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Post by Heather on Jan 15, 2014 23:18:37 GMT -5
HF Forum Username: gfountain
1. Where did you first learn about natural diets for ferrets? not sure exactly.. I've been aware of feeding raw for other species for years, and thought it just made sense for ferrets as well, so I began researching.
2. Please describe the type of diet you would like assistance in switching your ferret(s) to. Be sure to include if you are interested in feeding whole prey (live or frozen-thawed) and if you are wanting to FULLY switch to a natural diet or PARTIALLY. If you are unsure what kind of diet you want to put your ferrets on, please express that and we can help you find the best type of natural diet for your ferret. I think I probably want to do a partial switch..I'm a little lazy and like the convenience of kibble, especially when I have to be gone for several hours. Actually, I'm not sure about full switch or partial, but I definitely don't think I can handle whole prey.
3. Why are you interested in switching your ferrets to a natural diet? health benefits
4. Do you understand that switching your ferret to a natural diet can be a lengthy, arduous process? Its not an overnight switch. It can be a commitment of several weeks or even months. Your HF Mentor will be more then happy to assist you in switchng your ferret(s) to a natural diet, but you need to be equally as commited. If you aren't willing to tough out a potentially lengthy switching process, or if you have major life changes approaching (baby on the way, moving, starting school, getting married/divorced, etc) then it might be a better idea to wait on switching your ferret's diet until you have more time. Are you willing to make the commitment? yes
5. How many ferrets do you currently have? What are their names? Ages? Genders? Do they have any health problems? Are they overweight? Underweight? How long have you had each ferret for? 1 male, Mr. Slink E. Magoo, age 7 months, almost 3 lbs., no health problems known, owned by him for almost 4 months
6. What diet do you currently feed your ferrets? (Please include all treats, supplements, etc) Drs. Foster & Smith kibble, Purina Smartblend Kitten, Marshall's Premium Chicken, Chicken or Turkey baby food, Ferretone for training, pure pumpkin once in a while for funky poops, raw egg yolk once a week
7. Have you ever tried to switch your ferrets to a natural diet in the past? If yes, what happened? Not really. I've tried giving him both cooked and raw chicken & he won't touch it. He absolutely LOVES his baby food, so I've tried mixing the chicken with that & he eats around it.
8. What additional information about yourself or your ferrets would you like to share? Idk.. what else do you want to know?
9. How often during the week do you have access to a computer? Every day
10. Please post a picture of each of your ferrets (if possible). I don't have any from above.. I'll do that soon.
11. Have you met the requirements for this program? Do you have your scale, a place to access meats, hearts, livers, etc? yes
Hi and welcome to the mentoring program (wave) . In a little while your mentor (Miamiferret2) will introduce himself and you can get started on a new adventure in natural ferret care and diets. Please remember to post regularly (daily or as per arranged with your mentor) so that your mentor can assist you move along safely in this adventure. Also note there may have been some changes in the application and how you should post so please review these before proceeding. If you have any questions feel free to either ask your mentor or any of the admins. If you experience computer difficulties or are going to be away, please notify your mentor and most of all relax and have fun . Your mentor is here to help you on this journey. ciao
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Post by miamiferret2 on Jan 16, 2014 12:38:55 GMT -5
hello there. i am your mentor. nice to meet you.
what types of meat/organs can you find at your grocery store?
i want to get you to point where you are rotating at least 3 different proteins (e.g., chicken, lamb, beef, cornish game hens, turkey, venison-- any 3 proteins that you ca find).
right now we will start with a raw chicken mush. please let me know whether you can obtain the following ingredients so that we can start:
raw chicken thighs chicken hearts chicken livers pulverized eggshell powder OR human grade bone meal powder. to make the pulverized eggshells at home, save your egg shells, dry out completely. then run through clean coffee grinder or clean pepper mill until a fine powder.
or they sell it. Eggshellent calcium can be found online.
for bone meal powder stick with human grade. NOW brand makes bone meal powder and it is good brand.
since you only have one ferret, i suggest that you get some extra virgin olive oil and a few plastic ice cube trays. in the beginning we will make the raw mush and then we will rub some olive oil on paper towel, rub on ice cube trays, then we will pour the mixture into the ice cube trays. freeze, then pop out and store in a zip lock back. this way you waste less and can thaw out the cubes as you transition him.
we will start with the beginners raw chicken soupies. once you let me know that you have everything. 8 oz chicken (take meat off the thighs and leave some skin but not too much), 1 chicken liver, about 1 ounce of chicken hearts, and then you add 1/2 tsp eggshell powder or bone meal powder. grind up in a food processor or whatever you have to grind up food. some people use things like the Ninja or the Magic Bullet. whatever works for you.
grind up so that it is kind of like a yogurt consistency.
let me know once you have gathered the ingredients and made the soup.
I would like for you to post your little buddy's weight on this thread at least once a week. very important to keep track of their weight during the switch.
looking forward to working with you!
