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Post by Heather on Jan 24, 2013 16:48:02 GMT -5
What all are you feeding at the moment? I was glancing over the lists of supplements and have eventually got totally turned around. Write a list of what you're feeding and the dosages and what you're using as food (all the foods). I saw cod liver oil listed as one of your supplements and that if given regularly and in any great amount can cause you huge amounts of grief....so lets have all the the items you're feeding him at the moment and we will try and work something so this little guy can get his stomach turned around. ciao
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Post by Deleted on Jan 26, 2013 10:14:22 GMT -5
I went to the vet today for a psysical examination,he said that my ferret is ok and he also gained about 200-300.Today i went to the store and i bought him rabbit.I boiled it for 5 minutesand i added a small quantity on his food,he ate it and now i am waiting to see reactions,he had never eaten rabbit before.
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Post by Sherry on Jan 26, 2013 11:18:23 GMT -5
Since you boiled it, I hope you didn't give the bone? Heat makes it brittle. But they DO need it raw. Otherwise you are going to have a lot of problems from calcium insufficiency. Again- can you list everything you are giving? Food, supplements, vitamins, etc.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2013 9:25:26 GMT -5
I didn't give the bone and the rabbit wasn't 100% boiled it was medium-done.I don't wanna fill his stomach now with a lot of harmful bacteria from raw food,anyway,i did notice more mucous on his stool this time and i am wondering if my ferret has general food intolerence,or it was a coincidence.I am not giving him at this moment any supplements cause they haven't arrived yet,the only things that i am giving him right now are: Hill's diet ZD Olive oil and a really really small amount of Cod liver oil.Mixed with a lot of water and 1-1,5-8 of the tablet Prednisolone. Nevertheless,i am also going to use: Slippery Elm Terramin California Cley(it's for colon cleansing) Probiotics Digetive Enzymes Vitamin B-Coplex. Also,Can cod liver oil cause grief?? When i will use the other supplements i will let you guys know.if you know anything else that it can be helpful please let me know.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2013 10:02:55 GMT -5
Hi Jim, Sorry to hear you are having so much trouble with your little one. But, to be honest, your ferret may not have IBD at all. Since you were feeding a raw chicken and beef diet with no bone, your ferret wasn't getting the proper nutrients. Ferrets need minerals that can only be found in raw bone such as calcium. While raw food is the best diet for ferrets, it has to be a BALANCED raw food diet. This means if your ferret is being fed twice a day, that over one week, he should get 8-9 meals WITH edible bone in them. yes ferrets can eat raw bone and they need it to survive. Edible bone has to be smaller bones like chicken wings. And yes some will pass out in the stool but this is perfectly normal. Ferrets should only get 3-4 meals of just plain meat a week. You also need one meal of hearts and one meal that is 2 ounces of liver and 2 ounces of kidney and other organs. Was your ferret getting just chicken and beef meat and nothing else? If so, this is why he has yucky stool. The calcium in bone is what makes the stool healthy looking. The reason he got better on the Z D is because it is a balanced food meaning they ADD the minerals like calcium that ferrets would normally get from bone. If you put him on a rabbit and lamb diet, you NEED to balance it. You NEED edible bone source (rabbit and lamb bones are usually too big) and the bone has to be raw. You also need hearts and organs. These provide essential nutrients like taurine and vitamin A that your ferret will die without. I can promise you if you switch to a BALANCED raw diet you won't even need all those supplements! And yes definitely avoid cod liver oil it makes their stool very runny and dark. You should join our mentoring program and a mentor will help put your ferret on a diet that will improve his stool greatly! He could still have IBD but the balanced raw diet will also improve that greatly. Raw meat with no bone is actually the most dangerous diet for a ferret, and can make them very very sick. Please let us know If you have anymore questions. We are here to help
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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2013 10:26:43 GMT -5
Cod liver oil may cause digestive upset. In general, organ meats are a bit harder to digest than body oil. (Oil/fats, in general, are harder to digest than muscle tissue.)
One thing that may be causing trouble is the lack of bone in the diet. bone. A natural diet include meat, organs, and bone. It also includes fur, feathers - and other non-digestibles.
You will need to feed bone to avoid serious health issues long term (In fact, a lack of bone may be part of the digestive issues.)
You'll need to figure out how you want to feed bone longer term. The human grade ground bone meal can be fed. You can also grind your own meats, including bone and organs. You may have access to commercially prepared raw frozen diets - many of these prepared diets already include the bone.
In the mean time, you may want to try adding a little UNSPICED canned pumpkin or mashed zucchini, finely ground broccoli with the food...a SMALL amount of finely ground, high-fiber vegetable matter can help with digestion. The canned pumpkin is particularly good. The veggies need to be finely ground - large bits of veggies can cause blockage.
