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Post by RedSky on Jan 18, 2015 7:57:59 GMT -5
Wow, that must be such a hard decision but it does sound like it might be best for Domino, since he already has that bond. Plus if he is coming around for lots of visits it might be like he never left anyway. I suppose the hard part will be who pays for vet bills, Domino being older than the new guy is more likely to have higher bills, but then the new guy, who knows how old he is or how healthy he is. Do you pay for Domino and they pay for the new one or visa versa? And that hard question, which you probably don't want to think about, again assuming Domino is older than the new guy, it's most likely the new one will outlive Domino, so at that point are you expected to give this new guy back? Or is it more likely that Domino will out live your friend's ferret and maybe need to come back home? In which case are you prepared to have 5 ferrets and all that comes with that? I think as long as you are prepared for what might happen and you and your friend are on the same page about everything then yeah, sounds like a good plan. Glad this new one is taking to raw, does your friend raw feed too? It's great they are taking pieces of heart, and I'm sure the new guy will catch up. But in the mean time, we need a name and pictures please
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Post by Deleted on Jan 18, 2015 9:03:06 GMT -5
Wow, that must be such a hard decision but it does sound like it might be best for Domino, since he already has that bond. Plus if he is coming around for lots of visits it might be like he never left anyway. That was really the only reason that I even agreed to this weekend experiment in the first place. I actually got Domino as a kit in September, so I assume he's only a few months older. It'd be a 100% swap of responsibilities if we go through with it. We're going to talk about pros, cons, observations and everything this evening and see what we wanna do. Little boy (who I'd name (Joliet) Jake if he stayed, I need to complete the Blues Brothers lol) is getting on very well with my crew during playtime so I at least know he'd do well here, if he stays. He doesn't feed raw, but he told me to try with him so if he does keep him, it'll jump start him making the switch with Leche as well. Idk if he'd do the same if he keeps Domino considering he'll need to go through a full switch. Leche is young enough to pick it up quickly. I did take some DSLR photos yesterday so I'll try and get those posted at some point today.
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Post by RedSky on Jan 18, 2015 9:13:56 GMT -5
I didn't realise that they were all that young. Well good luck and I hope it all works out.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 18, 2015 13:49:45 GMT -5
Everytime that I talk about Elwood, my husband says you need a Jake. Especially since you're in Chicago, there just has to be a Jake.
I hope your swap goes well and everyone is happy. Bonds are important and should be respected. Since you guys are close friends and will see each other, it sounds like this will work well for all.
Pictures, pretty please. :banana:
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Post by Deleted on Jan 18, 2015 14:22:02 GMT -5
Everytime that I talk about Elwood, my husband says you need a Jake. Especially since you're in Chicago, there just has to be a Jake. Funnily enough, Elwood is like the real Elwood in the sense that he follows the others and is a little out there, and would-be Jake seems like a little mastermind and could lead him, like the real Jake. Their names would be perfect I woke up to some Snapchat videos of Domino and Leche playing, and he looked so happy. He hadn't bounced around like that since Coconut arrived. It seems like he does better with only one other ferret. When Elwood arrived is around the same time his playing started to slow. I don't know if it's correlated or not, but I was just happy to see him happy. I updated my photo thread with some photos holisticferret60.proboards.com/post/244082/thread
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Post by Deleted on Jan 18, 2015 15:23:44 GMT -5
They all have such personalities, I can understand them having preferences in friends also. I'm glad that Domino seems to be happy and playful again and will still get to see you often. Seems like you all found the perfect fit for everone.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 18, 2015 16:09:11 GMT -5
Okay, I have put together a plan for this week using the basic frankenprey menu on the docs. I did swap some of the AM/PM on some days just based on what I know they'll eat. Since I don't have time to coax them to eat something new in the morning without waking up stupidly early, it's just easier. I'd like to go back to the store Wednesday and pick up some more stuff, so Thurs - Sat might change. This is just based on what I'm in possession of.
Sunday AM: Chicken wings (did not eat bone) PM: Quail (new)
Monday AM: Chicken wings PM: Duck leg
Tuesday AM: Chicken heart PM: Quail
Wednesday AM: Chicken wings PM: Rabbit (new)
Thursday AM: Quail PM: Pork heart, chicken liver, pork kidney (new)
Friday AM: Rabbit PM: Duck leg
Saturday AM: Chicken wings PM: Chicken liver, pork kidney
Does that seem okay? Also I did not smash the bones in this morning's wings, and they ate around them. I am going to smash them for the other bone-in days, but in the event that they also eat around those, should I sprinkle bone meal powder on their next meal?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 19, 2015 7:35:49 GMT -5
The quail was a big hit. They were still working on the chicken wings around their normal dinnertime (6pm) so I pulled the rest at that time and put the quail in the cage around 9. I saw that the bones were tiny when I cut it, so I didn't smash it. I believe they ate most of the bones because all that was left this morning was a 1.5" tiny bone.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 19, 2015 12:03:01 GMT -5
I'm glad the quail was a hit. That makes gives you such a nice bone in meat.
You're menu looks good: You have six proteins. The correct amount of Organ meals: including the half meal of heart You have a full meal of heart.
One question and note about your muscle meat meals. Are you counting Duck leg as a muscle meat? Bone In meals are the Non Weight bearing bones, so a Duck leg may be a bit much for the little guys to handle, at least in the beginning.
