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Post by Deleted on Dec 20, 2012 10:42:08 GMT -5
Hi, I bred my first pair of ferrets earlier this year, but I wasn't quite experienced with it. The dad (Frisky Lucius), and the mom (Louisa, now called Jewel) bred before I bought them from a breeder. They mated again, this time with me as owner, and had a litter on August 1. Due to my inexperience, I had a local ferret rescue help me rehome the kits. Full story is in the Introduction board. I still want to breed again eventually. I understand it is for the betterment of the species, and not much else. I also understand that there will be some heartbreak, such as death of a kit or two. One kit died after the father was handling it way too roughly. But he seemed to be a good dad to the rest of them. Perhaps there was a strange smell on that particular one. I would like to know why it is so difficult to find ferret breeders? Most ferrets in my state are either from rescues, pet stores, or individuals seeking new homes. But there was only one that I know of, the lady who sold me my pair, but she no longer breeds ferrets. The picture is 3 of the kits at 1 week old, there were 6 in total including the one that died. Jasper, the one with half a tail, is almost as big as his dad now and still living with me and his dad.  |
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Post by goingpostal on Dec 20, 2012 11:05:48 GMT -5
Where are you located? Did you get a pedigree and family history with these ferrets? Have you owned ferrets before?
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Post by Deleted on Dec 20, 2012 12:02:53 GMT -5
I'm in North Texas. I asked for a pedigree, but the breeder said she had none. I've had a total of 4 ferrets before getting this pair.
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Post by Heather on Dec 20, 2012 12:04:12 GMT -5
Quite basically, the reason why there are so few breeders is because breeding ferrets isn't about tossing two ferrets of the opposite sex together and hoping it will all work out (as you discovered). One only breeds to better the species and if one can keep the whole litter. I'm not saying you have to keep the whole litter but that is the implication. If you can't sell them or place them or someone returns one, then you're responsible to house them and care for them. A good breeder, always takes back their own breedings and never, ever burdens shelters or rescues. It's a lot of responsibility. It can mean that you go from having 2 ferrets to 12 if you happen to hit a bad year that no one wants to buy your ferrets and your jill was productive.
There is also all the special care and diets to also consider, the cost of vetting (not only the parents but the kits as well). The chance that everything will go south and you not only loose the litter but the jill as well....the cost of a c-section can really blow the budget and the special post operative care. Creating special places to make the jill feel secure and unstressed so she doesn't kill her kits. Making sure that the hob is kept away from mom and kits but still allowing out time for both parties also is something that one must consider. I've been studying under a mentor for over 2 yrs. There's a lot to learn, a lot to consider and the money factor as well. There is no money in breeding (if you're doing it correctly, you will loose money) so you've got to be prepared financially to bear the load as well.
There is also knowing what you're breeding and what you want out of the breeding....learning about the genetics and what to look for. You will find a lot of information, there have been a few discussions on board about this, about how colour affects health and the mental wellbeing of the kits. You're going to find out a lot here....but seriously speaking before you ever consider breeding again, find yourself a mentor.
ciao
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Post by Deleted on Dec 20, 2012 12:39:02 GMT -5
There is a very knowledgeable breeder, Joan Clague, in Texas. Maybe she would be willing to help you with some information or discuss the possibility of mentoring you. Maybe you could visit her breeding operation and see how she does things.
One thing I can tell you for future reference is that you shouldn't give the father access to the babies at that young of an age. But there are so many things to learn, I am sure if you talk to Joan or some other breeder as a mentor, they can tell you how to do it right.
The chances of doing a good job by yourself without the help of a mentor are slim to none, so you have to ask yourself whether you want to be an ethical breeder, or if you just don't care. If you do want to be an ethical and humane breeder, it is very difficult and can be expensive as well.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 20, 2012 12:49:15 GMT -5
Oh I forgot to answer your question, why are there not more ferret breeders? Heather already answered that well but let me add my 2 cents. Honestly, I think because it's not really worth it to breed them (for most people). It's either too much work and expense (if you are an ethical breeder and you really care about the animals and want to do everything right), or else, even if you're not an ethical breeder and you're just in it for the money, there's not enough money to be made for it to be worth it. Big mills like Marshalls are able to make it worth it financially by the sheer size of their operation, and the fact that they supply ferrets for medical research, and they cut corners and don't breed ethically, they treat the ferrets like a product. You won't be able to compete with them, they have the ferret mill market cornered already  What some people (who we call BYB for Back Yard Breeders) do is they just don't care about the well-being of the animals, they just breed whichever ferrets they can get to make a little money on the side, they don't keep track of the genetics or try to improve the breed, they don't give proper medical care or good diet, they just don't really have compassion for the ferrets or treat them right. Those people are able to get away with it by just compromising their ethics. I wouldn't want to go that route because I'm an animal lover. But that's what some people do, and nobody here supports that. Even those people, however, usually stop breeding in the end, because it's just too darn much trouble for the amount of money you get out of it. If you can't make good money off of it, and you're doing something you know in your heart isn't right, what's the point, most people lose interest and give up. Why is it hard to make any money off of being a breeder, even if you cut corners and try to keep costs down and just