Post by miamiferret2 on May 1, 2013 10:47:31 GMT -5
for hermes start making those slivers bigger. try to get it about size of your pinky. thickness at least. see if he eats it. is he still liking the dry freeze dried raw?
i would leave them both extra food for in between meals. but only raw. no gruel. hermes can eat his gruel/raw mush at meal time. but take the gruel out and only leave raw in between. you can also leave the dry freeze dried raw in between meals. it won't go bad.
keep an eye on their weight. we don't want them losing weight. they may not be eating enough. if you see that they are licking the bowls clean and losing weight, need more food. if you can get a kitchen scale (they sell them at target pretty cheap) you can weigh out their portions. boys usually eat about 4 ounces per day.
Thanks for the info about weight! I was freakin' last night when I saw they weighed less. I don't think it matters what kind of scale I get, they don't sit still--haha! I even put tone (have questions about tone too) in the big bowl to keep them still, and as they licked it, their weight went up/down/up.
I DO have a digital kitchen scale that weighs in grams or ounces for their food, but it only weighs up to a pound. I am using a digital postage scale for their weight that weighs up to 5 lbs.
Here's what I do regarding food when I'm gone. They are caged, so I only leave them freeze dried S&C Duck or Chicken in cubes, which they both love, and kibble.
When they are out of the cage (2-3 hours in evening), I fix their dinner (gruel/raw for Merlin) and all raw for Hermes. If they don't eat it all, I will leave it out for about an hour. They both usually will come back and finish it, or eat more.
Hermes usually finishes ALL of his raw, and, as you said, licks the bowl, at which time I give him more. Merlin will come back and eat a little more, but unless I feed him with a spoon, he won't finish it ALL.
HOW LONG IS SAFE TO LEAVE RAW OUT? IS IT DIFFERENT THAN HUMAN LIMITS? [not shouting, just drawing attention].
Post by miamiferret2 on May 2, 2013 8:14:09 GMT -5
Many people leave the raw mush out for 5-8 hours. Whole pieces of meat they leave out longer . If they are both eating the freeze dried raw for sure you can remove kibble completely. But if one is not eating all raw (or at least freeze dried raw) and willingly, then we have to put kibbles back in a few hours after they eat. Try making a meal for merlin using no gruel.Only raw. See if he eats it willingly now. He may. Might need coaxing.
I posted earlier, but I can't find it, "sigh", so I'll do it again. Please let me know if I'm doing this wrong!
Neither Merlin nor Hermes would eat any raw last night! I made 3/4 raw soup and 1/4 gruel for Merlin, and he licked it, then ran away. I picked him and attempted to feed him with a spoon. He did take some, but not nearly enough, I'd say maybe 2 TBS. Then he was totally bored. I let him go.
While I was working with Merlin, Hermes was smelling and licking his food. He never would eat it on his own. I don't think he liked the larger pieces. I bought more thighs and cut them into slightly larger pieces than I had been feeding him. About twice the size in the pics. He wanted to take them away from the bowl, and would just hold them in his mouth. He wouldn't open, chew or spit it out!! I tried to encourage him to eat it in the kitchen, but I finally let him go, and sure enough he went behind the couch. I can't move it alone, and so I don't know if it ate it or just hid it. I'll know in a few days I'm sure!!
The boys were up about 2 hours, and would go back to their bowls but never would eat. So, I put them to bed in their cages, and broke 2 Stella & Chewys wafers into pieces (3/4"). The both ate them all, and laid down to sleep.
The same scenario played out this morning!! Neither one wanted to eat!! So, I employed the very same routine as last night, and this time was worse. Neither one ate a drop!
Before I left for work, I set two S&C wafers on the top of the cage, and went to round up the boys. When I returned with Merlin, both wafers were GONE!! I put Merlin in the cage and went looking for Hermes. I found him in the hallway coming out of another bedroom, and he immediately laid flat looking at me. I asked him where he put the wafers, and the stinker jumped up and started war dancing all the way to the bedroom!!! I have no idea where those wafers went. There wasn't enough time for him to eat one, let alone two!!
