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Post by Heather on Apr 18, 2011 21:51:38 GMT -5
Name: Mike HF Forum Username: mikeybox
1. Where did you first learn about natural diets for ferrets?
I had heard of natural diets here and there but nothing specific, then hurricanekatt (HF Forum username) told me about this forum in my thread over on the ferret.com forums
2. Please describe the type of diet you would like assistance in switching your ferret(s) to. Be sure to include if you are interested in feeding whole prey (live or frozen-thawed) and if you are wanting to FULLY switch to a natural diet or PARTIALLY. If you are unsure what kind of diet you want to put your ferrets on, please express that and we can help you find the best type of natural diet for your ferret.
I would like to switch to all natural if I can afford it, but if not, supplement partial natural diet with kibble. I don't know enough about it yet to decide. I would be interested in supplementing with whole prey as well if it is not too difficult or expensive.
3. Why are you interested in switching your ferrets to a natural diet?
I don't want my ferrets to develop insulinoma or tooth problems. I also heard they poop less and smell better on a natural diet. Above all I want them to get a healthy diet since they young and still growing.
4. Do you understand that switching your ferret to a natural diet can be a lengthy, arduous process? Its not an overnight switch. It can be a commitment of several weeks or even months. Your HF Mentor will be more then happy to assist you in switchng your ferret(s) to a natural diet, but you need to be equally as commited. If you aren't willing to tough out a potentially lengthy switching process, or if you have major life changes approaching (baby on the way, moving, starting school, getting married/divorced, etc) then it might be a better idea to wait on switching your ferret's diet until you have more time. Are you willing to make the commitment?
Yes
5. How many ferrets do you currently have? What are their names? Ages? Genders? Do they have any health problems? Are they overweight? Underweight?
Fenton - 4 months, male, no known health problems Fiona - 2 months, female, no known health problems
6. What diet do you currently feed your ferrets? (Please include all treats, supplements, etc)
Marshall ferret diet
7. Have you ever tried to switch your ferrets to a natural diet in the past? If yes, what happened?
No
8. What additional information about yourself or your ferrets would you like to share?
I have not had them checked by a vet yet, but they seem healthy. I plan on having them checked up once I find a good local vet who knows ferrets.
9. How often during the week do you have access to a computer?
Every day
10. Please post a picture of each of your ferrets (if possible).
Hi and welcome to the mentoring program. In a little while your mentor (Hurricanekatt) will introduce herself and you can get started on a new adventure in natural ferret care and diets. Please remember to post regularly (daily or as per arranged with your mentor) so that your mentor can assist you move along safely in this adventure. If you experience computer difficulties or are going to be away, please notify your mentor and most of all relax and have fun . Your mentor is here to help you on this journey.
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Post by katt on Apr 19, 2011 0:29:37 GMT -5
Hi! Here's just a little about me... Name: Katt HF Screen Name: HurricaneKatt Location: Anchorage, Alaska About Me: My favorite hobby is... studying. Just kidding. I like to do different types of art including drawing and painting. I recently started making dream catchers too. I enjoy horseback riding, playing with my critters, and enjoying time with my boyfriend. And the critters of course! I am a premed student in Alaska graduating May 1(weew! SO close! lol) with a Biology degree. I’ll be taking a year off to enjoy myself, work on my application, and visit Africa before applying for Medical School in the next round. I became a mentor because...I really like helping people (hence the whole wanting to be a doctor thing ) and animals. I am a strong supporter of a natural diet and probably bore most people that I meet to death ranting about raw diet and why it is the best way to go…this way I can rant to someone who actually cares! About My Ferrets: Koda – male, Real Canadian, just over a year old (he was about 8 weeks old when I bought him in December 2009), Sable. I gave him raw the second he came home and neither of us has ever looked back. He is a real trouble maker and is pretty well known around the forums as such. He is my first, and so far only, ferret and though I have not had him long he has forced me to learn and learn FAST! He has managed to eat several rubber objects (had to have surgery!), and is constantly finding new trouble to get into. Loves digging the carpet up, has a very serious oral fixation (if his mouth can stretch wide enough for his teeth to touch it – he will chew it), will rearrange the room to reach things, has learned how to levitate, and is an all around little monster. He is also very strongly bonded to my boyfriend and I, and can be a huge love bug. When the endless energy is finally burned off, he will curl up in our laps, give us kisses, and fall asleep. As you can tell, I have this problem where I can’t stop talking about him or taking pictures of him… We recently discovered that he has IBD and I am actually working with Mustelidmusk on adjusting his diet to keep his belly aches