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Post by Deleted on Sept 13, 2012 7:16:37 GMT -5
Hey Steph,
Yup, I try to keep a close eye on it as they usually won't eat much once it gets warm. Cyrus especially.
In the soup I made last night, the pieces are just a bit bigger than the slivers that I was giving before. I put more chunks in than normal and they seem to be leaving quite a few chunks on the bottom of their dish. It may be because the chicken is more chunks rather than slivers? In my next batch I will try to do more of a bigger sliver instead. I know they are eating some of them, but I guess they won't eat the chunks unless theyre covered in soup. When Cyrus gets a chunk in her mouth thats a bit big, she won't eat anymore. I also put a few chunks of liver for them to eat rather than blending it all up. Also added some pumpkin separately after blending and they ate that up too.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 13, 2012 13:39:03 GMT -5
Hey Definitely aim for the more sliver shape, it seems to be a lot easier for them to chew than squarer chunks at first. You can really mix them up in the soup too (cover them with soup). A lot of ferrets won't eat the pieces unless they are covered with soup for the first little while, so that's totally normal. You can also try hand feeding the chunks as they gradually get bigger. I find my ferrets really respond well to me handing them their food when I am trying new types of meat. It's something about you giving it to them that seems to convince them it's edible and that it's almost like a special treat because they are being hand fed it ;D Are they eating the liver pieces that aren't ground into the soup? If so that's awesome. Plain organ is often the hardest thing to get them to eat so if they are getting used to the liver taste when it's not completely ground up and disguised in the soup, that is fantastic
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Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2012 6:29:26 GMT -5
Hi Steph,
I do mix the chicken pieces right into the soup. I guess the ferrets just eat the soup and miss the chicken pieces so they get left behind on the bottom of the dish. I do try hand feeding them sometimes but it never goes very well. When I give them chicken they won't take it, and last night I was trying to give Zeus some liver, and he was licking it but he couldn't manage to get it in his mouth haha. Both the ferrets don't seem to mind the liver and they eat it in the soup just like they do the chicken.
Also I managed to finally find some chicken hearts last night. They came in a package with chicken giblets so I will be including very tiny pieces of giblet in their food too. Hopefully they will like it!
Breanne
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Post by Deleted on Sept 16, 2012 20:45:27 GMT -5
Hey Breanne, No worries, they definitely take time to learn how to eat the pieces. If there is still a lot left over, make them even smaller. Once they are eating them all or almost all, then increase the size, it's a slow process for sure but it works How are they doing with it now?
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Post by Deleted on Sept 16, 2012 20:59:57 GMT -5
Name: Zeus What they've been eating and how much per day: about 1/2 cup per day. Eating soup with added slivers of chicken, liver and heart. Sometimes pumpkin is added too Activity level: very active when we play with him, otherwise he doesn't tend to stay up for very long Stool shape and consistency: smaller than we usually see, medium consistency Weight:0.91 kg Picture: Name: Cyrus What they've been eating and how much per day: about 1/2 cup per day. Eating soup with added slivers of chicken, liver and heart. Sometimes pumpkin is added too Activity level:very active when we play with her, tends to wander around for 15 mins if we don't play with her then goes back to sleep Stool shape and consistency: about the same as we are used to seeing when she ate kibble. Weight: 0.71 kg Picture:
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Post by Deleted on Sept 17, 2012 11:33:53 GMT -5
Hey Steph - Sorry I didn't see your post. We posted about the same time last night so I thought it was just mine there.
It seems like they are getting a bit better. I made new soup last night and made most of them smaller but put a few bigger pieces in there too. The soup that I am making has about 1/4 of it as cut up meat so there are a lot of chunks in it. Do you think I may be putting to much meat in it?
Breanne
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Post by Deleted on Sept 18, 2012 0:08:24 GMT -5
No worries, thanks for the weekly report You might be putting too many pieces in, yes. Their jaw muscles aren't going to be all that strong right now so it's possible that they are eating some pieces and then getting tired and lazy and that's why they are leaving so many pieces at the bottom and just eating the soup around those pieces (since soup requires no muscle strength to eat). So you can try putting a few less pieces and keep them a good size that they are able to eat. You can also try putting a bit less of the soupy part to encourage them to eat the pieces and not just fill up on the soup. It's sort of a trial and error thing. If you can find a good size and amount of pieces then leave it like that for 2 days. Then increase the size and amount ever so slightly. Wait a couple more days until they are used to that, and so on. we want to eventually work them up to decent size pieces (like 1/4- 1/2 inch cubes) with soup just as a gravy on top before moving on with different kinds of meat. How we get there and how long it takes is up to them ;D
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Post by Deleted on Sept 18, 2012 7:42:41 GMT -5
Ok maybe putting a bit less soup in there would help. What seemed to be working last night was to give them frequent small meals. Whenever either of them woke up, I would give them a couple spoonfuls of soup and they would finish it, pieces and all Either Justin or I or home almost all the time since I work during the day and Justin works at night so we will be able to do this until they start eating the pieces by themselves. I will keep you updated! Breanne
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Post by Deleted on Sept 18, 2012 11:54:10 GMT -5
Perfect that is even better if you are able to do that!
