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Post by Deleted on Apr 9, 2011 3:17:00 GMT -5
No, no feeders angoras are too neat-o for that. Anyways, great set-up, but - YIKES. I need to know how old that doe is!!! If she's even 4 weeks old she could very likely be preggers with 4 bucks around her all the time. Eek. I would take her out A.S.A.P. For the bucks, the seriously best solution I have for you is to get 5 gallon tanks, one for each male. Smaller, cheaper, and saves space. It will do for one mouse, though a 10 gallon is really better. Check Craigslist for deals, check freecycle and ebay classifieds. Until you could afford to do that you could invest in some cheap, plastic critter keepers OR clear, thick, plastic tubs that you will need to modify with ventilation holes. Not ideal, but will save you $$ in the short-term while you save for the long-term. Other than that, I have an idea of what I MIGHT be able to do to help but I can't guarantee anything so...
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Post by tinytippytoes on Apr 9, 2011 4:12:14 GMT -5
How did I miss this thread LOL. Those meecers are so cute!! What beautiful colors. My Moose used to live on a shelf...6 ft long. See mice are afraid of heights so he lived a nice life up there. Miss him bad he was such a mush. I agree with candice although if you were closer I'd take a few babes off your hands LOL
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Post by Deleted on Apr 9, 2011 10:34:28 GMT -5
I had no idea mice were afraid of heights!
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Post by Deleted on Apr 9, 2011 16:20:30 GMT -5
I can't find 5 gallon tanks cheaper than $15 a pop, but I figured out something I could do for free...I have a bunch of leftover luan plywood I used face my aquarium stand with, so I cut out some panels and duct taped them together (non-toxic and I already had a roll) to make a five-way barrier. Four of the sections are 7.5" x 14.5" and the end piece is 7" x 15". About as much floor space as a 5 gallon tank each, and for cleaning I can put them in individual plastic bins, pull the barrier straight up, and have easy access to the whole tank. They'll have to take turns with the wheel though. I think ultimately I'd like to rehome three of the boys, keep a barrier up so Vash (he's our favorite) can have a third-ish of the tank, and use the larger space for Smokey and find her a couple of girlfriends.
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Post by tinytippytoes on Apr 9, 2011 18:02:40 GMT -5
I had no idea mice were afraid of heights! This where I got the idea. Now no 2 mice are the same it may a bit more harder to do with lots of them. But Moose being a male lived by himself. You have to know your meecers before you do this. This women fascinates me cause she has sooo many pets! But she lives on a farm with lots of help. She has a ferret too. www.youtube.com/user/CreekValleyCritters#p/u/119/T65wJyQ0FIo
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Post by tinytippytoes on Apr 9, 2011 18:04:52 GMT -5
I can't find 5 gallon tanks cheaper than $15 a pop, but I figured out something I could do for free...I have a bunch of leftover luan plywood I used face my aquarium stand with, so I cut out some panels and duct taped them together (non-toxic and I already had a roll) to make a five-way barrier. Four of the sections are 7.5" x 14.5" and the end piece is 7" x 15". About as much floor space as a 5 gallon tank each, and for cleaning I can put them in individual plastic bins, pull the barrier straight up, and have easy access to the whole tank. They'll have to take turns with the wheel though. I think ultimately I'd like to rehome three of the boys, keep a barrier up so Vash (he's our favorite) can have a third-ish of the tank, and use the larger space for Smokey and find her a couple of girlfriends. Can you put little wheels in there you know hang them from the top so they can get some exercise? Thats pretty cool what you did but do you think they can chew though it?
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Post by Deleted on Apr 9, 2011 19:38:01 GMT -5
Cool setup hope they like it
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Post by Deleted on Apr 9, 2011 20:32:23 GMT -5
Tiny - I think it'll be fine, it's 1/4" thick plywood and every edge (other than the top which is 16" tall) is either flush up against the glass or covered with tape so there's really no where for them to dig in. It's also a very temporary set-up, I really want to find a good home (or homes) for 3 of the boys and then create something more permanent/nicer/spacious to keep the remaining guy and girl separate. These guys are appx. 4 weeks old and it sounds like this is when the issues with aggression and early breeding start occurring so I cobbled this together this morning for their safety. For the moment I'm just trading the wheel between spaces every few hours or when I think about it since it's the only one I have while I try to figure out something else.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 9, 2011 22:47:19 GMT -5
I love what you did, Hannah. These little guys can chew though almost anything - even some metal, so just check every day... Oh and if you're in the market for some cute 'lil girls I found a breeder who (eee!!!) is in Spanaway and has officially agreed to mentor me in breeding show-quality, healthy, extremely friendly Fancy Mice. He holds almost all the same standards (diet-wise and more) for rodents and other pets that I do too. You could get yourself some beautiful, show-worthy Fancies from him!!