I know you had that scare with gizzards, but they are a great muscle meat. Also, try to find a red meat for their menu. It's high in Iron and Vitamin B, and ideally, they should have at least one meal of red meat a week. Mine don't like beef very much, so I use that meal and add an egg to the beef.
Smash the bones and if they decide to be stubborn, then you can dust the meat with the bone meal powder. Wait and see how they do. That way if they do eat the bones and they have bone meal powder, their poops may be too firm. I tend to dust the organs and muscle meats with a little bonemeal powder.
As you go along, you'll find ways to tweak your menu that makes it easier for your schedule. You'll also find that they eat better at one meal than another and you can adjust for that. Plus they will have their favorite foods. I tend to follow a basic menu and have learned that mine eat better once they are eating familiar foods. I try to slip a new food in once or twice a month, but I'm a little limited in variety here in my area.
That's a very nice First Menu. Good Job :thumbsup:
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Post by Deleted on Jan 19, 2015 12:29:36 GMT -5
Yay!! Oops, I should've labeled what each item was. I'm sorry. Yes, the duck leg is a muscle meat (the bones look pretty large, so I cut the meat off). When I go back to the store, I am going to get some frog leg and I am going to look at the beef again. I know they had cuts but also tongue? I don't know if they'd like it, but it is a muscle, correct? They also had ox tail, would that also qualify as a muscle? Or is tail a bone? I'm going to try to get some quail eggs too, I'm sure they'll have them. I do have gizzards in the freezer, I'd like to try them but I thought they may be too tough for them to chew yet. I might bring them into their rotation for next week and see how they do. Jake ended up staying, he is slowly figuring out how to chew (he was licking the chicken wing for awhile until he saw Gidget chewing, lol) so I figure he might be doing better at the end of this week.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 19, 2015 13:56:19 GMT -5
When you post a menu, it helps to write what each meal (muscle meat/organ/bone in) is and what protein. That way we know that you know which is which.
Gfountain has had fed frog legs (she's a good New Orleans girl) and hers like it. I haven't tried it, but then I haven't found it yet either.
Tongue is a muscle meat. It's full of Taurine and is a good substitute for hearts. (potential test question, lol) and mine love it. I buy pork tongue. Beef tongue is very pricey and huge. It is a muscle meat.
Ox tail (which actually comes from cows and is labeled as Ox for some strange purpose) might have some marrow and that would be a good treat. Remember bones are the Non Weight bearing bones of an animal the size of a chicken or smaller. So, if there was meat on it, it would be a muscle meat. They wouldn't be able to handle bone that large.
Why don't you try the gizzards and mince them. If they like them, then try long thin slivers. Look for duck gizzards also. They are a favorite and a great way to get duck without spending alot. Forgive me if I repeat myself, I'm a huge fan of gizzards and always sing their praises.
Jake might move along fast, peer pressure can be a great motivator. He could be stubborn, but let's hope that he will catch up quickly and make it easier on you.
Quail eggs can be fun. I've only tried them once or twice, but no one was too impressed. Other ferrents report that theirs go crazy over them. I believe that most will simply offer the whole egg and let them open them. Sounds messy but it would be good enrichment.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 19, 2015 19:29:07 GMT -5
I'm going to try the gizzards for dinner tonight instead of the duck. I'll definitely report back.
I don't remember if I saw pork tongue or not, but I'll grab some if they have it. I've never eaten frog legs personally, I'll just see what the ferrets think of it before I go and try it, lol.
Bone is now being eaten. There is a small bone left from this morning's breakfast of wings. I finally got to see what a bone poop looks like in person :-P
I took their weights, should I be concerned about Dalia's loss? I know it's tiny, but still.
Jake: 2.88lbs Dalia: 1.94lbs (1/11: 1.98lbs, 1/15: 1.97lbs) Elwood: 2.79lbs (1/11: 2.61lbs, 1/15: 2.6lbs) Gidget: 1.46lbs (1/15: 1.4lbs)
I'm going to get updated photos when I return from my nail appt later tonight!
ETA: Jakey is chewing gizzards like a champ! As are Elwood and Dalia. Gidget is still working on a bone. So proud.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 19, 2015 23:13:39 GMT -5
Here are their body photos: Elwood & Gidget Dalia & Jake Elwood Gidget
Dalia Jake
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Post by Deleted on Jan 20, 2015 19:07:45 GMT -5
I've had to split the levels again, it turns out Jake isn't potty trained. I didn't realize it during the weekend because they free roam in my room when I'm home, and he was good about using the puppy pad. Yesterday and today I came home to poop/pee on the fleece (in front of the litter box, no less) since they're in the cage when I'm at work. I have Elwood and Dalia on top, Gidget & Jake on the bottom. Hopefully she can train him, she's never missed the box while in the cage since being here.
Food's going really well. I cut their hearts in half today, instead of pieces, and there were no leftovers. I also put a whole quail on each level and all ran to it and started eating with no problem.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 20, 2015 19:19:29 GMT -5
I just loved those pictures. Everyone looks quite healthy and so beautiful. I love how little Dalia's legs were splayed out. Not very lady like but awfully darn cute. You're really making amazing progress. Very nice job :thumbsup: Jake should pick up the potty training from Gidget. If not, here is a thread on litter box boot camp: holisticferret60.proboards.com/thread/108/litter-box-boot-camp
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