Has your vet checked your ferret's stools for lately? Some "tummy bugs" can be VERY difficult to get under control - they tend to return multiple times until the immune system gets them under control. The Prednisolone suppresses the immune system, so if any of the difficult organisms are present, they may be repopulating the gut, Giardia comes to mind, and coccidia is another one.
Again, the lack of bone in the diet can certainly be a contributing factor. If you can get some human-grade bone meal (the non-human-grade stuff contains a LOT of toxins - like lead), you'll probably see a difference in the stools. And long term, you'll need to add some form of bone to the diet.
-jennifer
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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2013 10:42:52 GMT -5
I think i am going to remove the cod liver oil cause i haven't heard good things about it from some people in this forum.Previously i was giving him:Chicken breast with the little bones,chicken leg(without the bone),chicken liver chicken heart,beef and sometimes pork.after a while he started showing some symptoms whenever i was giving him chicken,a lot of mucous and sometimes blood he couldn't even digest bones when i was giving him chicken wings.!right now,i cannot give him bones his stomach is REALLY delicate.In fact,sometimes i find hairs on his stool from his fur,cause his stomach has lost it's ability to digest such things.anyway i will remove the cod live oil from his diet because i do't think i have seen any improvement in comparison with the olive oil.many people here say that it is dangerous.i wanted also to ask cause in 3-4 days the slippery alm and the terramin will be here,how many times a week do i use slippery elm?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2013 10:52:58 GMT -5
3 months ago,when the ibd started getting worse,the first think that i did was fecal examination i did it twice and it didn't show anything,that's what my vet said.3 weeks ago my vet did an ingection of ivermectin(in case he has any parasites).I know i have to add to his diet more bone but in greece it is difficult to find bone powder or concentrated bone...however i can add supplement for cats and dogs with calcium vitamin d3 and phosphorus.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2013 10:55:39 GMT -5
I gotta run to work (I'm late now, and I have a half-hour drive) Hair and bone do NOT digest. This is why ferrets get blockage from hair balls. the The bone fragments help to push the hair through. There's an article I want you to read by Bob Church. It explains the role of bone in the digestive system. Somebody on the forum can prbably find this for you- I will beck online with more information later, but I'm already very late for work ;D -jennifer
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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2013 10:58:51 GMT -5
thanks for your help!
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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2013 20:40:58 GMT -5
Well, POOP! The old Bob Church series on ferret diet is no longer posted on the old FML archives server! Here's another good article about ferrets and raw diet.... www.veterinarypartner.com/Content.plx?P=A&A=479&S=1&SourceID=43And another about the prey model raw diet..... www.rawfedcats.org/nature.htmI'll see if I can hunt down some more reading material -there's actually quite a bit out there on raw feeding. catnutrition.org has a lot of good info as well. -jennifer
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Post by Sherry on Jan 28, 2013 22:28:59 GMT -5
Just so you don't worry about the fur- I find it in their stools on a regular basis, especially during shed And I think Jennifer didn't mean to say bone doesn't digest Their stomach acids break it down really well, but you will still find shards of the denser parts in their stools also.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2013 22:39:18 GMT -5
I didnt read all the replies so sorry if this was already said! I put a mix of ground up papaya tablets and Holistic Select probiotic powder into Sebastians duck soup to help with his poops, and it does help a bit. Obviously it doesnt cure what ails them, but does help ease their little tummies a bit.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 29, 2013 10:03:02 GMT -5
Yes, Sherrylynne, is correct....her description is much better than mine. Well-stated, Sherrylynne - Thanks for clarifying my post! ) Kitschrevolt, I'm glad you're seeing improvement with the probios and papaya enzymes. Papaya is one of the weaker enzymes....Bromelain (from pineapple is stronger than papain (from papaya). Pancreatin (from hog pancreas) is quite a bit stronger than the other two. As always, it's best to use the weaker "medicines" and lower doses if they do the trick. But sometimes a stronger supplement may be required. -jennifer
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Post by Deleted on Jan 31, 2013 8:34:36 GMT -5
hello guys,i wanna ask your opinion about something,my ferret is not feeling really well lately and my vet is not helping me at all,he is telling me that he is ok,but i see that there is something wrong with him.i have searched on ibd treatments and i found a drug called Flagyl(metranidazole) that they say it's really helpful for ibd,i am thinking of using it without my vet's permission because i am always asking my vet what else can i do to help him and he is not HELPING!Unfortunately he is the only exotic pet vet in athens.what's your opinion?have you used this drug or do you know anyone that have used this drug flagyl metranidazole?is it effective.?
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