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Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2011 4:25:27 GMT -5
Sounds awesome, I'll have to pm you for the details! Maybe with some luck he can help me find homes for the boys too since they're so beautiful and friendly.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2011 6:29:20 GMT -5
I don't see why not. It looks like he has more demand than he is able to supply so who knows! I'd love to take one of your boys, however more tanks in this tiny apartment probably isn't a good idea right now. Oh, how I can't wait to move! (Still waiting for one out of four homes to open up.)
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Post by Deleted on Apr 17, 2011 0:27:37 GMT -5
Thought I'd post another update. The boys are still in the 40 long and I did away with the divider since every time I opened the lid it would shift enough they'd get between and all huddle in one box...so I'm just keeping my eyes on them for scuffles (none yet) but overall they seem a lot happier being able to groom each other, sleep in the same cardboard box, and try to run opposite directions on the same wheel. I'm still trying to find homes for them...I've contacted two breeders in the area to see if they want/have customers that would want them and also regarding buying a few females to keep the girl company without getting any response. So I made a craigslist post tonight to try and find them pet homes that way. I set the girl up in her own 20 long tank before removing the divider (a CL freebie that came with a nice hinged lid ) and she seems pretty depressed when we're not playing with her. I'm thinking tomorrow I'll check out Petsmart/co's fancies for a friend to keep her from being so lonely while I wait for the breeders to get back to me. The rats are doing good, they're still all girls and it seems like in the couple weeks we've had them they've doubled in size. They love hanging out on my shoulder making chattery commentary while I do my chores .
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Post by Deleted on Apr 17, 2011 3:07:46 GMT -5
I understand you are trying to find them homes - but anything you can do to separate the boys is 100% necessary in this situation, otherwise you will have a vet visit on your hands. Even if that means buying cheap plastic tubs with modified air-holes (lots and many) or plastic Critter Keepers. They are not a long-term solution but (and I don't repeat myself on this to irritate you) they are FAR better than those boys huddling together. Whether they were raised together or not makes no difference: they WILL fight and maul each other horribly. Mice are not even remotely close to rats in that they cannot EVER be kept together when they are males. As Barbara replies in the post below only pet-bred mice from VERY good breeders can do it and even so I know that to be something the breeders usually are uncomfortable with a buyer doing anyway. I applaud your choice to get your girl some girls but the male worry cannot be stressed enough. Please check this thread out on "Bucks Kept Together": forum.thefunmouse.com/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=13274&p=124505&hilit=bucks+kept+together#p124505
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Post by Deleted on Apr 17, 2011 4:45:23 GMT -5
I read a lot if articles on the subject of keeping males together and there are so many conflicting opinions on whether it can or should be done, it's hard to know the right decision...these two articles (http://www.fancymice.info/keepingmales.htm & www.rmca.org/Articles/mousefancy.htm) and my observations of their behavior together when they'd get through the barrier are what swayed me to give it shot. I really wish they had all been girls.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 17, 2011 6:53:06 GMT -5
I have read both articles before (a long time ago) but I really belief this is too much of a risk to chance it. Ask any club (not a rat-affiliated one) that is for mice as pets and you will get that response. Fancymice.info is not a up-to-date source of information on pet-keeping. You can't know what will happen and it can go bad at any time. When that happens, will you give these tiny ones vet care, or feed them off? No offense to anyone on this forum, but with this particular type of mice especially (Fancies, uncommon varieties) I find it very upsetting. There is the Oregon Humane Society that receives and adopts out male mice routinely (singles only and they are caged separately, I might add). They charge more than for feeders, also, to ensure a good home. ETA: I really hope you will read the forum post I linked to. There are graphic photos, and you said "based on their behaviors". This post exactly mentions the reason you think they may be fine together. I quote: "It took time, patience, lots of love and a really good vet to get these boys healthy again but they are both now fine and enjoying life. Byron did not have to have his leg amputated but he walks with a permanent limp now. My vet has assured me that if I hadn't found these boys and got them to a vet 'pronto' they would have died from their wounds which had become infected. The reason for my post was to show the 'raw proof' that male mice should not be housed together. I see post by people who truly do not understand the dynamics of male mice and territory. It doesn't matter if they're brothers (as are Byron & Stanley), if they've been together for life, if they never fight or if they sleep together. Male mice claim territory and they do not have human emotions so they don't distinguish between wrong and right the way humans do. They may live together in harmony for months and then 'boom', one of them wants to claim the cage as their own, and the other one suffers for it."
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