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Post by linsul on Feb 21, 2015 0:44:11 GMT -5
Full disclosure I have a vet that will give Kat rabies vaxx when she's a little older, but not a "home" ferret vet. A lot of referrals that lead to nowhere so far. Having said that I'd like to see if I'm understanding DES as a Adrenal preventative right so I know what time frame I'm working with. DES is good as early as possible and ideally before their first season and even more ideally in January to beat the hormone rush? Is Kat in season this spring at 2 months or do I have until January?
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Post by Celene on Feb 21, 2015 13:27:55 GMT -5
I'm not an expert, but I believe the general opinion is "the sooner the better, but anything helps".
I only know a few (incredibly experienced) ferrents who recommend against using the implant as a preventative since if/when it does start it will mask the symptoms and can't be caught early.
Truthfully, I haven't looked into it extensively since the implant has been unavailable so it was kind of a moot point, but now that it's expected in I would definitely like to hear others' opinions on it.
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Post by Desiree on Feb 21, 2015 14:09:00 GMT -5
I'm going to use it as a preventative when my two youngest come into season. If Kat is only two months now I would wait until next season. I believe that ferrets season twice a year. I'm not sure when the seasons actaully are but basically the first season after they are 6 months is a great time to get the implant from what I understand about it. I haven't done this myself yet. Remember that artificial lighting can also cause a ferret to come into season earlier. I'm using an all natural diet (frankenprey and whole prey) coupled with natural lighting and the DES to see if we can stave off any diseases for as long as possible.
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Post by linsul on Feb 21, 2015 15:24:21 GMT -5
Great thank you I really appreciate the responses on the topic. I was confused about the age and coming into season part for sure since she's so little. Natural light as a factor is new as is the option to wait for confirmation of Adrenal disease so I'm very glad to have this info.
I spent all morning and this afternoon calling and "vetting" the vets. It was rough. Then I found one with DES in the DFW area. Idk if I'm allowed to link it, but if anyone is in North Texas and having my issue then I'm happy to pm the link, it's on their site but I haven't called them yet. Since it will likely be Kat's vet I'll call and ask them what their view on preventative care with implants is. Part of me doesn't want to just because confirmed Adrenal ferrets need it and I know it's hard to find sometimes.
Edit: they're closed today but also have ferretonin by Melatek available and even suggested on their website as a Adrenal preventative rather than DES.
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Post by Desiree on Feb 21, 2015 17:25:01 GMT -5
Ferretonin, I believe, is the melatonin injection. It does help with the symptoms but it DOES NOT slow the growth of tumors like the implant does. The implant helps inside with the ferretonin helps the outside, itchy skin, fur loss etc.
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Post by linsul on Feb 21, 2015 18:34:19 GMT -5
It's listed as a 4 month implant on the vet website, but I will ask for sure. I don't want to do something pointless, especially if it involves hormones!
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Post by Deleted on Feb 21, 2015 18:39:29 GMT -5
Hi linsul! I'm no expert by any means, but I do use Deslorelin acetate implants on my Marshall ferrets for prevention and treatment. It is not known if it actually prevents and treats adrenal disease. Sadly some ferrets receive this implant for many consecutive years, and still develop adrenal tumor. It might just mask the symptoms as Celene said, but I think it's worth it just to give them a relief from these nasty symptoms. With the information that the current studies can provide, I believe this is our best bet. Our Marshall ferrets are doomed. Most of them will develop adrenal disease sooner or later.  linsul, is Kat a Marshall? I'm sure you know, but all Marshall ferrets in the U.S. come fixed. (Unless you are in Europe, then Marshall apparently does sell intact ferrets over there, from what I've heard.) So they do not go into seasons. When working with fixed ferrets, you don't really need to worry about the timing of giving them an implant. I think sooner the better.  |
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Post by Desiree on Feb 21, 2015 19:24:29 GMT -5
Would two months be to young though? My babes are just over three months. I was going to weight till they hit 6 months or older.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 21, 2015 20:36:07 GMT -5
I'm not sure... My exotic vet tried to give my Mitch an implant when he was three months old. She didn't seem too concerned that he was too young. I politely declined though, as I thought I should let him grow a little bit more.
I read somewhere that the youngest ferret to have developed adrenal tumor was 9 months old. So my "uneducated" opinion would be you could probably wait until they are close to one year old. Is there a bad consequence of implanting them too early? I have no clue.