under control. Right now it is still hit and miss. Kneai: I brought Kenai home towards the end of November. He is also eating 100% raw diet, whole prey, franken prey, meaty bones you name it! He was a tiny little bag of bones when I brought him home, but he eats like a pig and grows like a weed! He is now huge and rolly-polly! definitely a little porker - he can barely make it out of his rice box because he is so bottom heavy. lmao He is a silver mitt/black roan mitt. haha He loves, LOVES toys and is a loveable, goofy little guy and has been helping to keep Koda company and burn off each others energy! He's definitely a little spaz - I though Koda was until I got Kenai! He's a bit of a simpelton, but we love him just the same. About My Natural Feeding Experience: I've been feeding raw since December 2009 when I brought Koda home. Thanks to this forum, I was ready for a fuzzball to come home with my freezer stocked with meats! I gave him a raw chicken wing his first night home and that was the end of that! He is fed frankenprey, f/t roents, and live prey. Unfortunately, his diet is somewhat restricted because of his IBD, but we've finally got a bit of variety back in. I have been reading and learning since before I brought Koda home and learned a lot from the people here on the forum. I am always on the forum, and various websites trying to learn more about ferrets in general, and especially raw diet. My boys are healthy, energetic, have super soft fur, and smell so good that people regularly comment, asking me what perfume or spray I sprayed them (esp Koda) with! I love telling them: Thanks to a raw diet - he just smells that good naturally! When Kenai first came home he had been eating Marshall's kibble and his poop smelled...awful doesn't even come close to describing it! Now he smells much better and his scraggly coat has been replaced by a luxurious pile of fur. Type of Mentor: In Training! I feed frankenprey, raw meats, bone-in meats, ground meats, frozen/thawed rodents, live prey, and recently added (for treats and supplemental) freeze dried raw. I have never fed kibble so I can’t help a ton there on picking a good kibble… but hopefully we can get rid of it entirely anyways. My Specialty: Trouble makers! Especially only ferrets, and kits. Switching your pair should be easy peasy! Kits will eat almost anything you put in front of them. I'll guide you through introducing them to new foods, and getting a balanced diet going. You will find that feeding raw is actually much less expensive in the long run. Fewer vet bills, no dental bills, less poop to clean, and they eat less. Right now your pair are young, and they will be compensating for the kibble diet so they will eat a LOT for a while. They will slow down after a bit though don't worry. Kits are tummies with teeth.
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Post by katt on Apr 19, 2011 0:45:00 GMT -5
Let's start with a rundown of your feeding schedule. Do they have access to food 24/7? Or do you have meal times? Also, the first thing that you will want to do is stock up on the basics. You need skinless boneless chicken breasts (might as well get a big pack lol) and canned pumpkin. Make sure that it is NOT the premade pumpkin pie filling - the ONLY ingredients should be pumpkin and water. If you can't find that, squash baby food will work just as well. If you can't find that either, then sweet potato and meat baby food will do. Do you have a good blender? You will need one for the soupies. The first thing we want to do is get them used to the taste of raw. Try giving them a tiny chunk of chicken and see if they will take it. You might need to "Scruff and stuff" hold them gently by the scruff, supporting their butt in your lap, and put the chicken in their mouth. You'll be acting the part of Mommy Ferret here. If they will eat chunks of chicken GREAT we can skip a few steps. If not, that is ok they will still get to it pretty quickly. If they DO eat the chicken breast slivers (cut very small to begin with): take the kibble out of their cage and give them a bowl of chicken slivers. See how well they take to it. If they do NOT like the chicken. No worries! They will. You will need to make some soupies at this point. It's really easy. Add chicken and 1 tsp of pumpkin per ferret into a blender with some water. You can make the soup more or less thick by adding more or less water. Start out thick and go thinner until they will eat it. A consistency of super thick pudding is usually a good place to start, or even thicker. See if they will lick it off of your fingers. If not Scruff and Stuff until they will lick it off of your fingers. Then offer it on a spoon (you might need to lower your finger to the spoon until they take it that way), then the bowl (lower the spoon to the bowl until they eat it). I am confident we can get them eating soupies without kibble. If not, then we can go back another step or two.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2011 0:47:08 GMT -5
Awesome, well I'm ready to get started! Is it OK if I offer them a chicken wing? Or should I read some thread on how to start or something? I'll take whatever instructions you give
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Post by katt on Apr 19, 2011 0:52:11 GMT -5
No way. Go for it! If they will eat a chicken wing then even less steps to go through! And all the sooner they will be on a balanced diet. ;D Fiona should take to it right away. Fenton should too, but sometimes the "older" kits need a day or two on soup first. Let me know how it goes!