They had two wafers broken up with a little kibble in their cage bowl. Now What?
Post by miamiferret2 on May 3, 2013 7:31:22 GMT -5
Ok how big were the meat slivers? Should be same raw mush recipe just add tiny slivers. We may have moved too fast for him. Sometimes if they don't want to eat the raw then there might be a weird smell or it went off. Was it left out ? They may not have been hungry bc you are leaving food in their cage. Are BOTH ferrets eating the freeeze dried raw? If yes remove the kibble. But make sure they actually are both eating it and not just stashing.
With Hermes and Merlin just keep trying to get them to eat all raw and all slivers. Put less gruel in the soup. I figured Merlin would be a slow switch. We just have to keep using same method until he has no gruel and all soup. If he is stubborn with higher concentration of raw then rub some into his gums or dab on his nose.
Hermes: The slivers were about twice the size as those in my pics (the larger ones). I did cut them up to make them about the size they were. He ate about an ounce.
Raw: I just can't get it in my soul to leave meat out for longer than an hour, then cover and refrigerate. I put the bowl with the meat in it in a larger bowl with hot water in it, to bring to room temp after it's been refrigerated. I NEVER zap it in microwave.
Merlin is so funny. He keeps going to Hermes' bowl and smelling his raw chunks, but won't eat.
Last night Merlin had maybe 1 cube chunky raw, no gruel. Not making any more. I had to spoon feed him again. He will eat just a tiny bit alone out of his bowl, he seems to prefer me holding and feeding him with spoon. Hope I'm not retarding his progress by doing that.
BOTH BOYS are eating freeze dried raw and seem to prefer it over EVERYTHING. They will push each other away from the bowl each trying to get more than the other when I put them in the cage. No more kibble in the bowl.
Going to get some goat milk (whole), and continue search for hearts and quail eggs Saturday.
I have a chiropractor appt. Saturday (she had ferrets in the past, so did an employee, so they must be good!) and have been in excruciating pain, but I'm gonna try to get out and about. (headwall)
Post by miamiferret2 on May 4, 2013 13:24:59 GMT -5
You are making progress. No need for kibbles at all and i prefer for them to have dry freeze dried raw in their cage rather than kibbles.
I think we just need to slowly increase the size of slivers on hermes. We, oved too fast for him. Dont worry about leaving the raw out for hours. If you keep ac on it should not go bad right away No need to make meat room temp. Sonny eats cold meat all the time.
Post by miamiferret2 on May 4, 2013 13:30:24 GMT -5
With merlin just keep lowering the spoon slowly to the plate until he is eating on his own off of plate. Or hold him and hold plate up to his face. Then lower ferret and plate onto the floor.
The good thing is that since you have them both on freeze dried raw and eliminated kibbles, you are 3/4 of the way there. we just need to get them both eating chunks then bone in meat. Then we can introduce different proteins like turkey, duck, lamb, whatever you can find. Once we get the diet balanced and they are eating bone, organs, hearts we will post your weekly menu and then Heather reviews and then you will "graduate" But we still have a ways to go for that. Lol Sometimes these things take a while. Taking it slow and having patience is required. You are doing great. I am proud of the progresss you have made
Post by miamiferret2 on May 6, 2013 11:56:36 GMT -5
try making them a meal with just liver and chopped hearts. take 1 liver for now, take about 6 hearts, mince up/grind finely and see if they will eat that on their own. what most people do is they will feed the bone in meats or muscle meat meals throughout the week, and then they will feed 2 organ/heart meals each week. makes life easier if they eat the organs on their own because otherwise you will have to grind up the organs and blend in with the raw grinds throughout the week to ensure that they are each getting the requisite organs/hearts for the week.