being a typical drama queen Keep this up every time she's out playing. Once she's accepting it from your finger willingly, then try offering from a spoon, and finally a dish- all on your lap. We'll work at getting her eating it on her own at that point. Put the kibble back in the cage with her when she goes back in. For George- is he on meds at the moment? Some still need them, and some don't. Our girl was one the surgery didn't work for. If he isn't, and his BG is still stable then he can just carry on as he is at the moment and not worry too much Since he's doing well with the chicken- how large are the pieces he's getting? We need to also start working on getting some bone in there soon in spite of the bone meal, but for the moment let's get him going on the turkey. You have the right idea about the turkey, and sneaking it in Another method is to "marinate" them together. A small amount of turkey finely slivered mixed in well with his meal of chicken. Leave them covered on the counter together for about an hour, then give it to him. The turkey slivers will taste more like the chicken and he should accept them easier. You'll go from that to slowly increasing the size and number of pieces of turkey to chicken. Let me know how they do!
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Post by Deleted on Mar 12, 2014 11:56:06 GMT -5
Great stuff, thanks Sherry. I'll start on the soup with Es right away and will carry on with my sneaking with George. He's not on any meds at the moment and seems to be doing fine. Do you know if there's any way I can test his BG without a pricey trip to the vets?
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Post by Sherry on Mar 13, 2014 9:08:05 GMT -5
Pick yourself up a glucose meter kit from your local drug store Someone actually sent me the Reli-on one from Walmart since they cost a LOT more here in Canada. I've found it works quite well. You will have to take it to the vet's and calibrate it against their's, so you have a better idea of what the variation is, but just a BG reading shouldn't be very much. They also use a glucometer for that. Takes about 30 seconds.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 14, 2014 12:41:41 GMT -5
Will do, thanks!
So a bit of an update, George isn't fond of turkey so I've been trying to sneak it in. He's mostly been flipping his food dish as far as he can haha. I'll try cutting the turkey bits up even smaller and see what happens. Esmerelda is still not loving the soup, but I'll continue with the dabbing. She seems to like licking georges bowl of meat, though won't eat it!
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Post by Sherry on Mar 14, 2014 13:20:02 GMT -5
That's actually good progress for Ezmerelda! Keep doing what you are with her(dabbing every 5-10 m when out). Try slivering the turkey the size if your pinky nail crescent and mix together well at least an hour prior to offering it. Just use 4-5 slivers and increase as he eats them.
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Post by katt on Mar 15, 2014 18:27:22 GMT -5
Hi Beckie! Sherry will be out for a few days so I'm stepping in until she gets back. I'll be back later to read the thread and catch up with where you are, I just wanted to pop in and introduce myself.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 16, 2014 3:14:34 GMT -5
Great stuff, thanks! I'll be posting the weight/mood/menu update later on.
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Post by katt on Mar 17, 2014 11:33:51 GMT -5
Just popping in for updates - how are they doing?
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Post by Deleted on Mar 17, 2014 11:46:36 GMT -5
Hi, they are ok. Please see my weekly update below...
1. Ferret's name:Esmerelda 2. Ferret's weight:1.1Kg 3. Ferret has eaten a small amount on average per meal, as we are at the raw soup dabbing stage. She has biscuits during the day and the soup comes out for playtime. 4. Stools on various proteins. Standard kibble poos at the moment. 5. Activity levels:High, I think she's full of the joys of spring at the moment! 6. Weekly menu:She's on James well beloved kibble with the raw soup from the mentoring post at playtime.
1. Ferret's name: George 2. Ferret's weight:1.4Kg 3. Ferret has eaten 2oz amount on average per meal. 4. Stools on various proteins.At the moment they are mostly small and dark. 5. Activity levels: High as well! 6. Weekly menu: Only got my mentor notification through last weds so that's when I started noting down the food.
