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Post by R on Mar 9, 2013 19:58:53 GMT -5
I am looking for a ferret with a completely dark mask. I believe these are called dark sables, but I could be wrong. That being said I am having a hard enough time finding a breeder that is still working, let alone the particular color variant I am looking for.
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Post by R on Mar 9, 2013 20:41:11 GMT -5
Also, not going to lie. The idea of keeping an intact ferret is pretty gross. The idea of my ferret dying to adrenal is however much more horrifying.
Which would be better to keep, an intact female, and what if I can't find access to a v hob, or should I keep a v-hob male for others to benefit. Do v-hob males have the same horrific habits as intact males?
Sorry to sound so shallow, but I figure it's better to be honest then not understand what you're asking for.
Is descenting still cool? Or does that have an effect as well? I know they recently found out that light cycles do not cause adrenal, just outward physical symptoms, but last time I checked that study was still being overlooked.
Sorry if these questions seem dumb, it's been a few years since I've had ferrets and I want to be as thorough as possible both in my selection and my understanding.
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Post by Heather on Mar 9, 2013 23:23:16 GMT -5
Never consider your questions foolish....they need answered. What type of ferret are you looking for exactly? Do you have a picture? We have a number of breeders on board but..... I will attempt to answer some of your questions. V-hobs have the same habits as hobs. I have both. If you find a hobs habits disgusting the v-hob is not any different. My V-hob is the sweetest, gentlest soul but he's all male even if he is a sport's model. Keeping an intact ferret is easier in that there is now something that is called a DES implant, which is a chemical castration. You have to keep implanting every eighteen months to two years but it basically creates a hob or jill, for that matter, who is never in season. This cuts the bad habits, the marking and scenting and in the jills the need to either make use of a v-hob or a jill jab. No, breeder will sell a ferret who will be descented, nor will any reputable vet descent a ferret unless it's a serious health issue. It doesn't change the smell factor (unless they poof ) They have a different odor but it's not any different in intensity. The poof is not an oil so it's not like a skunk. Light cycles are just one very serious factor in adrenal disease and one that must be considered even with an intact ferret. Genetics does indeed have some baring but lighting probably has the most significant affect I hope that helps a little if you need clarification at all, or come up with other questions please ask ciao
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Post by Deleted on Mar 10, 2013 7:24:53 GMT -5
It would also help if you told us what country/region you're in, we can't suggest a breeder if we don't know where.
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Post by R on Mar 10, 2013 17:20:58 GMT -5
Well from what I read unfixed males urinate and then rub themselves in it.. which is pretty gross to me yeah, but on the other hand males are sweeter than females, lazier, and if keeping a v-hob could help others than maybe. How often do males go into season or is it a constant thing?
As far as females go, I have not heard of the DES implant and will have to look into it further. How different is chemical castration than physical? If that will be answered through research then I will find out shortly.
I live in North dakota but obviously am willing to travel or ship. I received one email back last night finally! From scarletts happy dookers.
As far as the pattern I believe it's once again called dark sable. It is the entirely dark body, and then mask, with white muzzle and ears.
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Post by R on Mar 10, 2013 17:25:03 GMT -5
then maybe*
Also I read that they found out in a study that light cycles seem to increase the outward symptoms of Adrenal, but those kept in the proper dark cycles, and all darkness had the same rate of adrenal as those kept in light. Not sure how well the study was done, or if it's been published or not, but it was recently that I read this.
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Post by Heather on Mar 10, 2013 17:48:34 GMT -5
I think I know the study you speak.....I believe they've discovered it is flawed. Ferrets do require natural day times, what they don't require is extra light. What we forget when living at home is that if they get natural daylight through the windows and then spend time with us in the evening with the lights on. It's too much light (they're discovering this is indeed the issue as intact ferrets in the UK are also exhibiting adrenal). I'm working with this right now as having intact ferrets meant that I had a hob who was dancing the merry in October because I didn't watch my lighting close enough. I was lucky in that he was not full in and I was able to hold him off by putting him into total darkness until about Feb. I noticed my 'bino hob was having a practice run at my v-hob (his brother) this morning so obviously they're going to be in season shortly too. Jackie here, has a wee jill that she took out this year when she came into season. It's the same as a spay except it's not permanent and it seemingly (no proof yet) because it turns all the hormones off, the chance of getting adrenal is nill. There is no excessive hormones worked up in the adrenal glands....again no proof, only a lot of theories at the moment but it is looking promising. It means that you have all the pros of having an intact ferret with none of the hassle....I'm fence sitting on that one. I use it only to deal with adrenal. If you want to do some research look up Deslorin or Superlorin implant. This is the type of ferret you're looking for? Male Female If that is the case there are a number of people who do indeed breed for this type. These two are polecat/hybrids from the UK. These are pics of their winter masks This is that same wee lady in the summer ciao
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Post by R on Mar 10, 2013 18:40:04 GMT -5
That is indeed the markings I am looking for, and I did notice that most were labeled as " Russian polecat" Hybrids. I imagine recently produced specimens have hybrid vigor, and will look into further behavioral differences.
GFX has been mentioned to me multiple times for this pattern, but I have never been able to get ahold of them through out the years and do not know if they are even still breeding.
Thank you for all of the information thus far, I really do appreciate it and how prompt you've been.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 10, 2013 18:50:26 GMT -5
DES works for males too. Basically they can keep their man bits, but don't go into rut once a year thanks to the chemical suppressing the hormones so they're not excessively smelly and hobnoxious, pining away for the ladies. Or marking/sliming.
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Post by Sherry on Mar 10, 2013 19:58:41 GMT -5
GFX is still breeding.
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Post by R on Mar 11, 2013 13:57:33 GMT -5
Alright! So at what point is it best to give the DES implant to either sex? So far it seems like with females it's before their heat, and with males it's a few seasons in? I contacted the two vets in the area that work with ferrets. Neither knew of the des implant but are looking into it for me. I also put an ad on craigslist asking if any one had intact jills with no/limited V-hob in the area. If I get enough responses I might deal with it to help others. I do have a heated garage after all, I suppose when he goes in season I could put a ferret nation or two in there and when he's done return him to his room? Only if I get enough responses btw these ferret faces are too cute!
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Post by Heather on Mar 11, 2013 14:27:19 GMT -5
You can use the DES to take your jill out of season. As for the hobs...it's still advised to allow them their first season, at least I believe so. If you're going to use your v-hob to bring other jills out of season, make sure that those jills are up to date on their ADV tests. It has been known that where v-hobs are shared....ferrets have been known to "share" diseases. Stds are not limited to humans ciao
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Post by R on Mar 11, 2013 17:49:20 GMT -5
I am aware that stds are a risk with ferrets just as they are with most mammals, but thanks for the extra heads up.
So far the vets here are only acquainted with mel and lupron injections but I'm having them look into the DES implant
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Post by Deleted on Mar 11, 2013 18:28:55 GMT -5
Just a note, vasectomies aren't a common surgery in the USA. Most breeders don't even use them. It is a very hard surgery to perform and is very easy to mess up. So I would research first into the possibility of even finding a surgeon who could do the vasectomy.
I used the deslorelin implant to take my Jill out I heat. I waited until she was already in heat to take her out. This allows them to have the normal hormone spike. Remember though that intact ferrets can still get adrenal. There is a genetic component and lighting factors as well
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Post by Heather on Mar 11, 2013 19:42:47 GMT -5
Hmmm, that's true. I've found a surgeon who is willing to perform the surgery but my v-hob came from the UK where doing this surgery is common. ciao
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