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Post by Corvidophile on May 6, 2015 20:54:39 GMT -5
So, I got me a game hen today inclusive of a full neck and all the internals except for the stomach/intestines and divided it up as such:
Wings
Thighs
drumsticks
4 sections of back and partial ribs
4 sections of breast, keel, wishbone and partial ribs
2 sections of neck
cut the organs a few times depending on size
And I basically made 7 assorted bags, all about 4 oz each, including an eyeball-even amount of fat, muscle, bone, and organs in each. Is this a nutritionally balanced week of food, since he's going to consuming the whole carcass in that time? Should I add extra hearts? (if he finishes the daily portions I'll round out with NV Instinct raw bites for cats)
I'm hoping he'll simply eat it without me pulverizing everything, I got an occasional source of adult mouse culls since my first posting and he'll eat whole 25 gram mice with no problems, but if not, I'll mash it up.
On a related note, I had an embarrassing few minutes with it once I got it on the cutting board and realized.. I'VE NEVER CUT A CHICKEN. I've roasted them whole and bought precut bits and carved cooked birds, but I had to go exploring for where all the joints were!
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Post by Corvidophile on May 7, 2015 5:35:08 GMT -5
Well, I left him with a drumstick, breast with little cracked ribs, liver piece, heart piece, and part of some tough perogie-looking thing (is that the gizzard? Never saw one before!) this morning before work. He sniffed it all over and pulled the drumstick into a different position, but he was more interested in staring at me sadly to let him out, haha. We'll see what he figures out when I get home. He's got some kibble in there too in case he refuses, but he's a good little convert and won't eat kibble anymore unless he's exhausted every other food source, so the chicken should be highly preferable. If not, I'll mash it up and mix it with the Instict.
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Post by RedSky on May 7, 2015 7:07:35 GMT -5
If it contains everything but the intestines then yes, it would be balanced in terms of having the right % of each part. The only downfall is he should be having a minimum of 3 different proteins each week and at least one meal of red meat (lamb, pork, beef etc). If this CGH is going to last him a full week then I'd add in a few other meals and maybe stretch it to 10 - 14 days.
There is a great post somewhere that shows how many meals of each type they need if fed whole prey/balanced meals so many days a week. I feed mine 4 balanced meals a week and had already worked it out and it was nice to see that we had come to the same number.
I don't think that as a one off feeding him 1 protein for a week will have a massive impact, but I'd hate to say yeah that's fine and have someone else read it thinking their ferret can live of chicken or something. I'm sure in the wild polecats will probably have weeks of eating just one thing when it's abundant but ideally they should be eating a varied diet.
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Post by Corvidophile on May 7, 2015 8:45:07 GMT -5
Yup, I caught that list of articles and read them all, I just wasn't clear on whether the normal proportions of large fowl were fine or I should be adding more heart for instance to bring it closer to the right proportions of nutrients for a predator that would probably be eating smaller, denser birds and mammals given the chance. He'll get probably a mouse or two as interruptions this time, but I can take the breasts clean off and eat them myself in the future (I mutilated them too much this go-round) and in their place add ground hamburger meat, maybe?
Are other farm fowl different enough to count as varied, or would I be better off going with a totally different animal?
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Post by Corvidophile on May 7, 2015 20:03:35 GMT -5
HE ATE EVERYTHING, just left over the drumstick bone and some meat attached to it. But holy moly, these poops, I don't know what you guys are talking about less stinky poops, these smell like straight up roadkill. Does that go away or was it the organs or what? He let out a rainbow of them:  |
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Post by Deleted on May 7, 2015 20:46:15 GMT -5
your little ones stool look better than mine when eating poultry. my senior 's will be a pile of boney chips and watery diarrhea--as both of mine are sensitive to chicken and cornish hen---at least those r formed stools. Some of my ferrets stools smell too according to what they eat, as rabbit tend to loosen my ferrets stool and give a smell. When i feed mine heart or gizzard or organs it is dark and----ay, yay, yay  if they pig out. Duck would be considered a different protein and you could get quail. I think the chicken and cornish is considered the same ---may be wrong on that---but if one is sensitive to the chicken---they will usually be to the other---that is why i am saying that. |
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Post by Corvidophile on May 8, 2015 9:14:49 GMT -5
As a final update, he polished off the thick drumstick bone overnight alongside mouse and NV raw bites. I feel very lucky to have such an easy eater.