(dance) (dance)
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Post by miamiferret2 on Jan 16, 2014 13:02:18 GMT -5
print out this frankenprey menu. it is the "bible" for feeding a balanced raw diet using "frankenprey" (meat/bones/organs that you can find at any human grocery store). a raw diet must be balanced properly to be healthy. if you follow these rules, you will feed a balanced diet
ferrets should have a minimum of 3 proteins in rotation. the more the better but 3 is the minimum. different types of poultry DO count as different proteins. so you can do chicken, turkey, and cornish game hen. those would be different proteins. i like to add lamb and beef as well. venison too.
Basic Frankenprey Menu
Monday am: edible bone in meat Monday pm: edible bone in meat Tuesday am: edible bone in meat Tuesday pm: muscle meat Wednesday am: edible bone in meat Wednesday pm: heart Thursday am: edible bone in meat Thursday pm: edible bone in meat Friday am: edible bone in meat Friday pm: muscle meat Saturday am: edible bone in meat Saturday pm: muscle meat Sunday am: edible bone in meat Sunday pm: liver/organ what are edible "bone in meat": chicken with bone (wings, necks, backs, thighs--but not legs bc usually any weight bearing bone on poultry are too big and ferrets cannot break up those bones with their teeth). whole quail, rabbit, turkey necks, ribs, and wing tips. duck neck, ribs, and wing tips. pork button bones, pork rib ends. whole cornish game hen.
another "bone in meat" can be any commercial frozen raw with 10% to 15% ground bone or any freeze dried raw with 10%-15% ground bone. some brands that I use are Stella & Chewys, Vital Essentials and Natures Variety Instinct. what are "muscle meat" meals: any heart meat. chicken muscle meat(including gizzard) turkey meat, duck, lamb, goat, beef, CGH, venison, elk, basically any meat without bone. IMPORTANT: every ferret must have at least 2-3 ounces of raw hearts per week. they get taurine from raw hearts. if you cannot find hearts (or if they are not eating 2-3 ounces of hearts per week) give them 250 mg of taurine per day. i use NOW brand taurine. what are considered organ meat: Liver, kidney, thymus, pancreas, reproductive organs, lung, brain, snout, basically any part of the body that secretes. IMPORTANT: every ferret must have at least 2 ounces of liver per week, plus 2 ounces of one other organ (usually kidney is all that people can find at the grocery stores). you can grind these up and add a little to their food spread it out over various meals. some organs are very rich tasting and your ferrets may turn their nose up at it. best to disguise it in some grinds.
meat must be RAW:
if you cook meat, it defeats the whole purpose of feeding a raw diet. cooking destroys many natural vitamins and minerals in raw meat/bones/organs.
Taurine is very important for ferrets. it is best to use dark meat in poultry bc it has more taurine than others. also the dark meat is higher in fat. ferrets require over 20% fat in their diets. good sources of taurine are hearts and tongue. if you run out of hearts or cannot fine tongue, you can give each ferret 250 mg of taurine with each meal (two meals per day). a good brand to use is NOW taurine because it has no weird fillers.
BONE: it is imperative that your ferret gets at least 9 of meals as bone in meats. they need the bone for calcium. if need be, you can feed snacks in the middle of the day that consist of bone in meats like chicken wings or necks that way you can make up for meals where they did not eat all bone or if you skipped a bone in meat meal.
you can tell if your ferret is not getting enough bone if their poops are too loose. too much bone and they will be constipated.
in an emergency, if you run out of bone in meats, you can use pulverized eggshells or human grade bone meal powder. again the NOW brand is a good brand to use for bonemeal. you should add 1/2 teaspoon of the eggshell or bone meal for every 8 ounces of muscle meat.
BONES MUST BE RAW:
COOKED bones are never safe to feed because they splinter and they can perforate the stomach or intestines. raw bones are safe because they will not splinter. when they pass through the stomach and intestines they are actually rounded out by the acids in the ferret's stomach. so when they come out the other end, the bones look rounded, no sharp edges.
an average healthy male should eat about 3-4 ounces per day. larger males can eat more than 4 ounces. during summer they tend to eat a bit less.
a female can eat anywhere from 1 to 3 ounces per day. larger females can eat more than 3 ounces per day though.
HAIRBALLS:
a healthy diet item that you can use for hairballs is RAW EGG YOLK. you can give 1 teaspoon of raw eggyolk 3 x a week (per ferret) that would be approx 2 large egg yolks per week if you have 2 ferrets. if they will not take it straight up, just mix into their meat grinds. i like to use quail eggs because they are small and i do not waste any yolk. i only have one ferret so he gets 1 quail egg every other day. quail eggs hardly have any whites. i do not even bother separating the whites out.
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Post by gfountain on Jan 16, 2014 14:27:00 GMT -5
Hi.. I'm excited to start the switch and I have/can get everything on your list, but unfortunately, I'm going to have to wait until next week to begin. My grandpa, my rock, died yesterday morning & my weekend is shaping up to be hectic, with the funeral and 5000 relatives coming in.