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Post by Deleted on Sept 19, 2012 7:54:32 GMT -5
Hi Steph, What I told above that we were starting to do (ie. feed whenever they wake up) seems to be working great. They end up eating all (or most) chunks of meat. Also, I don't know if this is progress or not since you said they will eventually be eating big chunks with soup as "gravy", but last night a gave Zeus some chicken chunks with a little tiny bit of olive oil on them and he ate them all up A few questions... I remember that you said that we can give the ferrets eggs. Do you think it would work if we blend it right in with the soup? We have tried to give them egg in the past (before we started raw diet) but they showed no interest. We have had some chicken in the fridge for about a week now and it is starting to get a little bit of white on it. It doesn't seem like mold because when I rub it, it doesn't come off, so I am not really sure what it is. This would be bad to give the ferrets right? I am assuming that the chicken needs to be pretty fresh for them. Does the canned pumpkin go bad? It was a big can and I am noticing that it smells a bit different than it used to. It has been in the fridge the whole time covered by a baggie but maybe it just won’t last long enough for them to finish it. I did end up freezing some of it when it was fresh so I can start using that if I need to. I just don’t like to waste it (or the chicken that I talked about in my last question). Also just read your first post to us about your ferrets. I don’t think I ever saw it before. It is so sad to hear about how Bo and Nova were when you first adopted them. I can’t believe Petland would let that happen to the poor ferrets. Are they both doing alright now? I am glad that you got them and know what is best for them, especially getting them on to raw food so quickly! Does feeding raw help keep them healthy and away from the vet when they get older? One of my biggest worries when we got ferrets was the vet bills because I know ferrets can tend to need a lot of medical attention especially when they get older. I can’t imagine having the vet expenses for 5 ferrets like you do!! Even just having 2 has been pretty expensive so far, but it is worth it! And lastly - are your cats on a raw diet? If yes, it would be awesome if you could give a little break down of how you did it and what they should get? It doesn't have to be right away but just when you get a chance. We have 2 cats and they LOVE to "help" me make the ferret food. They wait at my feet from the minute I start until the minute I am done, waiting for me to give them a few pieces of chicken and/or the little bit soup left on the spoon. I would like to switch them to raw too, as I am assuming it is also better for them than kibble. I was just looking up what goes into cat kibble and if it is true..EWWW! Thanks, Breanne
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Post by Deleted on Sept 19, 2012 13:21:03 GMT -5
That's fantastic! Keep that up and start increasing the size of the chunks now That's awesome that Zeus will eat the chunks on their own. See if you can't get them both eating the chunks with just a layer of soup on top (the soup can be made thick like a gravy now) rather than totally submerged in soup. You can put egg in the soup, just no more than 1 egg per ferret per week. And it will probably make their stools a little off so don't be alarmed. Eggs are more of a treat in a raw diet than a staple. With meat in the fridge I usually go by smell. If its getting slimey and smelly than I probably wouldn't risk it. Ferrets generally won't eat meat that's off but my personal belief is I'd rather waste $10 throwing out some chicken than hundreds of dollars for a sick ferret from eating bad food. The pumpkin does start to smell different after its been in the fridge. If you put it in a sealed ziploc container in the fridge it will stay fresher longer. I find mine grows mold in the fridge. If it doesn't smell rancid and has no mold it's probably okay, but again $3 for a can of pumpkin versus vet bills for a sick ferret... In the scheme of things...I just throw out when in doubt. It's not worth their health or life to save a bit of money. Bo and Nova are both doing wonderful now . I actually havent had ferrets reach the "older" stage yet, as my oldest ferret is around 3 and the other are all younger. But from other's experiences raw definitely keeps them much healthier as they age. As for vet bills, I really haven't had any for quite some time (*knock on wood*). The raw has kept everyone super healthier and I don't vaccinate anymore so there's no cost there. I have spent something like $5000 on Olivia's heart problems though My cats aren't on raw. Mostly because they are family cats and My mom doesnt want them on it. But a few people on this board do have theirs on raw. You can post under the other pets section about switching them to raw if you are interested and other people will give you advice/links.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 20, 2012 7:52:22 GMT -5
Hey Steph
Thanks for the advice. I will post on other pets section of the forum.
