My Fear Has Come True...... :(

[Deleted]

I have copied this from my other thread "My Vet Said to do this But" because this ties into why I wanted Lupron since the implant is currently unavailable (in case you wanted to read the full story.....I think the link will be at the end of this rant/babble) ;

So my fear has come true........Zekrom is having difficulty urinating

This happened Monday night; I got home from work and everyone was sleeping in their hammocks. I made sure I had enough soup for dinner and breakfast when Zekrom woke up in a panic. I wasn't *too* concerned as sometimes they will wake up crazy itchy (silly ferts!). I saw him run to the litterbox and jump out. Then he ran over to the ramp and acted as if he would poop, then ran upstairs (they have a double ferret nation cage) and went in the corner (he NEVER misses the litterbox) and had a yellow/white poop, formed, and then ran downstairs and back upstairs dragging his rearend. He hoped into a hammock and started licking near his bum-bright red prolapse! I immediately started crying. My poopr baby boy! (He turned 3 years old October 15th) I knew this can turn to a terrible situation fast! I figured the prolapse was caused by him straining to urinate. He was fine Sunday and I didn't notice anything out of the ordinary Monday morning. I prayed he would be okay until Tuesday.
I called the vet and made an appointment at 5:30 (I don't have anymore time off this year). My husband worked a half day and called me a couple times to let me know Zek was acting fine. Once at the vet's, they expressed his bladder and got a medium amount of urine out. She told me they ordered the lupron and should be here Friday/Saturday. While I'm thankful, I'm mad! This is exactly why I called 3 weeks ago to get lupron! He was fine then but look at him now! He also pooped and urinated when we got home around 6pm last night!(YAY!!!!!!) I've never been so happy to have urine on my hand (I dabbed it with a paper towl to be certain!) So now my list of questions:

Is this light colored poop 'normal'? He has been eating mostly soup with a chunk here or there. Everyone else is having brown/dark poops. It almost looks like a formed egg poop.

Has anyone experienced this? (Trouble urinating/prolaspe) This vet said to put some vaseline on if it's sticking out (She was able to 'tuck' it back in so she didn't think he would need stitches but wants to keep it moist)

Is this coincidence and maybe he's been on soup too long? He did have diarhea(sp?) a couple weeks ago but has had formed poop for a solid week now.

If his prostate is getting enlarged, how long will it take for the lupron to kick in?

I'm just so upset; I really hope we won't have to go to an emergency vet on/before/after Thanksgiving. Plus, with emergency vets, I'd be afraid they won't know what to do? Could they do more harm than good? Ugh

Read more: holisticferret60.proboards.com/thread/16530/vet-said?page=2#ixzz3KBnT3n2W

[Heather]

There are other meds you can use that will help treat the enlarged prostate. "Propecia/ Proscar (Finasteride)
Used to treat an enlarged prostate due to Adrenal disease. Is an enzyme inhibitor which stops the formation of DHT, a main hormone causing the enlargement. Usual dosage is 1 mg day for 30 days, then taper down". (I used this particular drug with Mad Max
"Casodex(Bicalutamide)
Used to treat an enlarged prostate. Blocks androgen (DHT) receptors on the prostate, reducing testosterone levels. Usual dosage is 5 mg daily."
Quite often when we used to treat with lupron we'd also have to treat with another med or two to treat the enlarged prostate.
As far as the prolapse you can use some prep h (regular) and hold him for about 10 minutes after treatment. Dabbing some sugar on the prolapse will also reduce swelling (again holding him to prevent him from either licking or wiping it off will be necessary). If you don't see any normal return to the prolapse then please don't leave too long as surgery may be needed and the longer that you leave the prolapse the more extensive the surgery.
ciao

[Deleted]

Thanks Heather! Now, if his prostate is enlarged, a vet could feel that right? Last night she did not think it was enlarged. (I asked twice, ha)

I'm going to print your above message and take that when I take him for the lupron.

His bum looked good last night and this morning (no prolaspe at all) so I did not use any vaseline. Prep H- he is wiggly sometimes unless I got him while he's sleeping-just worried he could lick it? The sugar- just plain white sugar?

[Heather]

My vet could feel Mad Max's prostate upon palpation but used an xray to confirm. Just plain white sugar will be fine. I used to use a baby wipe to remove it after the 10 minute snuggle and yes, I really know what it is to hold onto wiggles. The last time I had to do this was for a 3/4 month old kit who honestly thought I was murdering him while doing the treatment.
ciao

[Deleted]

My Coco gets a prolapse after he poops too. But it never stays poking out for long.. I think I got advice that it was okay if it happens once in a while just as long as it doesn't stick out for a long time.

[Deleted]

Well, so far so good! Zekrom continues to urinate on his own and is pooping WITHOUT the prolapse reoccuring! Poor little guy has no privacy-I'm all up in his business :/ I really hope the lupron comes in today......not that it would be an instant fix, but might help me to relax a little...
A couple questions if someone can help...

Does anyone know how long it would take the lupron to have an effect on his prostate?

I spoke with the lady who runs a shelter in my area and she was suprised the vet didn't prescribe antibiotics-should I ask for that??

This vet is the one who primarily sees/treats cats and dogs (she does SEE ferrets and has done some research here and there for me-just not a ferret specialist) and she (the other vet at this office who expressed Zekrom's bladder) offered doing x-rays, ultrasound, bloodwork......should I have any of these done? I declinded because I did not think they would *know* what to look for if there could really even be something those tests could show.