treat the ferrets like a product? Because, in order to charge a lot of money for your ferrets, you have to be an awesome breeder, provide lots of pedigree information, and produce very healthy good-looking kits, etc. in order to attract the customers who are willing to pay higher prices. Otherwise, who is going to bother buying from you, when they can just go to Petco or some other pet store and buy a ferret there for $99 on sale? If they want to spend more money on a ferret, there are already PLENTY of breeders they can choose from, even if they aren't local, they can have the ferret shipped to them. For example, I paid $275 for my ferret Finn and had him shipped to me on an airplane. Even if there was a backyard breeder here in my state (and actually there is), I wouldn't have bothered buying from them, when I have NO idea what quality the ferrets are going to be... I would much rather buy from a respected breeder with a good reputation, than some unknown new person. The other way you can out-sell the pet store is by selling your ferrets for cheaper than they do, attracting customers who just want the cheapest possible ferret. Good luck making any money doing that though... The costs of breeding make that very difficult. I'm not just talking about monetary costs, the time involved as well. For example, there is a backyard breeder here in my state, who sells her ferrets for cheaper than the pet store. How is this possible? Because she's an old retired lady who lives in a shack, feeds her ferrets crappy cheap food, keeps them in overcrowded and cruel conditions, and just basically treats them like crap. But she has all day every day to waste her time breeding them. It works for her, but wouldn't work for most people, and I don't know HOW she lives with herself, knowing that she is mistreating the ferrets. I think it is only a matter of time before the humane society shuts her down. What a pointless way to make a very small amount of money. A lot of these backyard breeders get reported to the Humane Society or ASPCA and get shut down. It's also not legal to breed them in some states, or you need a license. There have been several ferret breeders who got shut down and their ferrets got confiscated because they were not taking proper care of them. There have also been rescue operations where a bunch of ferret lovers came to the house of a hoarder or a breeder and took their ferrets to save them from those conditions. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 20, 2012 12:59:10 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Dec 20, 2012 13:21:39 GMT -5
Another thing I forgot to mention - If you don't go the "legit" route, and use an experienced mentor etc., you can ONLY be a backyard breeder, you can't become a respected breeder without going through all the process of doing it right.
Why? Because if you don't have a mentor and do everything right, nobody will sell you breeding stock, except for other scummy backyard breeders ;D See, in order to be part of the respected breeder community, you have to have documented healthy breeding stock, which you can only get from other respected breeders, and they won't provide you that breeding stock unless they are convinced that you are committed to doing it right and know everything you need to know, etc.
So, this is one way the breeding community sort of protects their good names.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 20, 2012 13:23:43 GMT -5
Another thing I forgot to mention - If you don't go the "legit" route, and use an experienced mentor etc., you can ONLY be a backyard breeder, you can't become a respected breeder without going through all the process of doing it right. Why? Because if you don't have a mentor and do everything right, nobody will sell you breeding stock, except for other scummy backyard breeders ;D See, in order to be part of the respected breeder community, you have to have documented healthy breeding stock, which you can only get from other respected breeders, and they won't provide you that breeding stock unless they are convinced that you are committed to doing it right and know everything you need to know, etc. So, this is one way the breeding community sort of protects their good names. You should really talk to Linda Gurule, she's an example of someone who is now a well-respected breeder, but she didn't start breeding all that many years ago. She could talk to you about the process she went through to get there. Heather is also a newer breeder but she's a little difference since she's in Canada and her breeding stock comes from the U.K.  If you try to go that route, you are talking about even MORE expensive. But yes, she has a mentor, who is a respected breeder in the UK, and she was working on the process of becoming a breeder for years before she ever got her first pair of breeding ferrets. |
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Post by Deleted on May 26, 2013 14:18:07 GMT -5
It's been a while since I've posted here. I still have my buddy Frisky Lucius and his son Jasper, who are both neutered. Frisky just turned 3 years old last month. Jasper will be 1 year old in August. And, I also have an unrelated spayed female, Molly. I want to thank you all for the advice. I'm really considering breeding, but next time I will ask for an experienced mentor who has bred before. I'll also ask the Texas Ferret Lover's Rescue for advice, as I think they know some breeders. I think it would be fun to keep track of which hobs breed with which jills and make pedigrees. Attached is Molly.  |
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Post by Sherry on May 26, 2013 14:20:13 GMT -5
Oh, she's adorable  |
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Post by crazylady on May 26, 2013 15:02:09 GMT -5
Awww what a cute little girl if you do in the future attempt breeding my advice along with a mentor is learn how to keep records of everything and I mean everything from bloodlines to where they were from how many where in the litter what sexs what colour how old where parents how many litters had they had what sexs where they what age were grandparents when they passed ect and then when kits are born log all the information you can and ask any buyers to e mail you ( I keep in contact monthly ) with a health update this way you can see if anything is wrong memory is a funny thing and things can easily be forgotten but if you have it in black and white you can go to it for referral and if problems were to arise in a line you have your records for information and contacts to buyers who you may need to pass on information too just my two pennys worth take care bye for now
Bev
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