Deaf???

[Deleted]

I think Ash may be deaf. I am actually shocked that I have missed this with him. He was attacking the Christmas tree.. so I called him.. nothing. His previous owner had said he never responded to his name or a squeaker. I tested it and called him by his original name (Vincent).. nothing.. Ash.. nothing.. tried squeaking the squeaker while he was walking around the living room.. Luna and Aurora came.. ash didn't budge. When I vacuum and they are in their cage Luna and Aurora will stick their heads out from the cube or pop up and look when they are in the hammock.. ash does nothing. How can I be for sure on him being deaf??

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[Heather]

Sounds like it to me.
Ash has exotic markings right....it's the wee one with the heart blaze? Such markings imply a possible Waardy kid, deafness being a key issue with many of them. I'm trying to place your little one, silver right....sorry it's been a long week
ciao

[Deleted]

3 of my 6 ferts are/were deaf - 1 is a Waardy. Don't feel bad for missing it, these wee ones get along just fine when they can't hear so it can be hard to discover their *disability*. With my first, it took me a few weeks to realize he was deaf. When he didn't respond to normal things/sounds like my other 2 did, that is when I picked up on it. To determine if Ash really is deaf you can do little home tests.

With any sound test make sure that they can't see you sneaking up behind them and make sure not to make vibrations. You can squeak a toy behind their head (use a hearing fert as a comparison and see how they react to the same noise), you can clap or bang things behind them, basically just make any noise you can behind them to see if they react like the hearing ferts do. You can use a vacuum, but he will probably be able to feel the vibrations so this isn't a great test - but you can watch for his reaction vs. his hearing siblings and their reactions. My deaf ferts recognize when I cut the vacuum on but they don't pay it much attention whereas 2 of my hearing ferts run and 1 likes to pounce the noise-making monster.

[katt]

Actually Heather Ash is one of her original two, and the most "normal" colored of the three of them. The little silver blaze is Aurora, and Luna is a DEW. (Wait...or is she an albino...? ) I can't quite remember, and I can't tell from your siggy, but Ash is a champagne correct?

It is certainly possible he is deaf or partially deaf. There may be some tones he can hear, or he may be profoundly deaf. Time and experimentation will help you there.

This is one of my favorite videos... ;D

[Heather]

My bad I thought it was the new little one....I'm so terrible with names
Don't feel bad about not picking up a deafy. They're very good at hiding "issues". The fact that they don't realize that they're different is part of the issue. I had never been owned by a blind fert, so had no idea what to look for and missed poor Minion. I knew there was something wrong, he actually exhibited some of the symptoms you look for with deafies. Easily startled, nasty biter, not bothered by the vaccuum (but they all attack the vaccuum I think they look at it as vaquishing the dragon ;D)....the thing that bothered me out of that was he startled heavily to loud noises (scaring himself so badly that he would dart away, sometimes jamming himself into very tight places or running into walls), so definitely not entirely deaf on some certain level.
Years ago, when I first started looking after little ones, having a deafy was rare. Now, it's not uncommon for me to have 3 or 4 or more in a business of 12 to 18. This isn't good as the implication is that having a Waardy ferret is almost more common than having one that can hear properly
ciao

[Deleted]

This one is Ash.. he is the old man.
Luna is the 'Bino
And I am not totally sure what Aurora's colorings are but she the one with the heart blaze.

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[katt]

Aurora is a blaze mutt. She could potentially be considered a roan too depending on how many white guard hairs she develops. Coloring wise I'd guess she's probably a Blaze BRM (black roan mitt), marking wise she is a mutt. More pictures would help... *ahem*

As for Ash, he does have a bit of a derpy head, but I am horrible at telling Waardy heads. He is adorable either way. His belly fur looks pretty thin. Is he adrenal?

[Heather]

That was silly of me really He doesn't have any tell tale signs, colours or such. But then when you look at my Boris, you wouldn't know on the offset that he's a deafy. On closer look you will see he's actually a Waardy, with all the skull deformations to go with it Sometimes, there are nothing you can go by but what you find. Don't feel badly, they're very good at hiding their deafness, because they don't know they've got a problem. For a ferret not to listen and respond to their name, isn't uncommon....so it often doesn't appear to be a significant reason other than just being a ferret
ciao

[Deleted]

Ash with Luna
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[Deleted]

I am still searching for a ferret knowledgeable vet... I have been told he wasn't that it was his previous living conditions. I am giving him and Luna both melatonin until I can get them to a proper vet. I disagree with him not being adrenal as he has some signs so I am wanting a second opinion. What exactly is a warddy ferret?