[Heather]

I'm sure that the lady at the shelter's concern was that if you don't know if you're actually dealing with a prostate issue or an infection. If xrays, ultra-sound or bloodwork isn't done to try and determine a true cause then throwing an antibiotic at it might help (note "might"). I don't like to give antibiotics just to cover but in cases like this where there are so many possibilities (and the testing can add huge costs) a 10 day run of antibiotics might just be the cure if it's a UTI and it might save you the bigger expense of further testing. I've done it myself. It's frequently done for an enlarged spleen, and even prostates as you can get prostate infections (though these are usually accompanied by an elevated temp).
You should see an improvement with the lupron (if it's going to work) within a few weeks, definitely by the second month.
ciao

[Deleted]

Thanks Heather! The more I read and think.....I almost wonder if he just has IBD??? He, along with my other 4 ferrets, have been kibble free since October 24th. (YAY!) Here and there, Zekrom has had diarrhea but no one else did. I thought maybe he needed more bone (eggshell powder since we're still mainly on soup)- sometimes he would have a formed poop and sometimes he would still have diarrhea. Since I have been able to see him urinate (thank god!), I wonder if his bouts of diarrhea could have caused the prolapse? And maybe his prostate is fine? When the vet expressed his bladder, it wasn't a whole lot. I had to wake him from the cage and put him in the carrier, so he did not have a chance to go on his own. He, again thank god, has been acting fine. He *usually* has 'brown' poop, but a few times they have been light, almost off white, cream colored. (they actually looked exactly like egg poops, just not sticky). I want the lupron reguardless, but I wonder if this is more diet related?

Or am I thinking about this too much?

I understand about the possible antibiotic run, but I would prefer him not to have medicine if he doesn't truly need it. (And that's just me not liking to take anything myself)

Hmm, so many things to think about.......?

[Heather]

Welcome to the world of ferrets. Everytime you think you've found an answer a dozen questions pop up. I used to think I was knowledgeable about them. I realize that I was just a beginner and really hadn't a clue. I still don't have a clue but at least I know that now lol.
ciao

[Deleted]

Gosh really! I was just starting to feel confident and now I feel like a mess and helpless

Could IBD cause a prolapse??

I made another post about this question, but incase someone reading this knows the answer.....Can 2 different proteins be mixed together?? I blended pork and chicken together yesterday, but I'm wondering if that's considered cross contamination and could hurt the babies??

[Heather]

Yes, IBD can cause a prolapse.... too loose stools are often the cause of a prolapses. A prolapse is often the result of another problem...a symptom.
You can mix any number of proteins together. It's often thought not to be a good idea in the beginning when you're first switching because if your little one's sensitive to a protein, you won't know which. The other night my guys had chicken bones, with beef meats, rabbit livers and fetuses and turkey hearts.....hence the term frankenprey (giggle)
ciao

[Deleted]

The vet called this morning-the lupron is in!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! We're going at 5:30 and I'm praying it's not hundreds of dollars! But if it is, it is

Is there anything I should address/ask while I'm there? This is still the cat/dog vet that SEES ferrets. She knows some things about ferrets, but isn't a specialist (I know I sound like I'm on repeat)

I guess asking for:
Xray?
Ultrasound?
Antibiotics? If so, what kind?
The meds Heather mentioned? (I took a screenshot so I'll have the correct names/dosages)

Or, if you were in my position, just schedule an appointment with my regular vet who is a ferret specialist? Zekrom has been able to urinate on his own and is having good poops WITHOUT a prolapse; but I know ferrets are also good at hiding illness-And I've been a ferrent for only 3 years-so this 'medical stuff' is new to me.

[Blue]

Blood glucose test? Although there's a debate about fasting before hand.

[Deleted]

Well, I didn't ask for any further testing since the vet wasn't even there

Zekrom was a perfect boy though-he was laying in his carrier and snuggled the vet tech before they gave him his shot. I tried looking as close as I could-looked like the injection was below his shoulder blades. He did not flinch one bit and there was no evidence of discomfort

The vet just called me this morning; I wondered how long the lupron *should* take effect and she said immediately. She also told me that she would check the virbac website in 2 weeks so see if the update changes about the implant. Her goal is to get the implant or, if the date of availablity gets pushed back again, do 2 more months of lupron and see how that goes.

I would prefer to go to the other vet (the specialist) to see what's going on with Zek. Obviously *something* is happening. A 3 year old ferret does not have a prolapse for no reason. Perhaps nothing is wrong with his prostate OR I caught it in time before we have a big issue. Maybe he has IBD OR I gave too much eggshell. I can, and have, drive myself nuts worrying and thinking what if.......

What is important is; Zekrom is okay. Everyone had a big breakfast this morning and I got kisses from him, and Zoey, before I left for work. I'll just keep watching him, and the others, to make sure everyone's happy and healthy! If something needs addressed, I'll follow my gut and take care of my babies.

[Deleted]

Hey ferretmomma. I thought same thing ---not enough bonemeal--that wasnt it for me. I have a little girl who is constantly having diarrhea---went to vet looked under microscpe and had overload of bacteria. Forum mentor think she has an allergy to chicken and it is real bad when feeding Cornish Game Hen. My girls are poultry eaters quail, pheasant, duck, turkey, CGH: They eat better than I do. They just started eating lamb soupies with bonemeal, that i got at Vitamin Shoppe ----no organs other than lamb heart and kidney. I do feed rabbit. I have been feeding lamb soupies, but today i gave her a gizzard for snack--they like want to eat three times a day-- i was not prepared for that--will need to thaw more food out ---sorry about going on soo.

Just letting pressure off. I cant advise you on anything other than an elimination diet.
Mine little girl just come off of a 10 day regime of antibiotics for bacteria -stool is loose not liquid as before. I hope this Friday i can get her stool rechecked for evaluation on bacteria.

Tell me how lupron affects stool.