Weds: am- 1.4oz chicken meat with bone meal. Pm- 2oz mixed chicken meat and heart. Thurs: am- 1.1oz turkey meat with bone meal. Pm- 2oz turkey (He didn't eat all of this, we found some the next day under the couch so he prob only ate about 2oz) Fri: am- 2oz heart. Pm- 2oz heart. Saturday- 1.4 Chicken with small amount of turkey slivers. Pm- 2oz of the same. Sunday- 2oz Chicken with small amount of turkey slivers. Pm- same again.
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Post by katt on Mar 18, 2014 1:46:17 GMT -5
1. Ferret's name:Esmerelda 2. Ferret's weight:1.1Kg 3. Ferret has eaten a small amount on average per meal, as we are at the raw soup dabbing stage. She has biscuits during the day and the soup comes out for playtime. 4. Stools on various proteins. Standard kibble poos at the moment. 5. Activity levels:High, I think she's full of the joys of spring at the moment! 6. Weekly menu:She's on James well beloved kibble with the raw soup from the mentoring post at playtime. Just curious for Esmerelda - I won't try and change up Sherry's methods here since she'll be back in a few days, but have you tried kibble soup? What often works well for a lot of ferrets is to start with a kibble soup (familiar taste, get them used to the texture, and easier to make gradual changes), and gradually mix in the raw soup. I have yet to see a kibble fed ferret who doesn't like kibble soup (though I'm sure there's some out there lol). To make kibble soup soak the kibble in warm water for a few min, then add a little more and blend it up. From there you have a nice soup that you can sloooowly mix raw soup into. You add a little more raw soup at a time, while eventually gradually decreasing the kibble soup. I prefer this method as you don't have to separate feeding times. But if she isn't taking to dabbing soup on her nose or hand feeding raw soups, this is another approach to keep in mind. Like I said, stick with whatever Sherry has you doing, but this is another trick you can keep in your tool-belt. For George...his poops are small and dark - are they well formed? How dark? Small is to be expected, raw fed poops are significantly smaller and less frequent. Weds: am- 1.4oz chicken meat with bone meal. Pm- 2oz mixed chicken meat and heart. Thurs: am- 1.1oz turkey meat with bone meal. Pm- 2oz turkey (He didn't eat all of this, we found some the next day under the couch so he prob only ate about 2oz) Fri: am- 2oz heart. Pm- 2oz heart. Saturday- 1.4 Chicken with small amount of turkey slivers. Pm- 2oz of the same. Sunday- 2oz Chicken with small amount of turkey slivers. Pm- same again.Have you tried any non-poultry meats yet? If not, I'd try to start introducing something. I find pork is a good starter for non-poultry proteins as it is still pretty mild in taste (vs say beef which is strongly flavored and generally takes them longer to accept).
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Post by Deleted on Mar 18, 2014 2:47:50 GMT -5
Hello, thanks for your message She was on kibble soup, but had backtracked a bit so Sherry suggested just jumping straight in. I do have a bit of an update on this actually as last night she ate a small pot of the raw soup so I left some in her cage and she ate about 1/2 of what i gave her which is definitely good news! For George, we tried some rabbit a few weeks ago as we have some in the freezer from when we were trying to get him to eat anything at all and he wasn't keen. I will try some of that again and will pick up some pork this week and start sneaking it in.
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Post by katt on Mar 18, 2014 3:27:16 GMT -5
Hello, thanks for your message She was on kibble soup, but had backtracked a bit so Sherry suggested just jumping straight in. I do have a bit of an update on this actually as last night she ate a small pot of the raw soup so I left some in her cage and she ate about 1/2 of what i gave her which is definitely good news! For George, we tried some rabbit a few weeks ago as we have some in the freezer from when we were trying to get him to eat anything at all and he wasn't keen. I will try some of that again and will pick up some pork this week and start sneaking it in. Oh that is great news! (dance) Good girl! Keep it up. Hopefully she will keep eating the raw soup so you can remove the kibble entirely soon. Definitely a big step. For George start out by sneaking just a small amount of very little pieces (slivers even) of rabbit into his current food. If he doesn't balk at that start to gradually increase it. You can do the same for pork too once you get some.
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