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Post by Heather on Jan 7, 2014 12:55:36 GMT -5
*****Emergency switching thread....Please fill out the application and let me know when you have. I or Katt will then copy it to this thread*****
Hi and welcome to the mentoring program (wave) . In a little while your mentor (Hurricanekatt) will introduce herself and you can get started on a new adventure in natural ferret care and diets. Please remember to post regularly (daily or as per arranged with your mentor) so that your mentor can assist you move along safely in this adventure. If you experience computer difficulties or are going to be away, please notify your mentor and most of all relax and have fun (dance) . Your mentor is here to help you on this journey. ciao
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Post by katt on Jan 8, 2014 1:39:19 GMT -5
Thanks Heather!
Copying my Q's from earlier thread here.
Do you have access to rabbit meat? Perhaps through HareToday? If they are eating canned, it might (key word here - they are ferrets after all LOL) be pretty quick to switch them onto commercial ground rabbit and then from there you can gradually work in new proteins while building up to whole foods.
When you say "my raw mix," what do you mean? Like what's in it specifically (ingredient wise), and what form is it (soup, ground, etc)?
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Post by Jeremy's Boggle on Jan 8, 2014 10:50:08 GMT -5
Lee answered me about the kibble, still using the zupreem or royal canine dry. So no need to rush out to get something special for them.
I can pick up some blue ridge rabbit today. I have a local raw food store. It will be late this evening before I'll be able to give it to them.
My mix is: 40lb course ground chicken things 5lb course ground beef or chicken hearts(I try to rotate between the two) 5lb ground beef or chicken liver 5lbs beef kidney 20lb blue ridge breeders choice 20lb blue ridge natural mix 8lb blue ridge quail or duck coconut oil 24 raw eggs with shells
Occasionally I add water to it to make a soup. They also get chicken necks or thighs 2-3x a week to chew on. On occasion ox tail as Walmart is the only place here who carries it & I almost never go there. Also whole dove minus the breast usually when I can put them in a cage outside as it make a huge mess. Most of mine can not handle any pork so that is not an option for us.
Our internet service has been a bit spotty with the weather(small local provider) so I may not be able to post between the hours of 7pm-9am due to outages. I do not have a smart phone.
Side note- I was in a car accident a few years ago & had an untreated head injury. My typing has been effected so if I don't have something spelled right or typed just so that is why. I can re-read it ten times & still not see my mistake. Plus I also type faster than my old computer can put the words up on the screen.
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Post by katt on Jan 8, 2014 16:50:42 GMT -5
Lee answered me about the kibble, still using the zupreem or royal canine dry. So no need to rush out to get something special for them. I can pick up some blue ridge rabbit today. I have a local raw food store. It will be late this evening before I'll be able to give it to them. My mix is: 40lb course ground chicken things 5lb course ground beef or chicken hearts(I try to rotate between the two) 5lb ground beef or chicken liver 5lbs beef kidney 20lb blue ridge breeders choice 20lb blue ridge natural mix 8lb blue ridge quail or duck coconut oil 24 raw eggs with shells Occasionally I add water to it to make a soup. They also get chicken necks or thighs 2-3x a week to chew on. On occasion ox tail as Walmart is the only place here who carries it & I almost never go there. Also whole dove minus the breast usually when I can put them in a cage outside as it make a huge mess. Most of mine can not handle any pork so that is not an option for us. Our internet service has been a bit spotty with the weather(small local provider) so I may not be able to post between the hours of 7pm-9am due to outages. I do not have a smart phone. Side note- I was in a car accident a few years ago & had an untreated head injury. My typing has been effected so if I don't have something spelled right or typed just so that is why. I can re-read it ten times & still not see my mistake. Plus I also type faster than my old computer can put the words up on the screen. So it sounds like you are feeding a lot of commercial raw then? They should do well on that, commercial ground is nice and easy to digest for IBD babies. Tonight try mixing a tiny bit of the ground rabbit into their canned food and see how they do. Texture and taste wise it should be fairly similar so I'm thinking you may not need to make it into a soup. Try finger feeding a few bites of the mix and see how they do. If they accept it right off the bat, then o we the next few meals gradually increase the raw rabbit and decrease the canned. You'll want to keep an eye on their poops but since they are already getting rabbit they hopefully won't have an issue with this first part. If they fight you, try more canned to raw ratio and mix in some water to make a soup. Let me know how they do!
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Post by katt on Jan 10, 2014 2:04:23 GMT -5
Any updates?
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Post by Jeremy's Boggle on Jan 10, 2014 8:37:45 GMT -5
Yesterday morning they ate 50-50 raw & canned rabbit & yesterday evening it was probably 1/3 canned. yet.