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Post by msav on May 8, 2015 13:26:40 GMT -5
Are the NV Raw bites the frozen or the Freeze dried?
NV has Clay in it and helps keep poop firm. Be careful not to give too many. If Freeze dried. you should not mix Raw food with dried. (like mixing raw with kibble) Should give 3 hours between one another.
Also Smelly poops are expected if switching from Kibble to Raw. Detox depends on how long they were on Kibble.
The smell does lessen. Except for Organ Poops. They will always stink.
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Post by Corvidophile on May 8, 2015 14:31:13 GMT -5
He was on Marshall's Premium kibble when I got him at about 9 weeks old, I switched him to NV Instinct Boost kibble, chicken flavour (the one with freeze dried prices mixed in) the next day, and after a few days started mixing in slowly NV Instinct frozen moist raw, chicken flavour. It took him about another week and a half before the kibble was phased out (around 11 weeks old at this point), and he was on that for maybe two weeks before I gave him his first mouse. Then a week after that, here we are at this thread at around 14 weeks old.
When the NV raw started taking over the kibble percentage-wise he was passing stools that pretty much look like human logs for about three weeks. His kibble stool looked like Play-Doh extrusions.
There was a specific reason I gave him kibble alongside the hen: Since he got used to the NV raw he stopped eating kibble entirely, I tried to give it to him when I was running low on the raw to stretch it out until I could hit the store (he ate much more of it than I had expected him to) and he wouldn't touch it for like six hours. I wanted him to venture out and try to eat the hen but didn't want to leave him with no alternative at all during the whole work day in case he flat-out refused, so I didn't want the NV raw in there, because I figured he'd eat that first as his "safe food" and then probably be full enough to wait for me to come home to give him more "safe food." So, leaving him with the option of a food he doesn't like but will eat if in a pinch and something new... he'd have a much stronger likelihood of giving the new stuff a try!
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Post by msav on May 8, 2015 14:47:26 GMT -5
If he is eating the CGH then I see no reason to have Kibble in the cage. He will eat the CGH if he is hungry.
I had a couple of ferrets come to me from the shelter and from day one they got SOUP. I have not fed them Kibble. They are doing quite well now with soup with slivers.
Since he is eating raw chunks of meat you should be working balancing his diet (liver, heart and other organ meals) and adding new different proteins. Sounds like he having no problems eating bone, so that is great.
I don't think you need to feed him NV any more either. He may be getting too many bone in meals. try feeding some meals of just CGH breast until you can get him eating some pork, Beef, or other non-bone in meats.
your doing fine so far just need to Balance him out. NV will not balance out your CGH only meals since it is already Balanced. you will need more liver/heart/other organs
BTW hanging a chunk Of CGH will be just fine in the cage for 8-10 hours Provided it lasts that long with his appetite.
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Post by Deleted on May 8, 2015 18:23:39 GMT -5
My gang LOVE CGH!!! LOL I've gotten to where I can cut one up in about two minutes. Between my four, they will polish off a bird and a half in a day. (the cat eats the other half a bird)
I can never find it with the neck and organs though. Organ day is stinkier than any other day.
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Post by Corvidophile on May 8, 2015 18:31:22 GMT -5
Oh the kibble was just the first time, he doesn't have it now that I know he accepted the hen just fine. I plan on still doing the NV raw overnight for at least a few days to give his jaw and guts a rest from working much harder to get all the vastly different textures through, he isn't eating as much as he was on the NV just because it's taking him so long, physically, to eat, so I want to make sure he's taking breaks with some calm easy mush in the beginning.
EDIT: Got it from an independent poultry guy at a farmer's market/co-op, that's why it had all the extra stuff! See if there are any similar venues in your area, because they're often happy to leave the organs in, less work for them.
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Post by Deleted on May 8, 2015 19:22:18 GMT -5
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