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2011 1:03:02 GMT -5
OK I gave them a chicken wing, dangling from a shoelace above their food dish (is this OK? I was worried it would get covered in bedding. Oh yeah also, I need to switch bedding, I'm using wood shavings which I guess aren't that good right?) Anyway I took a raw chicken wing and hung it in their cage, and Fenton is eating it right now! Yay Fenton! He's gnawing on the wingtip and has already eaten about an inch off it. Fiona hasn't touched it yet but I will keep an eye on them. If she doesn't eat any by tomorrow then try a soupie for her? How long can I safely leave the chicken wing in the cage with them? (assuming it doesn't all get eaten tonight)
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Post by katt on Apr 19, 2011 1:08:31 GMT -5
Yay! Go Fenton! I bet Fiona will eat it when she gets hungry. I would put in another wing and remove the kibble. Eating kibble and raw together can cause belly aches from the different rates of digestion. Also, be prepared for some Strange poopies while their GI tract adjusts to the new diet. Yes, get rid of the wood chips ASAP. Take them out - tonight preferably - and just put in an old towel, T-shirts (shirts with your scent will help them settle in) and blankets until you can get them their own bedding. For the wing, hooking it to the cage is good. With a shoelace not so much. They could eat the shoelace. I would suggest setting up a feeding den. There are some threads around here somewhere. Do you have a cardboard box? I find Capri Sun boxes work great. That will do for tonight.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2011 1:13:03 GMT -5
I think I have some small boxes here and there, I'll look around and read the thread on how to set up the feeding den.
Going to remove the kibble and wood shavings now...
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Post by katt on Apr 19, 2011 1:18:53 GMT -5
*cheers!* Any cardboard box will work for now. Some people use them all of the time. I used to but the rubbermaid is much easier to clean. lol You can just put a cardboard box in the cage and put the meat in there. They will rearrange it anyways. haha
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2011 1:20:08 GMT -5
Just a quick note, I think Fiona is hungry, she has been out of cage most of the day playing and hasn't eaten. I offered her a tiny piece of kibble and she snatched it up, so she acts hungry. But she doesn't seem to want to touch the chicken.
Would it be OK if I grind up a tiny bit of the kibble she's used to and rub it on the chicken wing to encourage her to try it?
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2011 1:29:53 GMT -5
Well I hope it's OK and not "cheating" but I did rub a little kibble dust on the wing and now Fiona is eating it.
I gave them a 2nd wing like you suggested so they both have one!
Keeping an eye on them for now...
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Post by katt on Apr 19, 2011 1:30:06 GMT -5
Absolutely. Also, try pulling a piece of meat off of the chicken (start small) and hand feeding it to her. You might need to scruff and stuff a few times to give her the idea, then offer a piece near the wing, then show her the wing...
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2011 3:44:44 GMT -5
Well both Fenton and Fiona are now gnawing vigorously at the chicken wings. Interestingly they seem to spend most of their time gnawing on the bone which makes for slow progress. I expected them to eat the flesh off first since it's easier but they seem to really like eating the bone.