I'll work on getting pictures & weight done this weekend if I get a chance, but I won't be able to make the soupie until Sunday or Monday at the earliest. Thanks for your patience.
Gina
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Post by miamiferret2 on Jan 16, 2014 16:32:24 GMT -5
oh no i am so sorry Gina! that is so hard. may your grandpa rest in peace. it is ok . just let me know when you are ready.
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Post by gfountain on Jan 20, 2014 12:03:41 GMT -5
OK, I am back. Somehow in all the confusion this weekend, I have misplaced my hearts so I'm going shopping after work. It will be late, so I'll make his soup tomorrow. The poor little guy has been a little stressed this weekend... a new Ferret Nation cage (Thursday night) + extra people in his house + change in schedule = exhausted ferret and funny poops
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Post by gfountain on Jan 21, 2014 10:17:15 GMT -5
Well, the store where I got the hearts from last week no longer carries them. I called every grocery store/butcher in town and no one has any. Is there anything I can substitute for them until I can find them again?
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Post by miamiferret2 on Jan 22, 2014 13:32:34 GMT -5
hello welcome back! sorry i took so long to respond. i tried downloading that stupid proboards app to my android phone and it is not working.
until you can get your hands on some raw hearts, go to the vitamin shoppe or any other health /vitamin store and buy Taurine capsules (get the ones you break open). you can add about 400 mg per day. the importance of the raw hearts is to add natural taurine to their diet. i always add taurine regardless of the raw hearts that my ferret eats. i add about 250 mg per day in addition. so it is a good thing to keep on hand. taurine is pretty cheap. i buy NOW brand taurine.
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Post by gfountain on Jan 22, 2014 13:43:06 GMT -5
OK, I can do that. I think I can probably also get a beef heart pretty easily, since I live on a dairy farm. Would that work if I can't get the chicken hearts this week? I also have chicken gizzards in my freezer, but don't know exactly what to do with them.
I went ahead and pureed the thigh meat, liver, & egg shell last night, but haven't frozen any yet, so I can still add the heart when I get it. I don't know if I should have, but I added maybe half a teaspoon of the raw mush to the monster's baby food last night & he ate it right down.
His weight as of last night (before eating like a piggie) was 2 lbs. 11 oz.
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Post by miamiferret2 on Jan 23, 2014 12:36:13 GMT -5
yes that should be fine. that is awesome ! if you can get him on raw mush straight away then more power to you. some ferrets are more stubborn than others. some take to it immediately. try just giving him more of the raw mush tonight and less of the baby food.
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Post by miamiferret2 on Jan 23, 2014 12:37:13 GMT -5
chicken gizzards are tough. right now they are just starting so need to work up jaw strength. once we move up to slivers chunks of meat/bones you can slice up some gizzards while they are partially frozen (easier to cut up that way) and then see if they like them.
gizzards are considered a muscle meat.
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Post by gfountain on Jan 23, 2014 12:54:14 GMT -5
I added about a tsp. of the raw to his baby food last night (along with 1/2 tsp of pumpkin), but he only ate about half of it. I left it in his cage for a while, but he never went back to it - he wanted his kibble instead. He is acting fine, but his poops have been kind of weird, thus the pumpkin.
I've been giving him a raw egg yolk once a week. Is that enough? I think it probably got missed this past weekend, so I thought I'd give him that tonight. Should I mix it with the raw mush, or just give it to him separately?
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Post by gfountain on Jan 23, 2014 12:55:49 GMT -5
What about the beef heart? I checked on that last night & I can get one any time I need it.
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Post by miamiferret2 on Jan 23, 2014 21:16:55 GMT -5
Yes you can use beef heart. about 3 ounces of heart per week. Beef heart is very rich. Best if you grind up and hide in the grinds you make.
Also i forgot to tell you to remove dry kibble a few hours before and after feeding raw as it may cause tummy issues.
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Post by gfountain on Jan 24, 2014 9:32:12 GMT -5
I only left a little bit of kibble in his cage with him yesterday and I ended up having to work late, so he was hungry by the time I got home last night. My husband let him out to play when he got home, but he wasn't sure about mixing up his food so he left that for me.
I got the taurine powder mixed into the raw mush. Then when I fixed his food, I accidentally dropped in more of the raw than I intended, so it was about half & half with baby food, and I had to thin it with about a teaspoon of water. (And I forgot the egg yolk.. just this second remembered that I was going to give it to him last night.) He acted kinda funny about it for a few minutes, but then his hunger got the best of him and he chowed down. He ended up eating about 2 oz. of the baby food/raw mixture. Then he passed out for the night on my lap. I put his kibble back in the cage before I went to bed & it looks like he ate a little bit during the night. He was still sleeping when I left this morning, so I didn't bother him by opening the door to check on poops.
So with the beef heart, how much do I put in the raw mush? I figured 1 oz. like the chicken heart, but now with the taurine powder in there, I'm not sure.
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