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Post by katt on Jan 10, 2014 14:07:49 GMT -5
Yesterday morning they ate 50-50 raw & canned rabbit & yesterday evening it was probably 1/3 canned. yet. Great! How are their poops so far? As soon as they're eating all raw rabbit, as long as their poops are still looking good, we can start trying new meats. When you get a chance, can you please copy and fill out the mentor application and paste it into a reply here? You don't have to include all of your ferrets, just the two newbies. Thanks.
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Post by Jeremy's Boggle on Jan 10, 2014 22:16:36 GMT -5
I have everything filled out except the picture part on the application. Already filled it out on everyone. I'll post it now & get the pictures up tomorrow evening. Poos are fine so far.
I'll also post their weights & do the proper update structure.
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Post by Jeremy's Boggle on Jan 10, 2014 22:18:45 GMT -5
HF Forum Username: Jeremy's Boggle
1. Where did you first learn about natural diets for ferrets? I began feeding my animals a raw diet 9 years ago. I learned to feed my ferrets raw properly here
2. Please describe the type of diet you would like assistance in switching your ferret(s) to. Be sure to include if you are interested in feeding whole prey (live or frozen-thawed) and if you are wanting to FULLY switch to a natural diet or PARTIALLY. If you are unsure what kind of diet you want to put your ferrets on, please express that and we can help you find the best type of natural diet for your ferret. I feed a course ground mix with chicken neck or thighs 2-3 times a week. Also the occasional whole dove minus the breast.
3. Why are you interested in switching your ferrets to a natural diet? I want to provide my animals with the best diet possible.
4. Do you understand that switching your ferret to a natural diet can be a lengthy, arduous process? Its not an overnight switch. It can be a commitment of several weeks or even months. Your HF Mentor will be more then happy to assist you in switchng your ferret(s) to a natural diet, but you need to be equally as commited. If you aren't willing to tough out a potentially lengthy switching process, or if you have major life changes approaching (baby on the way, moving, starting school, getting married/divorced, etc) then it might be a better idea to wait on switching your ferret's diet until you have more time. Are you willing to make the commitment? Yes, i am.
5. How many ferrets do you currently have? 18 What are their names? Ages? Genders? Do they have any health problems? Are they overweight? Underweight? How long have you had each ferret for? Angel- ~5 yrs old, female, adrenal, we've had her 4 months plus few months before that as a foster Crash- ~3-4 years old, female, no health issues, we've had her almost 2 yrs Clio- ~4-5 yrs old, female, adrenal, 2 months Doc- 3 yrs old, male, adrenal with des implant, we had him 1 yr Arthus- ~2 yrs old, male, adrenal with des implant, he will have been with us 1 yr in feb Fuby- ~2 yrs old, male, enlarge non-cancerous lymph nod which presses on his stomach, we had him 1 1/2yrs Sphynx- ~2 yrs old, female, no health issues, 2 months Sasha- ~2 yrs old, female, no health issues, we had her 1 yr & 4months Sam- ~2 yrs old, male, asthma, we had him 1 yr 4 months Aang- 2 yrs old, male, no health issues, we had him 1 yr 7 months Ava- 2 yrs old, female, JL treating with dexamethasone injections, we had her 1 yr & 2 months Bear- 1 yr olds, male, no health issues, we had him 1 yr 5 months Trixie- 1 yr old, female, no health issues, we had her 1 yr 5 months Usha- ~1 yr old, female, no health issues, we had her 4 months Scratch- ~1 yr old, female, no health issues, we had her 4 months Clark- ~1 yr old, male, no health issues, we had him 9 months George- ~1 yr old, male, ibd issues, we had him 5 days Scarlett- ~1 yr old, female, ibd issues, we had her 5 days
6. What diet do you currently feed your ferrets? (Please include all treats, supplements, etc) 40lb course ground chicken things 5lb course ground beef or chicken hearts(I try to rotate between the two) 5lb ground beef or chicken liver 5lbs beef kidney 20lb blue ridge breeders choice 20lb blue ridge natural mix 8lb blue ridge quail or duck coconut oil 24 raw eggs with shells
Occasionally I add water to it to make a soup. They also get chicken necks or thighs 2-3x a week to chew on. On occasion ox tail as Walmart is the only place here who carries it & I almost never go there. Most of mine can not handle any pork so that is not an option for us. Plus the occasional whole dove minus the breast. Vital Essentials freeze dried for treats, usually beef flavored
Scarlett & George have been on Royal canine kibble & canned rabbit with zupreem. 7. Have you ever tried to switch your ferrets to a natural diet in the past? If yes, what happened? I've switched more than 20 ferrets to raw. Usually it doesn't take more than 2 weeks. A few have switched themselves. 8. What additional information about yourself or your ferrets would you like to share?
9. How often during the week do you have access to a computer? Every day. As long as the internet isn't down. 10. Please post a picture of each of your ferrets (if possible).
11. Have you met the requirements for this program? Do you have your scale, a place to access meats, hearts, livers, etc? Yes. I have a cheap scale that measures ounces.