I will most likely be making another batch tonight and will start putting the soup just on top. I hope Cyrus isn't too picky!!
It is awesome that your ferrets don't get vaccinated anymore. I thought (just because of our vet) that vaccinating them was very important. Is this wrong? I have always taken our pets to get vaccinated but never knew if it really helped.
Thanks Breanne
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Post by Deleted on Sept 20, 2012 21:30:03 GMT -5
Great! Let me know how it goes! If Cyrus is being picky you can always put more soup on top and then slowly reduce the amount over the week Vaccines after the first year are pretty much a waste of money and are a risk to health, rather than a benefit. If you go to the Health and Medical Board there is a folder called Vaccine Info. It has stickies with lots of articles on the science behind it but essentially most people on here only vaccinate once around 5-6 months, and some do a booster a year later, some don't. The kit series (8 weeks, 12 weeks, 16 weeks) is useless because before 5-6 months they have antibodies from their mama that basically counteract the vaccine. After the year vaccine, studies have shown they have immunity anywhere from quite a few years until life so subsequent vaccines = useless and they over stress the immune system, since the immune system "fights" the vaccines. So if your aging ferret has any health issues (which they all eventually do), vaccinating them is actually putting them MORE at risk. Plus distemper is basically 100% fatal and a vaccine can not prevent them from getting it. And the chances of a ferret getting Rabies is so tiny it's not worth the vaccine reaction risk. Just don't let strangers ( or anyone for that matter ) pet your ferret and risk getting bitten and filing a complaint because then you're in big trouble if Rabies is the law. Not to mention the risk of a ferret dying from a vaccine reaction is wayyy higher than the chance of them ever getting distemper or rabies. That's just my ( and almost everyone else on this board's) two sense. Like I said there's lot of articles and even some knowledgeable vets to back it up. But most vets will say vaccinate because it's how they make money. You just have to really put your foot down and say you're not paying for vaccines. Unless rabies is the law, then they can make you get it I think. Sorry that was a long ramble!
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Post by Deleted on Sept 21, 2012 9:21:24 GMT -5
Hi Steph, I tried to put soup on top of their chicken last night and it wasn't going so well. They would just lick all the soup away and leave the chicken. I didn't put so much soup that they would both be full from eatting just the soup. I tried it twice but since then have been just mixing it like we used to. Also, about the vaccines that is very interesting. I am going to read some of the articles but from what you say it seems like we will will not get Zeus and Cyrus vaccinated anymore. I just looked up on a government of ontario website and it said this "Is it important to vaccinate my pet (cat, dog, and ferret)? It is a legal requirement under the Health Protection and Promotion Act to have dogs and cats over three months old vaccinated for rabies in all municipalities in the geographic region of Southern Ontario. Vaccinations will not only protect your pets from acquiring rabies but will also help protect you and your family if your pet is bitten by a rabid wild animal." Since it says ferret in the title but not in the description I am assuming that ferrets aren't required by law I will find out for sure from our vet though. I do think our vet is going to be apprehensive about the raw diet and no vaccines though! But oh well. I wanted to ask.. Zeus has a scab on his back, we are not entirely sure what it is from, but we think it may be from our cat Shadow. He can get a bit rough sometimes but he has never caused any blood to be drawn from the ferrets before, which is why we aren't sure it was him. Anyway, it doesn't seem to be bothering Zeus but it keeps scabbing up but then Zeus itches himself and it starts bleeding again. Is there anything we can do to help it heal faster? Thanks Breanne
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Post by Deleted on Sept 21, 2012 22:42:56 GMT -5
No worries, they just aren't quite ready for that step then. Instead keep the same amount of soup and just keep slowly increasing the size of the chunks. If you could include a picture of the size of chunks they are eating when you go to take their pictures for the weekly report that would be awesome I'm not very good at visualizing what size and shape they are right now ;D Most vets are against raw and pro yearly vaccines, it can be really intimidating but you pretty much just have to put your foot down and stand strong on the matter. As for the cut, as long as its not infected, the best thing you can do is keep it clean and try and prevent him from scratching it ( easier said than done I know ). If it starts to show signs of redness, swelling, oozing discharge, feeling hot to the touch, etc. then you'll probably need an antibiotic cream from a vet. As for at-home stuff you can put on it, I'm not all that sure. You could take a picture of it and post a thread in either the "health" board or the "holistic health" board. Others might have more experience with and be able to offer more insight on what you can use
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