They are chewing on the wings right now as I go to bed, I'll check in the morning to see how much they were able to eat. Should I throw out the leftovers or leave them in there to chew on while I'm at work?
Also I have a young cottontail rabbit carcass (missing the organs though), can I feed that to them? Or is there any danger? I already checked that the rabbit didn't have rabbit fever (Tularemia).
Thanks!
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Post by katt on Apr 19, 2011 4:28:23 GMT -5
Yay! Sorry I forgot to answer earlier about how long raw stays good. Ooops. Typically raw soup is good for about 4-8 hours, ground meat 8-12 hours, whole meat is good for about 12-24 hours, prey for about 48. They will not eat it if it has gone bad, unless they are Starving, so don't worry about that. Yes, you can give them the rabbit carcass. Let me know how they like fur. ;D Some go for it - they are young enough that they might go straight to it - some need a little convincing first. They are eating the bones because their growing bodies need the calcium (and the meat protein too) but also because they are babies and thus still teething. Feed them as much as they will eat and more. I always make sure that I feed enough so that there is just a little left over. Then you know they are getting enough. They will self regulate. Ok so they are eating bone. GREAT! Here's the plan then. They imprint on their food so you want to get them eating a wide variety of food now while they are still so young and easy to please. It is not impossible to introduce new foods later by any means, but it becomes more difficult. You need about 10-15% bone, 10% organ (half of which should be liver), and the rest muscle meats. Heart is very important, it counts as a muscle meat (as does gizzard which is GREAT for the teeth) but they need a LOT of heart for the taurine. Also, they need an absolute minimum of 3 protein sources. Might as well start looking and getting an idea of the selection in your area. Some meats to consider/look for include: rabbit (whole is good, bones and organs!) chicken (all parts) chicken heart chicken liver chicken gizzard pork meat pork side (basically uncured, unsalted/seasoned etc bacon - good fat source) pork and beef liver pork and beef heart pork and beef kidney pork and beef spleen beef meat turkey - meat, wings, necks, gizzards, organs, whole turkey, etc Duck quail pheasant buffalo veal venison rodents goat lamb You want a good variety of organs, hearts, bones, and meats. You want heart, but you want heart from multiple animals if possible. Same for liver, kidney, spleen, etc. Chicken feet are a great bony chew toy. The More variety the Better! It is good to feed a variety of types of meat too. As in soupie, ground, and whole. You want them to recognize raw soupies because if they ever get sick and you need to feed them soups your life and theirs will be easier if they already recognize it as food. You want to feed whole meats and such, but feeding the occasional ground meat is a nice change for them here and there. Commercial ground raw is great for adding a little variety if you can find a place near you that carries it. Also, I feed thawed meat, frozen meat (makes a great toy), and on rare occasion (rare because it goes bad faster) warmed up meat. Do you have access to frozen feeder rodents? I would try them on some mice and rats here soon also. It will make things easier if you want to do whole prey later. Again with the imprinting thing. Anyways, I hope that was coherent. It is past 1 am here and I am getting tired. lol Talk to you in the morning...um, later in the morning!
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2011 13:07:11 GMT -5
OK checking in... I vacuumed out all the wood shavings from their cage and put old towels in there instead which I can wash when they get dirty. My fuzzbutts are about 90% litterbox trained when in their cage so I think we'll be fine without the wood Fenton and Fiona both came back to the chicken wings later to gnaw on them some more, and Fenton woke up this morning and went to town on one of them, stripping off all remaining skin and meat so only most of the wing bones are left (with parts missing they ate off the ends). The other chicken wing is about half eaten. Had to rush off to work so after morning playtime I left the remaining chicken wing with them and added about a chicken-wing-sized chunk of turkey back that I picked up last night. Surprisingly they both started eating at it right away with less hesitation than the chicken wings, maybe it smells and tastes enough like chicken that they knew it was food already? Hope that's enough meat to get them through the day until dinner time! Should I get some liver and heart on my way home from work or something?
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