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Post by katt on Jan 10, 2014 23:00:40 GMT -5
I have everything filled out except the picture part on the application. Already filled it out on everyone. I'll post it now & get the pictures up tomorrow evening. Poos are fine so far. So your mix...I just realized - is that all ground together?? Also what is in the Blue Ridge parts? If they are all mixed, is there a particular reason you feed it that way instead of in separate meals? It's really important to try one protein at a time with IBD. Otherwise if they react you have no idea what caused the reaction. It's also a good idea to start a journal for them while you introduce new proteins so you can monitor patterns. Sometimes it's very obvious when they react, sometimes less so, but keeping a journal lets you see patterns over time. For example, some IBD ferrets are mildly sensitive to a meat and can handle 1-2 meals but if they get too many meals in a row, it can cause upset. Some react to sudden changes rather than the actual new protein, so their meals have to be constantly gradually changed. Keeping a journal is invaluable for detecting their patterns. Every IBD ferret is different.
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Post by Jeremy's Boggle on Jan 11, 2014 20:04:17 GMT -5
It is a all ground together. I do it this way to make sure they all eat the different meats & organs. It is really hard to be be sure that everyone is eating what they need to with so many of them. Scarlett & George have started having some seediness to their poos. The poo is still well formed. One of my other little ones is ill so I have to get back to her but here is the link to blue ridges' ingredients if you need to look at it before I can type it out here www.blueridgebeef.com/products-beef-ingredients-analysis.html#BC
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Post by katt on Jan 12, 2014 4:47:23 GMT -5
How much raw:canned are they getting right now?
The commercial ground rabbit - is it whole rabbit, or just muscle meat? For your mix - I assume you are able to get those ingredients separately and you grind them yourself?
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Post by Jeremy's Boggle on Jan 12, 2014 11:32:22 GMT -5
How much raw:canned are they getting right now? They are eating about 1/3 canned with the rest raw rabbitThe commercial ground rabbit - is it whole rabbit, or just muscle meat? It is muscle meat & bone. No organsFor your mix - I assume you are able to get those ingredients separately and you grind them yourself? Yes they are purchased separately & I mix/grind them together. I'll be buying all of the ingredients on Friday so I can set some aside to keep separated for them. breeder's choice- ground beef : protein 21%, fat 15%, fiber 1%, moisture 72% natural mix- ground beef, ground green tripe, ground beef heart, ground beef liver: protein 18%, fat 8%, fiber 1%, moisture 74% quail- ground quail, ground quail bone, no organs: protein 17%, fat 5%, fiber 1%, moisture 72% duck- ground duck, ground duck bone, no organs: protein 17%, fat 3%, fiber 1%, moisture 70%
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Post by katt on Jan 13, 2014 2:03:37 GMT -5
Okay great, just want to get my bearings. Keeping the proteins separate is going to be really important for these guys, esp in the beginning. Are beef and chicken the only organ meats that you have access to? Those 2 are the most common allergens/triggers, so just as a precaution you may want to look around and see if you can find other sources. I know you said you have some that don't do well with pork, but IF it is an option and something you have available, you may consider trying some pork organs and heart next. Most IBD ferrets do well with pork, and it is nice and fatty too to balance out the rabbit. I don't want to keep them on an all-rabbit diet for too long because of the low fat and low taurine levels in rabbit. I also don't want to try too many changes at once because then if they have a reaction you won't know what it is to. If you don't have other organ options, then we'll plan on giving chicken a try for the next protein. Beef seems to be a worse and more common allergy in IBD ferrets for some reason, so it will probably be best to try that later once you have multiple other proteins to fall back on. How are they doing with the added raw? If they are eating it willingly, you could try offering them just raw. Offer a little hand-fed, and if they like it you can cut out the canned food, and if not then you can mix a little in and keep working on it. I'd like to see them on all-raw rabbit for a day or two, just to make sure their poops are doing okay, and then start adding in the next protein.
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Post by Jeremy's Boggle on Jan 13, 2014 9:38:15 GMT -5
I have been hand feeding them since they arrived. They are playing & active but they didn't want to eat. They refused to eat at all. George is doing better & ate from the bowl yesterday but Scarlett is resisting eating anything. Sometimes I have to scuff her to get her to eat sometimes I just have to spoon feed her. Right now they don't associate the bowl in the cage as food so I don't have to worry about them sneaking food I'm not ready for them to try, so I"m planning on keeping the hand feeding going for awhile. George is good at letting me know he is hungry.
I was concerned about Scarlett & thought she was having major issues but it turns out that the potato chunks in the canned where backing up her system. So dropping the canned all together is a good idea.
I'll check with Theresa but I think chicken, beef & pork are the only organs she carries. There is a weird little store called Piggly Wiggly here that I can check out on Thursday that has all sorts of strange stuff.
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