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[Sherry]

Waardenburg's Syndrome. It's a neural crest disorder that is frequently, but not always, linked with deafness. Some WS ferrets could also be described as mentally "slow". But again, not all.
It covers a very broad spectrum and is frequently typified by the shape of the head and eye spacing.
WS ferrets tend to have a broader flatter skull making the eyes appear larger since they tend to be set a bit further apart.
Nothing to really worry about in most cases, but can definitely explain the behaviour in some as well as understanding that these wee ones can be a little harder to train. And some never quite "get it" training wise.

[Deleted]

Ferrets can be deaf without being Waardy though, right?

[katt]

Waardenberg's syndrome is a neural crest disorder. It is a genetic defect that runs on a spectrum (much like say the autism spectrum). It is often correlated with high amounts of white markings, though you can have a Waardy without white markings, and a ferret with white markings who is not a Waardy. The genes are very closely associated though and often come hand in hand. Symptoms can include any range of a set symptoms from no symptom to full-blown including: deafness, cranial defects, broad skull, wider set eyes (think of Downs), mental retardation, lack of appropriate social skills, abnormal gait (I don't know if this is officially associated with WS, but it has been noted by many people with WS ferrets), etc. There are other symptoms, I'm just blanking on them, Those are the main ones though. They also tend to have more health problems and a shorter lifespan.

You can also have some of these symptoms without WS too though, such as a deaf ferret who is NOT WS, congenital defects, and other issues.

Here is a thread on the old forum...I wonder what Xeopse is up to...? She hasn't been around in a while...
holisticferret.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=talking&action=display&thread=6082

A photo thread:
holisticferret60.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=fuzz&action=display&thread=3438

[katt]

Here is a very good post by Josiesmom on the old forum:

Waarednberg Syndrome technically only applies to humans, not ferrets. The actual problem is "neural Crest disorder". A problem in neural crest cells wherein they do not develop properly. These cells begin in the embryonic stage and migrate throughout the embryo to become other organs, cartilage, nerves and tissues.

GO here to learn some more on neural crest cells:
www.brown.edu/Courses/BI0032/neurcrst/migrate.htm

When these cells have a disorder the organism can develop albinism, melanoma and other neurocrestopathies. Internally this can mean the animal's nervous system is not as developed as it should be, its digestive system is not properly innervated even its bones can be affected!

Outwardly this results in a ferret ( or animal) with a lot of white on its head and many other white markings too- white mitts, tip of the tail, knees. The head markings could be a blaze, one or both ears are all white, the entire head is white, they have a white bib too or a white cape.

Their head tends to be broader with the eyes set a little lower and they exhibit a "baby face".

They are usually totally deaf or have a hearing impairment. This stems not as much from improper nerve channels as much as it is from actually improper formation of the cochlea bone within the ear itself!

Often the nerve channels in the cervical spine are narrower and sometimes deformed.

The ferret's jaws don't open as wide as normal ferrets.

There seems to be a connection of ferrets with Neural crest disorders and other diseases too. My vet thinks that becauase Josie was born a Panda, this predisposed her to the Juvenile Lymphosarcoma.

Animals with white markings are often sought after at pet shops and breeders because they are considered more "cute" than their counterparts that exhibit "normal" coloration.

Neural Crest Disorder may be tied in with the fox "star gene" which has been shown to show up when subsequent generations are bred for "domesticity". Humans tend to breed for considerable white markings in many animals and after generations of these breedings, only then after other health problems have become prevalent do they begin to realize that while white markings ARE found in nature, they are there as warnings or camouflage. The white markings are generally NOT on the head- but rather along the ventral surface or edges.

Humans will breed for a "star" , which becomes a strip, which becomes a blaze, which then begets white sox, and then maybe a white ear, then two white ears and a bib, then finally we end up with a cute white faced animal with a bib, four white sox and a cute white tail- but the animal now has other problems!

Ferrets since the early days of domestication were selected for albinism because it is easier to find a white ferret in the thicket than a sable ferret! also the more white an animal has on it, the less "wild" it is perceived to be.

This is a good site to understand the "fox Star" gene
8e.devbio.com/article.php?id=223

And this is a great site to understand deaf ferrets.
www.wolfysluv.com/deaf.html


in short to improve the health of a species, they need to stay as close to their natural form as possible!

Cheers,
Kim

www.holisticferret.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=medicine&action=display&thread=966