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Post by Celene on Feb 21, 2015 21:13:18 GMT -5
Well deslorin is a hormone (it's used in hobs as a sort of temporary/medical castration as an alternative to neutering) so I would imagine it shouldn't be implanted into a ferret until they're fully "developed". Beyond that I don't have enough expertise to comment.
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Post by msav on Feb 21, 2015 21:49:36 GMT -5
It is not known if it actually prevents and treats adrenal disease. Sadly some ferrets receive this implant for many consecutive years, and still develop adrenal tumor. I would like to know more of where this info came from. I have 5 ferrets with yearly implants. 2 of mine are going on 7 years and were part of an early trial. They started on their implants even before it was approved in the US. I have been following several other trials, and every single ferret that got their initial injection before 6 months of age and got their yearly injections without any gaps have yet to show any signs of adrenal. However I fear that this trial will no longer be able to continue as the the shortage of implants is making continual yearly treatments difficult to maintain. Mine are due for their implants this month and I will not be able to continue without gaps in their yearly implants. The last Rumored word is they will not be available until mid summer. the empty promises and pushed release dates sounds very familiar to the purevax distemper fiasco, in the end they announced that they were discontinuing the vaccine. I hope that it does not end with the implants being discontinued as well. I would also check expiration dates of any implants that are still available as it is coming close to the time frame that all would be expired since that last batch of manufactured implants |
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Post by linsul on Feb 21, 2015 22:01:24 GMT -5
Would two months be to young though? My babes are just over three months. I was going to weight till they hit 6 months or older. I'm not sure honestly! I was just asking to see what others are doing and get a sense of what is possible and what is ideal based on others experience. I wanted to form a timeline of sorts because the vet search was really looking grim on the implant front and I didn't want to miss a prime window. Since I found implants now, I will absolutely ask them and see what they say. I do like seeing what msav had to say particularly in the matter of age and implant adrenal prevention efficacy. If the trials are looking so good for younger than 6 months then I'm all about it! Are those trials for DES or melatonin msav? I just saw "yearly" so I'm assuming DES but would like to confirm for when I call the vet Monday. I'm thinking rabies shot at 4 months and DES a couple weeks after based on those trial results. |
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Post by Celene on Feb 21, 2015 22:08:46 GMT -5
msav - I believe Virbac (the manufacturer) has confirmed that the implants are being made and packaged right now and will be shipping 100% for sure next month.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 21, 2015 22:55:36 GMT -5
I agree, Celene, I wouldn't want to implant kits before they fully develop either, just because it seems wrong. But again, the major damage is already done at the age of 4 weeks. They don't go through puberty like normal ferrets would. Now, my question is this. If all the implant does is suppress their sex hormones, would it have a negative impact on them, if they already don't have gonads? The chances of Marshall ferrets developing adrenal disease before one is extremely rare, although not impossible. So, I personally can't justify implanting them before then. But would it really do any harm? msav, someone I know recently lost a ferret to adrenal disease. The ferret had had the implant for several years before passing. It caught the owner by surprise, because #1 the ferret was on Deslorelin for prevention and #2 the ferret did not have any symptoms, until its sudden death. The autopsy revealed that not only the ferret had a massive adrenal tumor, but also it had metastasized to the liver. That's what I was referring to, and I do not have a study that I can site, nor do I claim that this is my personal experience. I'm just throwing it out there. I believe this ferret originally came from the shelter, and it didn't start the implants as a kit. Maybe that's why a tumor developed anyway? I hope it won't happen to your 5 babies though...  And good thinking about the expatriation dates! |
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Post by msav on Feb 21, 2015 22:57:29 GMT -5
msav - I believe Virbac (the manufacturer) has confirmed that the implants are being made and packaged right now and will be shipping 100% for sure next month. I would love it if that were really true. I emailed Virbac 2 days ago below is their response Thank you for contacting Virbac regarding SUPRELORIN® F (deslorelin acetate) Implant. At this point in time we do not have a date of availability. I apologize for any inconvenience this may have caused you. Please let me know if you have any further questions or concerns and I will be happy to assist. Have a wonderful day! Warm Regards, Lindsay Garman Veterinary Technical Product Support Technical Services / Virbac North America 3200 Meacham Blvd. Fort Worth, TX 76137, USA Tel: 800-338-3659, Ext. 3559 / Fax: 682-730-4059 lindsay.garman@virbacus.com / www.virbacvet.com |
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